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  1. Today
  2. I don't think calling people degenerates is very Christian of you. I won't say my opinion on the discussion at hand here because it's irrelevant to my point. What I will say is that even if you perceive someone's beliefs to be wrong, misguided, or unchristian, it is still you're responsibility to act in a kind and constructive manner, as Jesus would. Realise your shortcomings as a Christian, even if they may not be in this discussion (again, not saying you're right or wrong), and work on them before trying, and might I add failing, to fix others. Also, when someone said you were being confrontational, it was a bit strange of you to respond with such a confrontaional/aggressive form of denial which just proved his point. I really do hope that you, I, and everyone else here can work towards improving our relationship with God in every aspect, and I especially hope that you don't accidentally stray further from Christ in you're unforgiving criticisms which you may put forth to defend His name.
  3. Sounds a bit like the bahai faith
  4. Yesterday
  5. It would offend God too. Paul was Torah observant. He never ate anything that was unclean.
  6. Mid-trib rapture to Heaven : Revelation 11:11-12 Post-trib rapture to Israel : Matthew 24:29-31
  7. Text : 2 Timothy 3:16-17 Title : Abounding in Good Works Date : February 25, 2018 1. Furnished Unto all good works perfectly and Throughly - 2 Timothy 3:16-17 16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works. Scripture perfects a man and equips him for every good work. By "perfect" is meant complete, matured, and filled. No person is complete or mature apart from Scripture. Man was made for God and he is to live by the Word of God. If he tries to live without God and His Word, man fails in life. He lives an incomplete, immature, and mis-fitted life. Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 2 Timothy 2:15 9Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word. 98Thou through thy commandments hast made me wiser than mine enemies: for they are ever with me. 99I have more understanding than all my teachers: for thy testimonies are my meditation. 100I understand more than the ancients, because I keep thy precepts. Psalms 119:9, 98-100 11Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflame them! Isaiah 5:11 2. Filled with all the Fullness of God - Ephesians 3:19 And tknow the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God. Ephesians 3:19 The believer possesses the indwelling presence of the Spirit, Christ, and of God. When Jesus Christ was promising to send the Holy Spirit to believers, He promised that the trinity—the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit—would all three come and indwell believers. The point is this: each Person of the Godhead has a different function within the believer. Therefore, the believer is to ask specific things concerning each. He has already prayed to be strengthened by the Spirit and to have Christ dwell within and control his heart. Now the believer is to pray for "all the fullness of God Himself"—for God and His presence in all its fullness to fill and flood him, ruling and reigning and having His perfect way in the life of the believer. Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Romans 8:39 Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the Lord unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the Lord of hosts. Zechariah 4:6 3. Forwardness and sincerity in the grace of giving - 2 Corinthians 8:7 Paul does not command the Corinthians to give. If giving is forced or coerced, it benefits nothing; it does not please God. God is pleased only with gifts that are willingly and cheerfully given. He blesses only those who willingly help others. Therefore, giving must be based upon three things. a) Giving must be based upon love for those who are lost and needy. b) Giving must be based upon love for the Lord Jesus who has commanded us to go into all the world to reach and help the people of the world. c) Giving must be based upon the example of those who give sacrificially. In the case of the Corinthians, they had the dynamic example of the Macedonians. The Corinthians should have been stirred to follow the example of such sacrificial giving. In our case, we should be stirred to follow the dynamic example of all those who give willingly and sacrificially. 2 Corinthians 8:1-5 1Moreover, brethren, we do you to wit of the grace of God bestowed on the churches of Macedonia; 2How that in a great trial of affliction the abundance of their joy and their deep poverty abounded unto the riches of their liberality. 