America Today

[candlelight]

Yes, I know where the 10 kingdoms comes from, it's the deciding this will be 10 world divisions rather than 10 actual nation/kingdoms I'm trying to understand.

 

As has been pointed out, Scripture doesn't detail who or where these 10 kingdoms will be, so if one believes they will be 10 regional conglomerations of nations then there must be some reason for this belief.

 

After it was mentioned about a movie putting forth the 10 regional kingdoms idea, I looked into that and there is at least one movie which depicts this. As of yet, I've not found a pre-trib preacher or teacher who is putting this forth.

 

On the other hand, there are scores of books and sermons from pre-trib preacher/teachers explaining their reasoning for believing the 10 kingdoms will be actual nations within what is today the EU.

 

If there is no support for or explanation of the 10 regional conglomeration of nations view, that's fine, I was simply trying to investigate this.

 

Note that what some might call "traditional IFB" teaching on this matter points to 10 Euro-nations as the 10 kingdoms. That doesn't make it so, but that's the "traditional" teaching.

The Book of Daniel is now being completely opened, John.  It hadn't been for thousands of years.  For example, I was taught that the Anti-Christ would come out of the RCC.  That is traditional IFB teaching.  However, I am not a traditionalist.  I believe, and have believed, for the past several years, that the Anti-Christ will come out of Islam and Judaism.  The Jews will not accept anyone who isn't a Jew.  The tribe of Dan was the first tribe to go into apostasy.  We see this with Samson, going into Egypt and disOBeying his parents.  He says, "get me a woman" or something to that effect.  I am not using my Bible, just going by memory.  He was deliberately disOBedient to the teachings of God through his parents.  I believe the Anti-Christ will come out of the Tribe of Dan.  I also believe he will be Muslim, as well.  I think he will come from Syria.  Point being, the Bible is still being unraveled.  We are at a point in time where things are starting to come together.  I believe that the RCC will produce the False Prophet.  And, as scripture shows us, the Anti-Christ will devour the False Prophet.

"Dan shall judge his people, as one of the tribes of Israel.  17 Dan shall be a serpent by the way, and adder in the path, that biteth the horse heels, so that his rider shall fall backward." ~ Genesis 49:16-17 

The Book of Daniel is coming together.  I am reading things and starting to put more pieces together.  Unlike many, I don't listen to many outside sources.  I do like a few preachers, David Jeremiah, being one of them... but I read and study for myself.  I simply cannot imagine why I have been seeing "The North American Union" on meat packages in my area.  I am not making this up.  I have seen them for over 6 years.  The Lord is setting up the world, to go with the Anti-Christ against Israel.  There is so much on prophecy in the Bible it is unbelievable.  I know for a fact, that their are 10,385 scriptures on eschatology.  I don't understand why some OB members try to stifle those who talk about prophecy.  Eric's posts are constantly being shot down by members, such as yourself.  Have you ever thought that maybe that is his passion?  He may be reaching people through his posts.  I know it was prophecy and talk about the rapture that sparked me to start to read and studying the word of God.  Many times, God brings man to the bottom of self, before he takes them and starts to molds them.  I know that I was a complete medical wreck in 1997, and it was then that the Lord had me seeking Him for salvation.

There are various threads on OB.  I notice that you post in all of them.  Why not just pick and chose which peaks your interest and not try to bring down the posts about eschatology b/c it isn't your passion?  I am not trying to be mean, I am just saying what has been on my mind for several months.  I don't post in every thread.  You will hardly see me post in a thread on politics.  I may be drawn into something mentioned, but it is not my thing anymore.  I talk a bit about it on Facebook, but I don't want to discuss it on a Christian forum.  That is just me.    

[Arbo]

  When I joined this site, I was under the impression that it was IFB only.  I thought it had changed from the last time I was a member.  I love the fact that it is KJV, but would love it if it were strictly IFB.  I don't know why anyone who is not IFB would want to join OB.  

 

Ouch.

 

I can only state that in my own case, I joined for the fellowship (such as it is on the internet) with other Baptists sans the petty bickering I've seen on other sites.  I know that I am viewed by some as liberal (which I think is laughable) and by others one level above heretic (following a false Christ),  but I still try to be respectful of others' sensibilities and convictions.

[candlelight]

Ouch.

 

I can only state that in my own case, I joined for the fellowship (such as it is on the internet) with other Baptists sans the petty bickering I've seen on other sites.  I know that I am viewed by some as liberal (which I think is laughable) and by others one level above heretic (following a false Christ),  but I still try to be respectful of others' sensibilities and convictions.

