Billy Graham

[JerryNumbers]

John81 said:

 

"The sad thing is that many Baptist churches and Christians today do much the same thing. They go out soul winning, all too many do this in an unbiblical manner, and once they get someone to say a "salvation prayer" with them, they put a mark in their notebook and move on. The potential newborn believer in Christ is left undiscipled."

 

 

So true.

 

 

Many of them are left undiscipled because they refuse to attend church, & you cannot make them attend church services. All you can do is try your best to encourage & invite them. 

 

For instants, you can lead the mule to water, but I guarantee you will not be able to make the mule drink water, if he does not want to.

[DaveW]

I don't think I ever hard a sermon by the guy - but my mum did, and she got saved that day - she is certain of it. I wasn't there, I can't say for sure.

But because there was no follow up there was no growth.
When she heard the Gospel preached years later, she recognised it as what she did all those years before.

I know the guy had his problems doctrinally, and I know that his para-church methods are not biblical, and I know he he is VERY plainly teaching another gospel, which is not another today, but I also know my mum's testimony.

Maybe she got saved in spite of what he preached that day - I don't know.

But I don't endorse his ministry, and certainly didn't mean it to sound that way.

To be honest, I didn't know his background and didn't really care to. What he has preached for many years is enough to know that he is not on the narrow way now, regardless of which way he was on many years ago.

[JerryNumbers]

I don't think I ever hard a sermon by the guy - but my mum did, and she got saved that day - she is certain of it. I wasn't there, I can't say for sure.

But because there was no follow up there was no growth.
When she heard the Gospel preached years later, she recognised it as what she did all those years before.

I know the guy had his problems doctrinally, and I know that his para-church methods are not biblical, and I know he he is VERY plainly teaching another gospel, which is not another today, but I also know my mum's testimony.

Maybe she got saved in spite of what he preached that day - I don't know.

But I don't endorse his ministry, and certainly didn't mean it to sound that way.

To be honest, I didn't know his background and didn't really care to. What he has preached for many years is enough to know that he is not on the narrow way now, regardless of which way he was on many years ago.

 

 

There’s lots of people who think they got saved at a Billy Graham Crusade, yet the only thing they have is a false hope. The big problem comes from the councilors.

 

To be a councilors at one of his crusades you have to be counseled, & agree to his terms. Them at the invitation when a person comes forward before you can counsels that person you have to ask them if they prefer any certain church. So, if you’re a Baptist councilors & the person comes to you, & you ask them that question, & they say they prefer Catholic, you must send them to a Catholic councilor.

 

If that person says they prefer Presbyterian, them you have to send them to a Presbyterian councilor.

 

If that person says they prefer Pentecostal, then you must send them to a Pentecostal councilor.

 

Thus most people that come forwards will talk with a false teaching councilor, & leave lost.

 

The only good thing about his crusades it that the Catholic, Pentecostal, Presbyterian, or others beside Baptist councilor ask the person if they have a preference, & they say Baptist, them they're suppose to send that person to a Baptist councilor. But can they be trusted  if they teach a false gospel. I just cannot trust them, just think who their father is. "Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it." Joh 8:44

 

 

So at his crusades many walk away having only a false hope of Heaven, & its much harder to win someone to Christ that has a false hope, than it is someone that has no hope. So his crusades have done very much damage, spreading a false gospel. God tells us to come out from among them, not join up with them, & not wish them God speed.

[DaveW]

Maybe my mum was fortunate to find someone who actually knew.

I know I would never join with any ministry like today.

[John81]

Many of them are left undiscipled because they refuse to attend church, & you cannot make them attend church services. All you can do is try your best to encourage & invite them. 

 

For instants, you can lead the mule to water, but I guarantee you will not be able to make the mule drink water, if he does not want to.

I've not yet met a person who was truly born again in Christ who wasn't interested in attending church. Every new believer I've ever known was eager to be discipled, eager to know what church to attend, eager to go as soon as possible.

 

There have been many false converts who professed they accepted Christ and not a one of them was interested in church or discipling. They claimed to be born again, but they were quick to make excuses why they couldn't go to any good church offered and why they couldn't get together for discipling.

 

This is something I also noticed when a friend and I were witnessing to Catholics. Every Catholic that was born again in Christ immediately rejected and renounced the RCC and asked about a true church they could attend. Each one of them was eager and excited to join our Bible study so they could learn the truth of Scripture.