3For to their power, I bear record, yea, and beyond their power they were willing of themselves; 4Praying us with much intreaty that we would receive the gift and take upon us the fellowship of the ministering to the saints. 5And this they did, not as we hoped, but first gave their own selves to the Lord, and unto us by the will of God. 6Insomuch that we desired Titus, that as he had begun, so he would also finish in you the same grace also. 7Therefore, as ye abound in everything, in faith, and utterance, and knowledge, and in all diligence, and in your love to us, see that ye abound in this grace also. 8I speak not by commandment, but by occasion of the forwardness of others, and to prove the sincerity of your love. 9For ye know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that, though he was rich, yet for your sakes he became poor, that ye through his poverty might be rich. 10And herein I give my advice: for this is expedient for you, who have begun before, not only to do, but also to be forward a year ago. 11Now therefore perform the doing of it; that as there was a readiness to will, so there may be a performance also out of that which ye have. 12For if there be first a willing mind, it is accepted according to that a man hath, and not according to that he hath not. 13For I mean not that other men be eased, and ye burdened: 14But by an equality, that now at this time your abundance may be a supply for their want, that their abundance also may be a supply for your want: that there may be equality: 15As it is written, He that had gathered much had nothing over; and he that had gathered little had no lack. And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things, may abound to every good work: 2 Corinthians 9:8 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 2 Corinthians 12:9 17Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not high-minded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy; 18That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate; 1 Timothy 6:17-18 Abounding in good works.docx Edited by Mod: Added content of PDF to post
  8. Last week
  9. Thanks, LuAnne! I forwarded the suggestion to my mom. She appreciated the lead!
  10. Indeed, Brother Wretched, I also am not concerned about winning debates, but am much concerned about exalting Biblical truth. Even so, I must contend that my primary point from my posting above still stands - (Even if we remove any reference unto 1 Peter 1:23) There are NO tares in the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15. You implied that there were, but our Lord Jesus Christ Himself NEVER mentioned them therein. Indeed, in relation to this my primary evidences also still stand: 1. In the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15, there is ONLY ONE seed that is sown. Our Lord Jesus Christ Himself defined that ONE seed as the Word of God. (Luke 8:11 -- "Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God." Mark 4:14 - "The sower soweth the word.") However, in the parable of the tares as recorded in Matthew 13:24-30, 37-43, there are TWO DIFFERENT seeds sown: (1) The good/wheat seed and (2) the tares seed. Our Lord Jesus Christ Himself defined the good/wheat seed as "the children of the kingdom" and defined the tares seed as "the children of the wicked one." (Matthew 13:38 - "The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one.") It is worthy of notice that our Lord Jesus Christ did NOT even define the "good" seed from each of these two parable in the same way. In the parable of the sower, the "good" seed is the WORD of God; whereas in the parable of the tares, the "good" seed are the CHILDREN of the kingdom. (For your consideration, our Lord Jesus Christ did NOT define the two different seed in the parable of the tares as: (1) the Word of God rightly divided and (2) the Word of God corrupted by misuse. Indeed, I would plead with you to consider your own warning above about seeing and using God's Word as a reference for already settled "theological ideas.") 