Hell's Compartments: Then, Now, and In the Future.

[John Young]

Hell is the place souls go that are without bodies.

There were two compartments in Hell. One for those who are tormented and destined to be judged and another for those who were comforted and waiting for their redemption. When Jesus descended at his death he went to the prison of Hell. Those in prison that he preached to were not in rebellion to God but only "sometime were disobedient". They were sinners that believed in God and were waiting for the redemption so that they could be saved by Christ. The faithful of old, from before the crucifixion, were led captive from the captivity of the grave.

Today there is now only one compartment for the rebellious because the debt has been paid and the faithful disobedient no longer go to Abraham's in prison but to be with the Lord in Heaven.

One day their will be no Hell all will be resurrected in body and those who are not already in Christ will stand before God to be judged. 

Luke 16:22-23 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; 23 and in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

Hebrews 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

Luke 23:39-43 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us. 40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation? 41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss. 42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. 43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

Matthew 27:50-53 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. 51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; 52 and the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, 53 and came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Psalm 68:18 Thou hast ascended on high, thou hast led captivity captive: thou hast received gifts for men; yea, for the rebellious also, that the Lord God might dwell among them.9 Blessed be the Lord, who daily loadeth us with benefits, even the God of our salvation. Selah.

Ephesians 4:7-10 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ. 8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. 9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth? 10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

1 Peter 3:18-22 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: 19 by which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; 20 which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. 21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ: 22 who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.

2 Corinthians 5:7-8 (for we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 we are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Romans 8:22-24 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now. 23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body. 24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?

Daniel 12:2-3 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

Revelation 20:11-15 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Edited September 17, 2016 by John Young

[Alan]

 

3 hours ago, John Young said:

Daniel 12:2-3 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

 

3 hours ago, John Young said:

Luke 16:22-23 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; 23 and in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

John Young,

Thanks. Your lesson is a good reminder for us to be more zealous in our soul winning efforts. 

Alan

[MJW]

On 9/17/2016 at 3:51 AM, John Young said:

There were two compartments in Hell.

I'm not entirely convinced of this. The phrase 'afar off' could mean as far as Heaven is from Hell.

I believe this type of 'separation' is alluded to here...

Luke 16:26
"And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence."

[MJW]

On 9/17/2016 at 3:51 AM, John Young said:

Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

Why can't this simply refer to Mary's Womb?

I offer this as reference...

Psalms 139:15
"My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth"

The phrase 'Lowest parts of the Earth' is clearly referring to a Mother's belly during pregnancy.

Even the word 'Pit' refers to the Womb...

Isaiah 51:1
"Hearken to me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, and to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged"

Look at the word 'first' in the verse. What was the first thing Jesus did when he came to Earth?

He descended into Mary's Womb to become born.

Simple and beautiful.

[Salyan]

6 hours ago, MJW said:

I'm not entirely convinced of this. The phrase 'afar off' could mean as far as Heaven is from Hell.

I believe this type of 'separation' is alluded to here...

Luke 16:26
"And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence."

Heaven and hell are indeed far off from each other, but I don’t believe you can see one from the other. 

The old testament saints could not to heaven until the sacrifice for their sins – Christ – had been completed.  Their souls had to go somewhere. If not Hades, then where?

[Jerry]

They obviously saw each other in OT times, and even were able to communicate on at least one occasion - according to Jesus in Luke 16 - though there was a great uncrossable gulf between the two places.

[MJW]

Hi Jerry and Salyan.

Have either of you ever had a dream that was so real, it was as if you were in a different place altogether?

How about a nightmare?

When having a dream or nightmare, we often have 'visions' of places and events. They seem physical, yet... it's a bit of a mystery how it all works.

You folks obviously know there are many verses referring to the dead as 'sleeping'...

Ephesians 5:14
"Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light"

The point I'm making is that I believe when the dead are sleeping, they are dreaming. The main difference between them and us is they no longer have a body to wake up into... at least not until Resurrection Day.