 

Anyone we witness to that claims to accept Christ yet has no desire for the things of Christ, we need to try and guide them to examine their claim of salvation and go over the Gospel with them again; if they will allow it. Likely as not, if they claim to accept Christ but have no desire for the things of Christ, they are either outright lying about their profession or simply making a false profession for any number of reasons. Whatever the case, they are yet lost in their sins and need to be confronted with that so hopefully they won't walk away with a false sense of hope.

[DaveW]

I can only agree with you, but both my parents say they were saved in a situation with no follow up. I don't know their hearts, nor was I there to see what went on, but they have been attending a good IFB church for thirty years now, have heard many many strong salvation messages, now bear all the fruit you would expect to see - and both still say they were saved all those years ago.
My parents lament the fact that they each were left without direction - they knew the traditional churches were wrong, but didn't know where was right - so they gave up looking, rather than accept wrong.


I personally have never seen someone who I would.have no doubt of their salvation who does not want to be in God's houseand learning of God, but there is a reason why the Lord commanded in Matt 28:19, 20 to teach, baptise, and teach.

So many forget about the second "teach".

I had one guy try to tell me that we shouldn't try to "make disciples to ourselves" and shouldn't therefore have contact details on tracts we give out!!!!!

[John81]

I can only agree with you, but both my parents say they were saved in a situation with no follow up. I don't know their hearts, nor was I there to see what went on, but they have been attending a good IFB church for thirty years now, have heard many many strong salvation messages, now bear all the fruit you would expect to see - and both still say they were saved all those years ago.
My parents lament the fact that they each were left without direction - they knew the traditional churches were wrong, but didn't know where was right - so they gave up looking, rather than accept wrong.


I personally have never seen someone who I would.have no doubt of their salvation who does not want to be in God's houseand learning of God, but there is a reason why the Lord commanded in Matt 28:19, 20 to teach, baptise, and teach.

So many forget about the second "teach".

I had one guy try to tell me that we shouldn't try to "make disciples to ourselves" and shouldn't therefore have contact details on tracts we give out!!!!!

I was born again while attending an Assemblies of God church with my girlfriend shortly after I turned 18. There was no discipleship, and that church, while preaching the biblical way of salvation, didn't go beyond that. At that time they were focused on preaching the salvation message and the impending arrival of the rapture and end times; no discipleship.

 

It was a rough first few years for me with anyone to disciple me, tell me of what is or isn't a good church, moving, etc.

 

It really wasn't until the Lord brought a good Christian man into my life as a close friend that I began being discipled. He introduced me to a fine Baptist pastor, his church and his excellent mens Bible study. It was during this time the Lord led me to the KJB too. It was also this Baptist pastor who baptized me.

 

Like your parents, I was left adrift for a time after salvation and looking back I so wish I had been discipled and grown in the Lord early on rather than seeing years pass before such happened. Even so, I'm thankful the Lord is faithful, He was ever with me and He worked all things together for good.

 

Many folks are saved under less than ideal circumstances, by less than perfect means. These people need us to be looking out for them, to disciple them and help them grow in the Lord and move in the right direction.

[Invicta]

If you will check out the Presbyterian you will find that they do not teach salvation only by grace though faith, although they do teach your save by grace,  but it though works, baptizing, & church membership.

 

And yes, many of his sermons seems to say by grace though faith, not of works, not of self, its a gift.

 

And because of that teaching is why he will call Catholics, brothers & sister in Christ, as well as all of those protestant churches that came out of the RCC bringing RCC teachings with them. He has been a great bridge builder, & led many churches, many people, into  false teachings.

 

I cannot speak of many Presbyterians, I have only heard one preach and his was a powerful gospel.  he was from the Free Church of Scotland, Continuing.

[John81]

I cannot speak of many Presbyterians, I have only heard one preach and his was a powerful gospel.  he was from the Free Church of Scotland, Continuing.

I think James Montgomery Boice was a Presbyterian and he gave some good sermons.

[JerryNumbers]

I've not yet met a person who was truly born again in Christ who wasn't interested in attending church. Every new believer I've ever known was eager to be discipled, eager to know what church to attend, eager to go as soon as possible.

 

There have been many false converts who professed they accepted Christ and not a one of them was interested in church or discipling. They claimed to be born again, but they were quick to make excuses why they couldn't go to any good church offered and why they couldn't get together for discipling.