 

You've never been a prOBlem, Arbo.  I mentioned that I never had a prOBlem with GraceSaved, Jeffrey and kindofblue.  And, they are liberal Christians.  I don't think of you as liberal or following a false Christ, either.  I never said they were following a false Christ, either.  Also, I don't mind liberal Christians.  It is those who put forth false doctrine and harp on the rest of us, b/c we point out an inconsistency, that I have a prOBlem with.  I also have a prOBlem with the nit-picking.    

[HappyChristian]

How about we take a deep breath...

Asking questions as to source for one's opinions isn't attacking. It's what used to be called exchanging ideas.

Let's all of us not be so quick to jump on each other for asking for clarity on something. There has been so much talk about contention lately (and I agree that there's been more than usual) that it seems to me some of those complaining about the contention are being quite contentious themselves. So let's not add to it, ok?

As to OB being IFB - OB is a Baptist site that welcomes others with the understanding that it is. With forums for IFB. Entrance into the IFB forums require asserting that one is IFB - and approved by BroMatt. But as we all know, there are differences of opinion amongst IFB as well. Hence some of the lively discussions we've had.

As I said before, if everyone we disagreed with were banned, only BroMatt would remain. Again..let's take a breath. And stop assuming that a disagreement is a personal attack or an attempt to undermine.

[candlelight]

How about we take a deep breath...

Asking questions as to source for one's opinions isn't attacking. It's what used to be called exchanging ideas.

Let's all of us not be so quick to jump on each other for asking for clarity on something. There has been so much talk about contention lately (and I agree that there's been more than usual) that it seems to me some of those complaining about the contention are being quite contentious themselves. So let's not add to it, ok?

As to OB being IFB - OB is a Baptist site that welcomes others with the understanding that it is. With forums for IFB. Entrance into the IFB forums require asserting that one is IFB - and approved by BroMatt. But as we all know, there are differences of opinion amongst IFB as well. Hence some of the lively discussions we've had.

As I said before, if everyone we disagreed with were banned, only BroMatt would remain. Again..let's take a breath. And stop assuming that a disagreement is a personal attack or an attempt to undermine.

 

Lately it just seems that I have been attacked on this site, LuAnne.  It is reminding me of months ago when I came back on OB.  I did misread what John wrote.  I admit that.  However, it seems that every time I post something on OB, it is met with much resistance by people.  And, I am not talking about John.  A few moderators are known to attack.  I have a really high tolerance level when it comes to this, but over and over again, by the same mods, I am chastised.  Yes, I do add to the contention, but when I am backed into a corner, I do what anyone else would do.  I argue back.

Some of the unusual views on things regarding eschatology are not sitting well with me.  Preterism is not Biblical.  It is a lie out of the debts of Hell.  And, as I stated to John, why is it that prophecy is considered taboo on this site?

Like I stated, I was introduced to the Lord Jesus Christ, due to prophecy.  I started to learn the Bible backwards, so to speak.  As Christians, we should be free to post about such topics, without resistance from members.  And, I am not talking about Arbo, GraceSaved, Jeffrey and kindofblue.  I am talking about IFB's who constantly question everything, like they are all knowing and I am a moron.  If I had my Bible to show all the scriptures that lead to the topic above, I could better explain things.  And, I don't learn the Bible from things such as the "Left Behind" movies and books.  I find Hollywood movies, of that sort, extremely fictitious.  Over a year ago, I watched an End Time movie called, Megido.  It was Hollywood hype.  Your typical anti-Christian movie filled with nonsense.  I go to the source... the KJV.  Things have been pooping off the pages of the books of Daniel and Revelation for me.  And, for members to question that I haven't seen the "North American Union" on meat packages for over 6 years?  I feel like they are calling me a liar.  Forgive me for being a bit sensitive with all of this.  I don't appreciate being backed in a corner.

[HappyChristian]

I don't recall anyone questioning that you saw NAU on meat packages. The questioning came in with your assertion that the Bible teaches that the world will be divided into 10 kingdoms. Noone was saying you were wrong, but were just asking for further info for their own understanding and/or were pointing out what they had been taught.

Noone has attacked you - not even the mods (recall to mind when you accused me of doing something similar...simply because we were disagreeing?). But if you honestly think a mod is doing so, then the Biblical thing to do would be to go to them about it via pm. Mayhap an explanation would show they aren't attacking - or it could cause them to realize their error. Either way, that is best instead of allowing perceived slights to fester into bitterness.

I don't know why you think discussing prophecy is taboo - there are beaucoup threads about it. And there are many differing views about it, even among IFB.