The Rich Man, being in Hell, was having a nightmare.

Lazarus, being in Abraham's Bosom, was having a pleasant dream.

Somehow, the two are able to interact. Again, this shouldn't be too hard to imagine since we've all had dreams where it was as if we interacted with other people and other worlds.

Yet, there is no way we can pass from our bed to these other places.

I hope that makes sense.

As a side note, we often hear that the 'dead know nothing'...

Ecclesiastes 9:5
"For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten"

People interpret that as if the dead have no consciousness outside of the body. What they do not understand is that the living know nothing either...

Job 8:9
(For we are but of yesterday, and know nothing, because our days upon earth are a shadow:)

That's another topic I suppose.

[Jerry]

Context, context, context. The Bible does not teach any kind of soul sleep or unconsciousness of the dead. They are conscious - just not aware of what is going on i the world after they have departed it. The context of Ecclesiastes 9:5 and Job 14:21 show that. Job 8:9 is not even referring to what believe think or are aware of after death.

Sad - you claim to believe the King James Bible, but post in various threads in such a manner as to explain it away.

[MJW]

50 minutes ago, Jerry said:

Context, context, context. The Bible does not teach any kind of soul sleep or unconsciousness of the dead. They are conscious - just not aware of what is going on i the world after they have departed it. The context of Ecclesiastes 9:5 and Job 14:21 show that. Job 8:9 is not even referring to what believe think or are aware of after death.

Sad - you claim to believe the King James Bible, but post in various threads in such a manner as to explain it away.

What is sad is that, not only did you not comprehend what I wrote, but you bore false witness against me.

Nowhere did I mention 'Soul Sleep' or say that the dead are not conscious... quite the opposite actually.

[MJW]

Fascinating verses about communication in a dream state...

Job 33:14-15
"For God speaketh once, yea twice, yet man perceiveth it not"
"In a dream, in a vision of the night, when deep sleep falleth upon men, in slumberings upon the bed"

and...

Genesis 31:11
"And the angel of God spake unto me in a dream, saying, Jacob: And I said, Here am I"

or...

Genesis 20:3
"But God came to Abimelech in a dream by night, and said to him, Behold, thou art but a dead man, for the woman which thou hast taken; for she is a man’s wife"

Edited May 19, 2019 by MJW

[HappyChristian]

Sorry, but Jesus didn't say, "And, as he slept, he dreamed that he was in Hell and this is what he went through..."  Nope. He said, "And in Hell, he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence."

Nowhere in that passage, neither before, during, nor after, does Christ mention anything about a dream. As you've quoted from several scriptures, when someone is dreaming, God makes it clear. What is clear in Luke is that the conscious rich man awoke in Hell. In torment. Not in a nightmare. In eternity.

[DaveW]

The KJV has absolutely no indication that the account of the rich man and Lazarus was a dream in any way. It is stated as a factual, real event experienced personally by these two men.

[John Young]

16 hours ago, MJW said:

Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

Why can't this simply refer to Mary's Womb?

I offer this as reference...

Psalms 139:15 "My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth"

The phrase 'Lowest parts of the Earth' is clearly referring to a Mother's belly during pregnancy.

Even the word 'Pit' refers to the Womb...

Isaiah 51:1 "Hearken to me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, and to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged"

Look at the word 'first' in the verse. What was the first thing Jesus did when he came to Earth?

He descended into Mary's Womb to become born.

Simple and beautiful.

Because nowhere in the text does it say its referring figuratively to the womb and neither do your referenced verses. It simply is not a metaphorical passage but a describing actual literal actions taken by Christ. Apostle Paul is not making poetry about Christ physical birth but rather contrasting literal actions that Christ took as his Death Burial and Resurrection.

As to Psalms 139:15 David is not referring to his formation in the womb but rather to his "substance". His elements in the earth formed by God long before he was conceived that would one day make up his body. Psalm 139:16 Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them. As to Isaiah 51:1 that is a figurative allusion, but not of a womb, but of a rock quarry.