2. In the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15, there is ONLY ONE sower of the seed. Our Lord Jesus Christ Himself did not directly define this one sower, but He did only reference ONE sower. However, in the parable of the tares as recorded in Matthew 13:24-30, 37-43, there are TWO DIFFERENT sowers of seed: (1) the sower of the good seed in his own field and (2) the enemy who sowed tares among the wheat. Our Lord Jesus Christ Himself defined the sower of the good seed as "the Son of man" and defined the enemy as "the devil." (Matthew 13:37 - He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man." Matthew 13:39a - "The enemy that sowed them is the devil.") Now, in the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15, there is NO enemy sowing a different seed than that of the "good" sower of God's Word. Indeed, the wicked one, Satan, the devil IS present in the parable of the sower; however, he is NOT sowing any seed in that parable. Rather, he is taking AWAY the seed of God's Word out of individual's hearts. (Matthew 13:19 - When anyone heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side." Mark 4:15 - And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts." Luke 8:12 - Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.") So then, since there is ONLY ONE seed sown in the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15, the seed of GOD'S HOLY WORD - IF there are tares in the parable of the sower, then the seed of God's WORD had to produce (germinate into) those tares. Furthermore, since there is ONLY ONE sower in the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15, the "good" sower of God's Word - IF there are tares in the parable of the sower, then the "good" sower had to be responsible for sowing them. Yet since in the parable of the tares as recorded in Matthew 13:24-30, 37-48, the ENEMY who sowed the tares is the devil, and since in the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15, the devil is NOT SOWING ANY SEED, but is actually STEALING AWAY the good seed of God's Word, then we have NO grounds for inserting the idea of tares into the parable of the sower. The correct context for tares is the parable of the tares as recorded in Matthew 13:24-30, 37-48, NOT the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15. Thus I repeat again - There are NO tares in the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15. __________________________________________________________________ Concerning any correlation between the seed in the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15, the seed in the parable of the tares as recorded in Matthew 13:24-30, 37-48, and the seed in 1 Peter 1:23, consider the Biblical definition for the "good" seed in each case - 1. The case of the parable of the sower: Luke 8:11 -- "Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God." Mark 4:14 - "The sower soweth the word." 2. The case of the parable of the tares: Matthew 13:38 - "The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one." 3. The case of 1 Peter 1:23: "Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." It appears to me that in BOTH the case of the parable of the sower and the case of 1 Peter 1:23, the "good" seed is Biblically defined as the same thing, as "THE WORD OF GOD." However, it appears to me that in the case of the parable of the tares, the "good" seed is Biblically defined as something completely different, as "the children of kingdom." So then, I would ask -- Of the three cases, IF there is any correlation, which cases correlate between better with each other?
  11. Dave Olson writes good stuff. Check out help4uminstries.com. Jim Berg's Changed Into His Image us really good - not a typical devotional, but there is a workbook.
  12. I had the same problem with both the Spurgeon and Pink CD's. What you can do is go to the 'explore cd' option of the drive and copy the 'LIBRARY' folder and all its files to your hard drive. They are .pdf files and you can access them individually with acrobat reader. It's inconvenient, but you will have all the files.
  13. I gotta say..... Of all the things mentioned in my critique of the original post, there is not one answer, not one objection, not one disputed point - except that the person has taken offense at my use of the word stupid - which as I said was not directed at the person but at the proposition. Seems to me that the person was seeking for something to be offended at.... I did after all clearly display how the proposition was indeed a stupid one. Oh well...…...
  14. Brother Scott, this is what I mean here when I warn men not to see and use God's Word as a reference for their already settled, "theological ideas" but to treat it as God intended as the Bread of Life; The Living Water. Please believe me my dear friend when I tell you that I do not want to win temporary debates on forums, I want all of us who have received seed to win the war satan has waged on our souls through the traditions (theology) of men.
  15. Apparently my brother wants a men's devotional book for Christmas, and my mom is trying to find him a good one! Does anyone have any suggestions?
  16. Glad to hear about your first sunday. I'm looking forward to hearing more future updates about the church and your ministry there.
