Why is it that people think we just believe just what we are taught?

[BrotherTony]

1 hour ago, E Morales said:

The only problem I can see with the independent fundamental Baptist and all other denominations, is that we fall into a routine traditional ways of given a church service. Music to start, Announcements, more music, Love offering, preaching, more singing. Prayer or invitation . Many churches, not all, fall into a routine that never changes. How about singing, Preaching, more singing and prayer, then love offering or tithes, end the service. What is wrong with this, nothing at all. Try changing the service just a little bit, nobody’s gonna get hurt. Enjoy 

Please, don't be intentionally obtuse. There's NOTHING wrong with having an "order of service". It helps to keep things fluid, but organized. Can I ask in all sincerety, what is your problem with churches, pastors, other Christians? You seem to be totally negative about all of these. Many of us here have noticed it and made mention of it. Yet, you seem to continue with the acts of a critic instead of one who uplifts others.

[Napsterdad]

2 hours ago, E Morales said:

The only problem I can see with the independent fundamental Baptist and all other denominations, is that we fall into a routine traditional ways of given a church service. Music to start, Announcements, more music, Love offering, preaching, more singing. Prayer or invitation . Many churches, not all, fall into a routine that never changes. How about singing, Preaching, more singing and prayer, then love offering or tithes, end the service. What is wrong with this, nothing at all. Try changing the service just a little bit, nobody’s gonna get hurt. Enjoy 

1 Corinthians 14:26 + is a great reference for orderly worship with the capstone verse being:

Let all things be done decently and in order. - 1Cor. 14:40

The Strong’s definition for the word order in this verse (GR. “Taxis”) denotes: “regular arrangement, fixed succession, official dignity: ORDER”.

I don’t think this mandates every service should be without some amount of flexibility, but having a set standard of order ensures that all is done decently and hopefully without anything left wanting (praise, worship, edification, prayer, etc.).

Order was worthy of being put in scripture and good enough for the Apostle Paul; it should be good enough for us.

[rancher824]

I’ve not been here in several years, and won’t be around a lot because of a busy life. But I saw this thread and thought it interesting. Years ago I was in a several month long disagreement with my then fiancé, now wife’s pastor over something to do with our up coming marriage. It was a huge ordeal for both of us that ended in my pastor/father officiating over it instead of him. Anyway, as we drew near to the end of the debating, one day he said that to me. “You only believe that because your father does!”  The funny thing to me looking back, within 5 minutes he turns to another man, several years younger than me and asks him what true baptists believe. Now first off, though there are more independent Baptist that agree with him than I would like, the vast majority agree with me. Secondly, and most comical part, the man he called over was his son. He proved I only believed what my father told me to by using his son to prove me wrong. 

[HappyChristian]

Good to see you, rancher!

[rancher824]

8 hours ago, HappyChristian said:

Good to see you, rancher!

Good to see you as well. 

[Jim_Alaska]

There is nothing wrong with believing what you have been taught, as long as it conforms to Scripture and is faithful doctrine.

2 Timothy 2:2 (KJV) And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.

[Pastor Scott Markle]

9 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said:

There is nothing wrong with believing what you have been taught, as long as it conforms to Scripture and is faithful doctrine.

2 Timothy 2:2 (KJV) And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.

Also 2 Timothy 3:14-15 -- "But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; and that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus."

Edited April 7, 2022 by Pastor Scott Markle

[rancher824]

Very good points. In my case, the scriptures say to honor father and mother. Any of us that are blessed to have been born into a God fearing/loving family will have our roots in what our parents teach us. The same is true that those who find Christ later in their lives will most surely have someone they love and respect that will build that base. So long as we are trying the spirits on our own we can come to the same conclusion without just being a photo copy. And that is where we need to be. Ever listening to those who came before us. But, as those at Berea, we should be checking what they say against scripture to be sure it is truth. Always amazes me how that the things they were checking came from the apostle Paul. He being the instrument God used to give us so much of the New Testament. And they were greatly commended for questioning him. We should always push brethren to check what we are saying and rejoice when the come to correct us in love, even if we have to then guide them to the truth they are missing. Not get offended by them. And we should always have an open mind that even though the Bible is never wrong, I can be wrong in my understanding. 

[Jim_Alaska]

3 hours ago, Pastor Scott Markle said:

Also 2 Timothy 3:14-15 -- "But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; and that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus."

Thank you for that addition Bro. Scott, it is an excellent addition.

[Chad_McV]

I honestly believe that alot of Christians raised in solid homes do, because that is what they know, Sunday you go to church and sing the songs, listen and knod and go grab a bite to eat. Why? Because of habit. That is what our whole lives have been That is how my wife and myself were until our early 20s, and That is when we received our wake up call. 

Now with that being said we did not go the same route as our families, my parents our very modern and charismatic, we our more traditional and landed at a ifb church, and have moved 6 hrs away since then and the first thing we did was look for a ifb church (we found a good one, and we are becoming members Sunday, Amen!).

[Pastor Scott Markle]

On 4/7/2022 at 7:48 AM, Pastor Scott Markle said:

Also 2 Timothy 3:14-15 -- "But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; and that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus."

Yesterday I posted this verse without any further comment.  Now I wish to provide some further commentary.  

The idea that we should "disregard," "disrespect," or "depart from" the teaching of our youth simply because such a practice is a necessary part of "growing up" unto "real maturity" is NOT a Biblical idea.  In fact, under inspiration of God the Holy Spirit the apostle Paul honored the instruction of Timothy's youth and directly instructed Timothy, not to "cast it away," but to CONTINUE in it.  However, that instruction from the Holy Spirit through the apostle Paul to Timothy WAS founded upon some qualifications.  Those qualifications were as follows:

1.  The teaching of Timothy's youth was by the right teachers - "knowing of whom thou hast learned them."  (By godly teachers who possessed unfeigned faith in and love for the Lord God and His Holy Word (see 2 Timothy 1:5 & Deuteronomy 6:4-6).)

