Rapture Thought is Nuts

[Kubel]

I saw that the Bible clearly teaches this waaaayy before ever getting involved with anything having to do with the Doc. Don't even go there; you're just afraid of things you don't understand and can't disprove.

If you say so. But I was just pointing out that multiple ways to salvation is a teaching of Ruckman.

Oh, and maybe you should have included the little thingie at the TOP OF EVERY WAYOFLIFE PAGE:

Just like how you just quoted from that page, I was doing it within the allowance of the Copyright Act of 1976, 17 U.S.C. § 107. No need to get upset. It was done in good faith under fair use. :saint

The OP is about the Rapture but this thread has been degenerating into yet another Ruckman discussion. Anybody can do a search here and find out my personal feelings about Ruckman but as a moderator, I have to keep threads from turning into one of the many controversial topics we've had recently. Seems like every thread goes in certain directions these days...

My bad :oops:.

I think this theology is nuts and that we must say no to the 'Left Behind' fictional version.

I understand that not everything in the Left Behind series can be supported by scripture, but it is fiction after all. When I worked at a bookstore, I would stock those books under "Religious Fiction". It's not like they are saying "this is how it will happen". I just think this 'reverend' doesn't want to accept any Biblical account at all.

BTW: has anyone tried the game? I think it would be sort of interesting to play.

[Tim]

I am interested in the game as well just to see how it is put together.

[Psalms18_28]

Is DaVinci code a good religious fiction? People sure do take it seriously these days and made a religion out of it.

I don't mind a fiction story about a character's personal journey with the Lord. Like Jeanette Oke's books.

I do have to admit that I never read "Left Behind", but I have seen the movie. I have mixed feelings about it.

[ltl]

You need to understand why the "Reverend" says the Rapture is rubbish.

See, she's a Lutheran. Lutheranism, whether the liberal or old-line ones, believe in Amillennialism.

They do believe in a "Rapture", but it's different from what the Scriptures say so.

Their "Rapture" is this: at an unknown time, everyone, whether living or dead, saved or lost, will be raptured, and Judgment Day will begin straightaway. No millenial kingdom. No 7 year tribulation.

In addition Lutheranism also believes in these serious errors:
- Baptismal regeneration (see Luther's Large Catechism)
- Loss of salvation
- Plus a lot of RCC-related doctrine.

IMO, the Lutherans are the Protestant group closest to the RCC in doctrine. No surprise that they are the first group to sign a "Joint Agreement" with the RCC.

So I don't understand why so many Christians, even IFBs, laud Luther as an important man of God.

[pneu-engine]

You need to understand why the "Reverend" says the Rapture is rubbish.

See, she's a Lutheran. Lutheranism, whether the liberal or old-line ones, believe in Amillennialism.

They do believe in a "Rapture", but it's different from what the Scriptures say so.

Their "Rapture" is this: at an unknown time, everyone, whether living or dead, saved or lost, will be raptured, and Judgment Day will begin straightaway. No millenial kingdom. No 7 year tribulation.

In addition Lutheranism also believes in these serious errors:
- Baptismal regeneration (see Luther's Large Catechism)
- Loss of salvation
- Plus a lot of RCC-related doctrine.

IMO, the Lutherans are the Protestant group closest to the RCC in doctrine. No surprise that they are the first group to sign a "Joint Agreement" with the RCC.

So I don't understand why so many Christians, even IFBs, laud Luther as an important man of God.

...especially since he is responsible for the martyred deaths of more Anabaptists than the RCC all put together. When he protested against the RCC, why didn't he go and join himself to the true believing remnant already in place and following the LORD????? No, no, he wanted to do his own "thing". Even though his belief was that salvation was by faith and not by works, it was faith in the sacraments, not in the atoning work of the Lord Jesus Christ. This is why he went back and re-aligned himself with the RCC again, later on.

Not only that, but he had no love for the Jews. :roll:

[John81]

Agreed. It amazes me how many professing Christians, including Baptists, hold Luther in high regard and love to quote him. :(

[JJJ4given]

Agreed. It amazes me how many professing Christians, including Baptists, hold Luther in high regard and love to quote him.

It's amazing how many so-called baptists hold to protestant theology. There are many baptists who are essentially protestants with a baptist label.

:(

[pneu-engine]

It's amazing how many so-called baptists hold to protestant theology. There are many baptists who are essentially protestants with a baptist label.

I know what you mean, jjj4g.

They are like fly-dirt--->>> just all over the place. :(

[pneu-engine]

Neo-evangelicalism spawned a lot of them as well.

[lettheredeemedsayso]

I think all of us know that the scripture teaches us



Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.