[No Nicolaitans]

17 hours ago, MJW said:

Why can't this simply refer to Mary's Womb?

 

That was your reply/response/question to John's following quotation...

 

On 9/17/2016 at 6:51 AM, John Young said:

9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

 

Why can't it simply refer to Mary's womb? It can't, because it's referring to the fact that BEFORE Christ ascended to heaven, he first descended into the lower parts of the earth to set free those who were kept in Abraham's bosom.

17 hours ago, MJW said:

I offer this as reference...

Psalms 139:15
"My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth"

The phrase 'Lowest parts of the Earth' is clearly referring to a Mother's belly during pregnancy.

 

No it isn't. You may want to do a word study on what all "the lowest parts of the earth" can (and does) refer to. However, I will tell you this...not once does "womb" get mentioned.

 

17 hours ago, MJW said:

Even the word 'Pit' refers to the Womb...

Isaiah 51:1
"Hearken to me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, and to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged"

 

No it doesn't. The word "pit" refers to the current situation that they had "dug themselves into". They were in a bad situation due to their rebelliousness. They had dug themselves into a pit. Read the previous chapter, and you'll clearly see why it refers to their situation and NOT to a mother's womb.

 

8 hours ago, MJW said:

You folks obviously know there are many verses referring to the dead as 'sleeping'...

Ephesians 5:14
"Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light"

 

That has nothing to do with physical sleep, nor does it have anything to do with physical death...both are referring to spiritual truths. The lost are "asleep" in their lack of concern for salvation...they are dead in their trespasses and sins. However, Christ will give them light if they will see their situation and turn to the truth of the gospel.

Let me ask you a question. When the Bible says that Christ is the cornerstone of the church, does that mean that he's literally a large stone that was set as the corner of a building?

 

9 hours ago, MJW said:

As a side note, we often hear that the 'dead know nothing'...

Ecclesiastes 9:5
"For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten"

People interpret that as if the dead have no consciousness outside of the body. What they do not understand is that the living know nothing either...

 

Jerry has already answered you on this, but I would like to ask you to read the next two verses. They explain what is meant by "the dead knowing nothing"...which Jerry explained.

 

9 hours ago, MJW said:

Job 8:9
(For we are but of yesterday, and know nothing, because our days upon earth are a shadow:)

 

The clue to what this verse means is...in the verse itself. You should have underlined and emboldened the word "because"...because there's the meaning. Due to the fact that our life span on earth is like a shadow, we know "nothing". Read the previous verses and following verses. Job is imploring to seek wisdom from the fathers. 

 

6 hours ago, MJW said:

Fascinating verses about communication in a dream state...

Job 33:14-15
"For God speaketh once, yea twice, yet man perceiveth it not"
"In a dream, in a vision of the night, when deep sleep falleth upon men, in slumberings upon the bed"

and...

Genesis 31:11
"And the angel of God spake unto me in a dream, saying, Jacob: And I said, Here am I"

or...

Genesis 20:3
"But God came to Abimelech in a dream by night, and said to him, Behold, thou art but a dead man, for the woman which thou hast taken; for she is a man’s wife"

 

It is fascinating; on that, I can agree. However, those are all Old Testament passages which show how God spoke to men at times back then. 

[MJW]

3 hours ago, No Nicolaitans said:

It can't, because it's referring to the fact that BEFORE Christ ascended to heaven, he first descended into the lower parts of the earth to set free those who were kept in Abraham's bosom.

Right...

In other words, Abraham was this evil tyrant who kept prisoners in his bosom. Jesus had to rescue them.

Lol... this is another interpretation I completely disagree with.

I see many of you don't even bother to see how much twisting of Scripture had to be done to come up with that one.

Seriously... meditate on what you are saying.

BTW...

Everything that is being posted here are merely opinions. We are all entitled to them.

Romans 3:4
"God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged"

If you folks think Sleep and Dreams have nothing to do with each other, hey that's your business.

I think they do. When the Word of God says the dead sleep, I believe it.