Is obedience to the command of the gospel to repent and believe a work?

[mbkjpreacher]

Is obedience to the commands of the gospel to repent and believe a work? 

 

What about fear of God, responding in humility, sorrow of sins, repentance, and faith?  

Could loving God from loving sin be a work?  

[Jim_Alaska]

Personally I think that recent posts attributing almost anything having to do with salvation being seen as a "work" is getting old.

[mbkjpreacher]

According to the heresy of Steven Anderson that repentance of sin is a work.  So they teach that the lost sinner does not change his mind concerning his love for sin when he believes in the Lord.  

Fear is a response of the mind and heart when one knows the fact of sin and hell.  If a person would not fear God, and the facts of hell, why would he trust in Jesus for salvation??? 

Humility is the response of man when the Holy Spirit convicts him of sin, he needs to humble and accept the fact that he is a sinner and repents of it.  All men are by nature proud, and a person who is full of pride will not accept that he is a sinner, neither will he be sorry of his sins and repents.  So how would that person feel the need to trust in the Savior if he does not need repentance.  

When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
(Mark 2:17)
 

For all those things hath mine hand made, and all those things have been, saith the LORD: but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.
(Isaiah 66:2)
 

The big question, how come that many have followed Anderson that repentance of sin is a work when repentance of sin is a change of mind and not a physical effort and sequence of action.  Works are fruit of repentance. 

[SureWord]

On 7/14/2020 at 6:12 AM, mbkjpreacher said:

Is obedience to the commands of the gospel to repent and believe a work? 

 

What about fear of God, responding in humility, sorrow of sins, repentance, and faith?  

Could loving God from loving sin be a work?  

Commands of the gospel?

To obey the gospel is to believe the report.

There are no commands of the gospel other than believing the gospel unto salvation. 

Somebody has been filling your mind with junk in order to ruin your peace and assurance with God.

Stay away from Steve Anderson and stop over-analyzing the simplicity of Christ.

[mbkjpreacher]

30 minutes ago, SureWord said:

Commands of the gospel?

To obey the gospel is to believe the report.

There are no commands of the gospel other than believing the gospel unto salvation. 

Somebody has been filling your mind with junk in order to ruin your peace and assurance with God.

Stay away from Steve Anderson and stop over-analyzing the simplicity of Christ.

Is it your proposition that there is no humility and repentance of sin in believing the gospel?  

[SureWord]

1 hour ago, mbkjpreacher said:

Is it your proposition that there is no humility and repentance of sin in believing the gospel?  

Did the thief on the cross have time to repent of his sin in the way you insist repentance is? He only had time to change his mind about the wretched life he lived and the goodness of the Lord. No time for anything else. I guess he stopped sinning when he died. 

Edited July 29, 2020 by SureWord

[HappyChristian]

Yes, the thief did repent...he started out casting aspersions at Christ along with the other thief: "...and they that were crucified with him reviled him." (Mark 15:32b). This shows the nature of their hearts - mocking Jesus, reviling him right along with the crowd. However, something happened to one of the thieves. As time went on, it seems he began to realize that he deserved his punishment, but Jesus didn't. God had begun to work on his heart and mind...yes, I said God had done that, because it is the goodness of God that leads us to repentance.

At one point, we even see the fruit of repentance in that thief: Luke 23:39-43 tells us that when the one thief reviled Christ again, the other rebuked him. Obviously a change of mind and heart occurred...repentance. It is a truth that God works in us, leading us to repentance (Romans 2:4 tells us that God leads us to it).

Jesus said without repentance we perish...and that would include the thief on the cross, who obviously had a wake-up some time while on the cross, and repented. And I would say that he did indeed stop sinning when he died...we all do. LOL

The simplicity of the gospel is that Christ loved us, shed His blood and died for us...and the Holy Spirit leads us to repentance.

 

mbkj, Anderson is not the only one who teaches that repentance is a work. He didn't originate it, either. It is still heresy, though. 

[SureWord]

4 hours ago, HappyChristian said:

Yes, the thief did repent...he started out casting aspersions at Christ along with the other thief: "...and they that were crucified with him reviled him." (Mark 15:32b). This shows the nature of their hearts - mocking Jesus, reviling him right along with the crowd. However, something happened to one of the thieves. As time went on, it seems he began to realize that he deserved his punishment, but Jesus didn't. God had begun to work on his heart and mind...yes, I said God had done that, because it is the goodness of God that leads us to repentance.