This means no church, dogma,or person. Must I go on?


Jesus Christ is the only way,truth and life.

[John81]

I think all of us know that scripture teaches us



Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.


This means no church, dogma,or person. Must I go on?


Jesus Christ is the only way,truth and life.

Not according to Mother Teresa, George W. Bush, Billy Graham, etc.

Of course, you are Scripturally Correct while they are only Politically Correct. :mrgreen:

[ltl]

A thought provoking post over here.
I see two extreme groups of professing Christians in my life:

One group seem to be afflicted with "Rapturi-tis". They're rabid about the Rapture, investigating current events closely, and speculating the period when the Rapture will happen. I've heard of all sorts of such "theories": some say the world will end in 2012 (Mayan prophecy). Some say tribulation starts when the next Pope takes over Benedict XVI. Some say tribulation starts after the Temple Mount is cleared out for the construction of the temple. I once foolishly investigated all these stuff, and God rebuked me for my waste of time. When people start going crazy over the Rapture, they tend to forget what they are assigned to do by Christ: go fulfill the Great Commission. We know that the end shall not come until the gospel is spread to all nations. The Apostle Paul criticized the Thessalonian believers who abandoned their jobs just because they thought the Rapture was near. "He that does not work shall not eat"

Another group does not believe in the Rapture - such as the previously mentioned "Reverend". They think that there is still good in this world - and strive to do so via social reform and even Christianizing of the society. We now see this trend in Charismatic churches, especially those affected by the Latter Rain movement. The Scriptures however in Revelation paint a much gloomier picture of the world, prophesying its eventual doom.

The fact is that we do not know when the Rapture will be - it may come tomorrow, next week, next year, next decade or even the next century!

What shall we do then, knowing that Christ's Second Coming is imminent?
- Go and fulfill the Great Commission. Witness to your friends whenever the chance arises. Sometimes you even have to "create" chances. It does not always have to be by doorknocking and street preaching - though both are what an NT church should practice - but non-Christians also greatly appreciate you providing them with some help - whether it is counselling or other forms of aid - whether given personally or as a church - as a outward expression of your faith. You do not just profess your faith by wearing a cross, preaching on the streets, but also by your daily lifestyle. Let your life open doors to many hardened hearts.
- Enjoy life but fear God. God desires we have life and enjoy it abundantly. Do not let oppurtunities pass by, for our earthly life is but temporal. Life is not just about toil and work - it also includes rest, enjoyment with your brethren in Christ and your family. But remember all that we do we will be judged by God. Live and enjoy, yes, but remember to consult God's Word at all times. (Examples) Instead of drinking alcohol, why don't I enjoy the numerous fruits God has given me? Instead of going to seedy places for recreation, why don't I seek enjoyment by fellowship with my brethren, or with the Lord in prayer? Delight in the Lord always, and you shall have God-centred desires, which God will grant.

[Psalms18_28]

Mar 13:32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.

[John81]

I do agree there are those who focus far too much time on the end-times and when the Rapture will be.

There are also those who focus far too much time on trying to refute the Pre-mil view of the Rapture and end times.

Far better to focus on growing in the Lord, winning souls to Christ and edifying the Body of Christ.

[Me4Him]

The bible explains the "purpose" of the rapture/tribulation, but, so far, I've never see the purpose for either explained by "theologians".

Jesus said because the HG in us was greater than Satan, he would have to flee when we resisted and could never prevail over the church "saints" because he would "always" be with us,

Yet, during the trib we find Satan making war and prevailing over the "saints", do you suppose the theologians can explained why Jesus lied to the "Saints"???

Do you suppose they can explain why church Saints only "Spiritually" crucify the old man to destroy the "body of sin", and be saved,

while those who chose to be saved during the trib will also have to chose a "literal death", knowing the AC will "Literally crucify them" for having the testimony of Jesus and not worshipping the Image??

There are literally "dozens" of scripture contradictions between Church/Trib saints, so far, I've haven't seen any knowledge of or explanation for keeping these "seemly" contradiction "IN CONTEXT" with scripture.

Until God's "OBJECTIVE" (purpose) for the rapture/trib are understood, the reason for the "Pre trib rapture" won't be understood.



2Th 2:7
only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. (Holy Ghost/rapture)

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, (trib period)

and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: (end of trib)

Da 9:27 And he (Jesus/God) shall confirm the covenant with many for one week:

Many like to "twist" the above verse into meaning a "half week", instead of one week, the "HE" into Satan/AC.


Da 9:27 and in the midst of the week (half week) he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, (Abomination of Desolation)

The "Abomination" is too GOD, not Satan, "HE" God stops the sacrifices.