  17. We have arrived in Washington and have begun service in the church here. This last Sunday was our first Sunday, and the Lord blessed. The church has been running a steady attendance of 6 regular people for months. We had 14 here Sunday, including my son and I and 6 visitors. and there was an easy liberty to preach. I preached a short, simple message from Luke 8 on the woman who touched the hem of Christ's garment, contrasting her with all of the throng who was jostling Jesus, but never did "touch" Him. I just wanted to update everyone, and ask for continued prayes
  18. Brother Wretched, I certainly appreciate your respect toward me (now and in the past). Although we have not always agreed, I have definitely come to respect you a great deal through our various interactions. Even so, I desire that the following post not be taken as disrespectful; for I do NOT intend it as such. Nevertheless, I do intend it to be somewhat corrective (which some take as disrespectful). (Note: I have pondered much on how to present the following. I pray that it will truly be "good to the use of edifying.") With your linked phrase (tells us "believe"), you make reference unto the parable of the sower as recorded in Matthew 13:3-8, 18-23, in Mark 4:3-9, 14-20, and in Luke 8:5-8, 11-15. In relation to the parable of the sower, you speak about "tares" and seem to indicate that "they on the rock" should be viewed as such "tares." However, I am compelled to contend that there are NO "tares" whatsoever at all in the parable of the sower. The ONLY seed sown in the parable of the sower is the "good" (incorruptible - see for reference 1 Peter 1:23) seed of God's Word; and the ONLY sower in the parable of the sower is a "good" sower of the incorruptible Word (as implied by the fact that he is sowing the "good" seed of God's Word). From my perspective, to indicate or imply that the incorruptible seed of God's Word can produce (germinate into) "tares" is somewhat offensive against the incorruptible character of God's Holy Word. On the other hand, the only place wherein "tares" are directly referenced in the New Testament is in the parable of the tares as recorded in Matthew 13:24-30, 37-43. In the parable of the tares, there are TWO DIFFERENT kinds of seed that are sown: (1) "the good seed" and (2) the "tares" seed. Furthermore, in that parable there are TWO DIFFERENT sowers of seed: (1) the good sower of the good seed, "the Son of man," and (2) the "enemy" sower of the "tares" seed, "the devil." If we seek to correlate the two parables, it would seem to me that the correlation between them is at the point of "the good seed," the incorruptible seed of God's Holy Word. This good, incorruptible seed of God's Word produces (germinates into) wheat, NOT tares. Thus I would further contend that the "belief" presented in Luke 8:13 is genuine faith in the gospel of Christ, through which the Word of God germinates in their hearts and through which they pass from death unto life (as indicated by the very fact that there IS plant growth). The germination and LIFE of God's Word in an individual's heart is itself an evidence that an individual is "born again." (See for reference 1 Peter 1:23)
  19. I didn't call you stupid, I said your proposition was stupid.
  20. hey calling me stupid is a bit much. But I can see I am too dumb for this group. Sorry to have bothered y'all.
  21. I didn't post in this thread until now because I was not interested in the straw man proposition at the very start. I finally stuck my nose in when the OP proposed a clearly unbiblical form of baptism, but now that my nose is "in here" I am going to waggle it around a little. The original post is so full of false premise that it simply isn't funny. Who cares what the Gospel Coalition says (whoever they are...)? I know from my own experience that when I was saved 30+ years ago, and then a few month later baptised, people were already having the discussions about children with false professions "getting saved" again as an adult. I will note to you that the discussion was NEVER about those people getting baptised at a young age, but about whether or not they got saved at that age. I have spoken to many people older than I who made a profession of faith for salvation at ages as young as three, but mostly around the ages of 6-10, who then doubted their salvation and later "tried again". That means that this "trend" you propose has been stable for at least the last 50 or more years. I gotta say that I have never heard this in an IFB church - about salvation yes, but not about baptisms, and the way you word this appears to be suggesting that baptism is a part of salvation...…. Maybe that is simply sloppy wording on your part, but that is the way it looks...... So what? What has this to do with "emotional maturity"? It is about understanding your position as a sinner, and understanding the offer of salvation through Christ. It is not about emotional anything...... This is utter stupidity. The difference between baptism in a catholic church and baptism in an Independent Baptist Church is nothing to do with age, and everything to do with doctrine. Catholics baptise as a part of their salvation ritual process, IFB baptise as a testimony of what the Lord HAS ALREADY done in a saved person's life. You either have ZERO understanding of what baptism means or...…. no that's it...