The nature of a discussion board is that there will be disagreement. And of course each one of us believes ourselves to be right - we ALL do. ;-) If we didn't, there'd be nothing but "good posting"s, "amens", etc. LOL And then we'd all be bored stiff.:-D

[candlelight]

I don't recall anyone questioning that you saw NAU on mest packages. The questioning came in with your assertion that the Bible teaches that the world will be divided into 10 kingdoms. Noone was saying you were wrong, but were just asking for further info for their own understanding.

Noone has attacked you - not even the mods (recall to mind when you accused me of doing something similar...simply because we were disagreeing?). But if you honestly think a mod is doing so, then the Biblical thing to do would be to go to them about it via pm. Mayhap an explanation would show they aren't attacking - or it could cause them to realize their error. Either way, that is best instead of allowing perceived slights to fester into bitterness.

I don't know why you think discussing prophecy is taboo - there are beaucoup threads about it. And there are many differing views about it, even among IFB.

The nature of a discussion board is that there will be disagreement. And of course each one of us believes ourselves to be right - we ALL do. ;-) If we didn't, there'd be nothing but "good posting"s, "amens", etc. LOL And then we'd all be bored stiff.:-D

 The topic came with much resistance, LuAnne.  It felt like I attacked by a mod, then by John.  I am not going to waste my time with a private message.  Rather, I will take a break from OB.  This is not the Christian fellowship I am used to in my IFB church and with Christians, on Facebook, for that matter.  And, the lost are eager to know what the Bible says.  We are in a Revival now, even though it doesn't seem so.  

John, is always putting Eric down for his posts on prophecy.  I see it every time Eric starts a post on eschatology.

I understand disagreement, HC.  However, down right rude is another thing.  I am not used to rude IFB's.  And, with being rude, I will counter that with being rude, as well.  It is human nature.  I am just so tired of the chastisement of some of the moderators on OB.  I will retreat to my Timeline on Facebook.  And, it is Spring, although we are getting snow on Tuesday.  There are lots of things I can do outside this season.  I guess I am not used to explaining myself to others who don't hold my view.  I will stick with my IFB church, any day of the week.  And, I will continue to plant seeds and hopefully win people to Christ.

[HappyChristian]

Tit for tat is not biblical.

We are supposed to get the snow tomorrow. Stay warm. Its late here - later there! Goid night.

[candlelight]

I am not intentionally doing "tit for tat", LuAnne.  I am just discussing what is in my soul.

Night, sister.  We get the snow a day later than you do.  Thankfully, it won't stick.  They are getting much snow in Montreal on Tuesday.  It could be worse.

[John81]

Candlelight,

 

Thank you for taking the time to explain your views are coming from your personal reading and study of the Bible.

 

Eric is a fine brother and he answers my questions in a civil manner. I've not noticed Eric take offense and whether we come to agreement on each point doesn't matter, it's the exchange of reasoning that's helpful.

 

Asking questions isn't resistance or attack, it's a quest for more information which hopefully will aid in understanding and discussion.

 

I'm really not sure what your point is with saying you don't mind what liberal Christians say but you do mind certain people asking certain questions about certain topics. Then you mention that prophecy should be open for discussion.

 

Whether the prophecy topic brings up aspects of pre-trib, mid-trib, post-trib, a-mil, post-mil, preterist, partial-preterist, dominionism or something else, as I believe LuAnne pointed out, the best approach is to examine them by Scripture and agree or disagree based upon Scripture. If everyone on the board decided to say we would all agree to accept a-mil and won't post or allow posts about anything else or anything negative about a-mil, then there would be no discussion at all.

 

Members here over the years have posted their understanding of Scripture to show why they believe in a variety of end-times views. Those postings have been very helpful, even when I or others disagree with some of them. Iron sharpeneth iron, and continual reading, studying and consideration of the Word when it comes to eschatology can be of benefit.

 

While I've not seen any NAU labels on meat, or elsewhere, I never commented upon that because I had nothing to say on the matter and didn't have any questions about it.

 

In any event, thank you again for letting me know where your 10 world division view came from.

[Ukulelemike]

For those who haven't seen this. Its been planned since well back in the 70's

[Salyan]

"The best laid plans of mice and men gang aft agley..."

[Alimantado]

Apart from sharing funny accents, what do the Ozzies and the South Africans have in common that would cause them to yoke up?

[HappyChristian]

Apart from sharing funny accents, what do the Ozzies and the South Africans have in common that would cause them to yoke up?

Heh - that's what I was wondering (well, not about the accents - about the reasoning behind their yoking). 

[Salyan]

Southern Indian Ocean affiliates... or racial issues?