 

This is something I also noticed when a friend and I were witnessing to Catholics. Every Catholic that was born again in Christ immediately rejected and renounced the RCC and asked about a true church they could attend. Each one of them was eager and excited to join our Bible study so they could learn the truth of Scripture.

 

Anyone we witness to that claims to accept Christ yet has no desire for the things of Christ, we need to try and guide them to examine their claim of salvation and go over the Gospel with them again; if they will allow it. Likely as not, if they claim to accept Christ but have no desire for the things of Christ, they are either outright lying about their profession or simply making a false profession for any number of reasons. Whatever the case, they are yet lost in their sins and need to be confronted with that so hopefully they won't walk away with a false sense of hope.

 

Of course, but the answer is still the same, we can't make them if they refuse, its not our fault as some seem to say when speaking in such general terms.

[Daniel Rush]

Sadly, Graham was the start of the false prosperity preachers who embrace a universal weak Christ who will judge no one. 

[EKSmith]

a wolf in sheep skin even the devils. can preach Christ risen.

[Invicta]

A preacher we had recently had at our church recommended Graham's book on Angels.  Has anybody read it?

 

 

[Ukulelemike]

Boy, Graham is a tough nut to deal with. Our church tends to draw in believers who have come from other denominations, I guess because we're such a small community. Some never fully embrace fundamentalism. One gent in our church is a really decent guy-give you the shirt off his back-but when he wanted to teach a Bible study using one of Graham's books, I had to disallow it, and he fought that, and fought all I had to tell him about Graham. he comes from a SBC background, and I think tends to see some doctrines as not terribly important, and he follows the idea of giving all your time and money for the unsaved, while kind of complaining about the needs of young believers, like he's put out by helping them, but will buy a car for an unsaved alcoholic who cares nothing for the gospel.

Not always easy getting truth across to some folks, I'm afraid. But he's slowing working his way there. He has a good heart, just a little off course. Like the guy who wanted the church to start a soup kitchen for the homeless, even though in our tiny town, there ARE no homeless, because there are no services for homeless.

[Old-Pilgrim]

I heard from Chris Pinto that B. Graham has had ecumenical leanings from the beginning even though he used to preach the Gospel, and he was promoted in the early days by the help of a wealthy RC who was a member of the Order of Malta and who owned some of the media, so it looks to me like Rome had a mission or a plan for him from the beginning..

'Evangelist Billy Graham recalls in his new book the pivotal point in his young ministry when, during a 1949 Los Angeles crusade, a two-word directive from publisher William Randolph Hearst to "puff Graham" made him an instant celebrity nationwide.

The sudden front-page coverage showered on Graham by Hearst newspapers in mid-October (after three weeks of little notice) was quickly matched by other newspapers and newsmagazines--literally a media circus descending on his rallies under a big tent'

http://articles.latimes.com/1997-06-07/local/me-1034_1_billy-graham-recalls

http://moversandshakersofthesmom.blogspot.co.uk/2008/08/william-randolph-hearst.html

Movers and Shakers of the Sovereign Military Order of Malta

William Randolph Hearst

The SMOM is an elite Roman Catholic Knighthood headed by a Grandmaster who works at the behest of the Pope. Membership is derived from Politics, Industry, Finance, Military, Intelligence, Media and Entertainment. Knights and Dames first swear loyalty to the Pope and then to their country. "Defending the faith" and helping fellow members while serving the Order constitutes their ethics.

 

. It is also said that he is a 33rd degree Freemason. Apparently there was some book written about freemasonry and it had named Billy Graham as a Mason, but the publishers would not publish the book until his name was taken out, so it was, and the book just stated that a very well know evangelical Preacher was a member of The Masons. I think I heard that on C Pintos MP3 version of Freemasonary in the Church or his other one the Jesuit Conspiracy.

http://www.adullamfilms.com/FreemasonryInChurchCD.html

I would recommend Chris Pinto's work on the Topic of the Mystery religions influence on America, he's done about 5 or 6 Documentaries and these two CD's I think there is also a shorter version of these CD's, not many Christian have covered the Topic of Freemasonry the Jesuits and other secret Societies , He also has a on-line radio station now, for those who have the time.

Edited July 7, 2015 by Old-Pilgrim
William Randolph Hearst