…. And your proposal means that the position of an IFB church would have to change with every baptism. A couple of baptisms ago, our church baptised two 13 year old, a 14 year old, and a 73 year old. Do we average them to find out how close to a Catholic church we are? So we were 28.25 years away from being a Catholic church. But the last baptism was a mother of about 38. So now we are 38 years away from being Catholic? See, it is a stupid proposition..... Who cares what Presbyterians do? But here again you display a lack of understanding about baptism. It takes very little Bible research to see that the order is set out in a plain way - salvation then baptism. Find one instance of a man in the Bible being baptised before being saved..... (I assume Judas was baptised but he never was saved......so he doesn't count.) And yes it is worse than baptising a ten year old, because in every IFB church that I have ever been associated with, the ten year old would only be baptised AFTER he has professed Christ as his Saviour. No baby who cannot even speak the words, is of sufficient understanding to be able to be saved. So in short, your proposition of a trend towards baptising younger is not true over the last 50+ years anyway, so your beginning premise is wrong. Your attempt to associate baptism with "emotional maturity" is simply unbiblical. You appear to be associating baptism to salvation in an essential way, which is unbiblical. Your attempt to make the difference between Catholicism and Baptist churches into one of "age of baptism" is ridiculous, unbiblical, and quite frankly, stupid. And your attempt to minimise the "process" difference between the Presbyterians and the IFB indicates that your purpose here is not just for a good discussion, but to gently spread dissent and false teaching.
  22. Romans 6 4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. 5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: Likeness of his death....... Don't ya hate it when the Bible disagrees with you?
  23. Just to be clear, my 'full immersion requirement' is not based on consensus. It's based on Scriptural example and the Biblical explanation for the picture that baptism is to provide. Are you able to provide a Scriptural reason to back up your idea of not-fully-dunking? I don't see why they would have needed tanks in their houses... considering the early examples for baptism (John the Baptist, Philip) utilized external bodies of water, I would have expected the early churches to continue with the same example. Hey, i know a church that still uses a lake for baptism, since they haven't got a tank in their rented building. They're located in the Canadian mountains, so it's a tad cold (even in July), but it's very Biblical! That being said, it was not uncommon in the era for villas to have their own private baths (which included several large water basins), so it wouldn't have been out of the question for a wealthy Roman (like Cornelius) to actually have his own thermae. This isn't directly related, but it's a picture I love. This shows the baptismal font in a Catholic building in Rome, San Giovanni in Laterno, commissioned by Constantine. The current font is on a platform in what was original the baptismal pool... back when the building was originally built and they still practiced baptism by immersion! (Not intending to open a debate on catholic doctrine and what's wrong with it/how it's different/Constantine. I just love how this picture shows so clearly that they used to immerse - their little bitty font (okay, it's kind of a big font) is literally located in a swimming pool!)
  24. Salyan, i understand. The consensus is clear and the reasons for it. But somehow I doubt Cornelius and the folks in other house churches had big water tanks or even a bathtub big enough to lie down in. Something is going to stick up out of the water, which violates your full-immersion requirement.
  25. Forwards or backwards doesn't matter... it's the immersion that matters. And immersion by definition means full coverage. Fully buried, fully raised. Not just the head. I think that's what Dave's getting at. I know some a church that uses a stock tank too small for a full backwards layout... I'm sure they use some kind of crouching in the process, but they still get fully wet!
  26. DaveW, You wrote: There is ABSOLUTELY no biblical instruction nor example of this. How does this show the death of Christ? On the other hand, the procedure of laying people backwards one time into water is tradition. The NT does not specifically state how it should be done. I think it symbolizes the death of Christ if you have to hold your breath to avoid getting a lung-full. The NT says we should baptize/dip/immerse in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost (Acts 10:48 says "in the name of the Lord"). The specifics of the procedure are based on tradition and might be influenced by the situation. When you are baptizing 3000 people and a river is nearby, then go for it. Notice in Acts 10:47-48 Cornelius et al were baptized with water in his house. Full-body immersion backwards in a large container is not specified. 47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
  27. There is ABSOLUTELY no biblical instruction nor example of this. How does this show the death of Christ?
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