2.  The teaching of Timothy's youth was from the right source - "and that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures."  (From the truth and wisdom of God's Holy Scriptures themselves, not man's doctrine, but God's Word.)

3.  The teaching of Timothy's youth was of the right quality - "and hast been assured of . . . which are able to make thee wise."  (Diligently grounded in the holy scriptures so as to develop Biblical conviction and godly wisdom in the heart (see Deuteronomy 6:7-9).)

4.  The teaching of Timothy's youth was for the right purpose - "which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus."  (For the purpose of developing a faith-filled relationship in and with the Lord Jesus Christ, not just as an eternal escape from hell, but as a daily walk of fellowship.)

In truth, this is just the type of teaching that the Lord our God has assigned for every parent to fulfill in the upbringing of their children. (See Deuteronomy 6:4-9; Proverbs 22:6; Ephesians 6:4; etc.)  Indeed, this will be the objective of every godly parent throughout the upbringing of their children.  Even so, to the extent that godly parents do fulfill this type of upbringing in the lives of their children, the Book of the Proverbs instructs young adults time and again NOT to forget or depart from that very teaching.

Now, am I ignoring the reality that many parents and/or past authorities (even so-called "good" Christian parents or authorities) are not fulfilling this God-given responsibility according to the Biblical definition and qualification thereof?  God forbid!  I am quite well aware of this failure on the part of many.  And it will be necessary at some point for adults to depart from the ungodly, unbiblical teaching of parents and past authorities (see Proverbs 19:27; 1 Timothy 6:3-5; etc.) and to develop convictions and behavior that conforms unto the actual truth and wisdom of God's Holy Word.  However, this is NOT a "departure" simply to establish one's own "adult-independence."  Rather, this is a departure specifically to move away from falsehood unto actual Biblical truth.  Indeed, casting aside the teachings of our youth simply to demonstrate some form of "adult-independence" is NOT a sign of spiritual maturity, but actually a sign of spiritual immaturity.  According to the Book of the Proverbs, it is NOT a sign of godly wisdom, but of ungodly foolishness.

Furthermore, I am not ignoring the necessity for adults to study the truth and wisdom of God's Holy Word with diligence for themselves, so as to develop personally rooted convictions in God's Word, rather than simply to possess "authorities" rooted convictions from what others have taught.  However, the Biblical teachings of parents and past authorities should not be "cast aside" in relation to this pursuit, but should serve as the foundation upon which to build this pursuit.  Indeed, this pursuit of diligent study in the truth and wisdom of God's Holy Word should be a characteristic of our daily lives as the children of God continually unto the end the of our lives. (See Joshua 1:8; Psalm 1:1-2; 2 Timothy 2:15; etc.)

[John Young]

We do need to conform and challenge our ideas and teachings to that of the scriptures but too often the call for "challenge what you have been taught" comes from peddlers of long disproven, faulty, and bad teaching that tradition, scriptures, and plain family values has weeded out long ago, yet wishes to root itself back in again. When we take the lead of learning from such people without first being grounded in fundamental truth proven over lifetime of family learning, then the end result is one of shifting sands and unsure foundations.

[JenM]

On 3/18/2022 at 6:21 AM, BrotherTony said:

Who is we...and what is it you're supposed to believe? Just for reference....Thanks.

In context, I'm referring to Bible-believing Christians. 

[1Timothy115]

On 3/18/2022 at 8:06 AM, BrotherTony said:

Please, don't be intentionally obtuse. There's NOTHING wrong with having an "order of service". It helps to keep things fluid, but organized. Can I ask in all sincerety, what is your problem with churches, pastors, other Christians? You seem to be totally negative about all of these. Many of us here have noticed it and made mention of it. Yet, you seem to continue with the acts of a critic instead of one who uplifts others.

 

On 3/18/2022 at 7:03 AM, E Morales said:

The only problem I can see with the independent fundamental Baptist and all other denominations, is that we fall into a routine traditional ways of given a church service. Music to start, Announcements, more music, Love offering, preaching, more singing. Prayer or invitation . Many churches, not all, fall into a routine that never changes. How about singing, Preaching, more singing and prayer, then love offering or tithes, end the service. What is wrong with this, nothing at all. Try changing the service just a little bit, nobody’s gonna get hurt. Enjoy 

1 Corinthians 14 speaks of conduct in the service and the last verse, verse 40 states... "Let all things be done decently and in order."

So, I'm with Bro. Tony, we also have an 'order of service' it helps me know what page to turn to in the hymnal.

[TheGloryLand]

On 4/12/2022 at 10:01 AM, 1Timothy115 said:

 

1 Corinthians 14 speaks of conduct in the service and the last verse, verse 40 states... "Let all things be done decently and in order."

So, I'm with Bro. Tony, we also have an 'order of service' it helps me know what page to turn to in the hymnal.

Weekly services that never change?

I understand there must be order, but what I don’t understand is that some are just to boring.

1. 11:00 Praise to open the service

2. 11:15 welcome and announcements that are already on the bulletin they give out

3. 11:20 more praise music

4. 11:30 tithes and offerings

5. 11:40 Pastor comes to preach

6. 12:30 service is over

is this written in stone, in the early days, were the services so organized that it would not go over a certain time or order.