At one point, we even see the fruit of repentance in that thief: Luke 23:39-43 tells us that when the one thief reviled Christ again, the other rebuked him. Obviously a change of mind and heart occurred...repentance. It is a truth that God works in us, leading us to repentance (Romans 2:4 tells us that God leads us to it).

Jesus said without repentance we perish...and that would include the thief on the cross, who obviously had a wake-up some time while on the cross, and repented. And I would say that he did indeed stop sinning when he died...we all do. LOL

The simplicity of the gospel is that Christ loved us, shed His blood and died for us...and the Holy Spirit leads us to repentance.

 

mbkj, Anderson is not the only one who teaches that repentance is a work. He didn't originate it, either. It is still heresy, though. 

When I said the thief didn't have time to repent I was referring to the way the word repentance is used by many today, i.e. stop sinning and start doing right. The thief didn't really have time to pull that off. It was pure mercy he was looking for based on the fact that he was nailed to a cross and couldn't do anything. He hit the rock bottom, the end of the line with no change of changing his ways.

Repentance is nothing but a change of mind. The thief had that.

I've seen many young Christians really messed up with Lordship Salvation. Like I said before, one even went completely bonkers and had a nervous breakdown.

[John Young]

3 hours ago, SureWord said:

Repentance is nothing but a change of mind.

A change of mind (assent) and a change of heart (from pride and rejection to humility and submission).

Edited July 30, 2020 by John Young

[SureWord]

3 hours ago, John Young said:

A change of mind (assent) and a change of heart (from pride and rejection to humility and submission).

Yes, a submission to the gospel not a submission or promise to do good works. That submission comes after salvation. Some Christians think of repentance as a deal with God in relation to salvation.

[mbkjpreacher]

11 hours ago, SureWord said:

Did the thief on the cross have time to repent of his sin in the way you insist repentance is? He only had time to change his mind about the wretched life he lived and the goodness of the Lord. No time for anything else. I guess he stopped sinning when he died. 

Don't  you know that both the thieves mocked first and then the other one changed his mind and repented of his sinful way, and trusted in Jesus?  

 

The thieves also, which were crucified with him, cast the same in his teeth.
(Matthew 27:44)
 

And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us. But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation? And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss. And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.
(Luke 23:39-43)
 

Is your idea of repentance of sin, to stop sinning or a change of mind concerning sin?  If your idea of repentance of sin is to quit sinning then that is the erroneous idea of repentance of sin, that is similar to pentecostal view and anderson's view , to quit and stop sinning and they think that repentance of sin is not just change of mind about sin but they add works to it. 

We know that repentance is a change of mind, to change mind from writing to not writing is a change of mind about writing, to change mind from not going to going is a change of mind about going, to change mind from bringing evil punishment to not punishing just like God, and to change mind from sin is not work.  None of them is work but all of them is a change of mind, but the work is the result of changing one's mind.   If you think one of them mentioned is a work why don't you think all of them is a work???? 

Edited July 30, 2020 by mbkjpreacher
spell

[mbkjpreacher]

1 hour ago, SureWord said:

Yes, a submission to the gospel not a submission or promise to do good works. That submission comes after salvation. Some Christians think of repentance as a deal with God in relation to salvation.

Which comes first, repentance or faith according to the following verses, Mark 1: 15, Acts 20:21; Heb 6:1??? 

[HappyChristian]

On 7/29/2020 at 2:49 PM, SureWord said:

When I said the thief didn't have time to repent I was referring to the way the word repentance is used by many today, i.e. stop sinning and start doing right. The thief didn't really have time to pull that off. It was pure mercy he was looking for based on the fact that he was nailed to a cross and couldn't do anything. He hit the rock bottom, the end of the line with no change of changing his ways.

Repentance is nothing but a change of mind. The thief had that.

I've seen many young Christians really messed up with Lordship Salvation. Like I said before, one even went completely bonkers and had a nervous breakdown.

Repentance is more than a change of mind, or it wouldn't necessitate God leading us to it. Any person alive has the power to change their mind about things.  Repentance is also a change of heart, a change of thought process...PROOF of that repentance is shown later (if one does not die, as the thief did) as the repentant one learns to grow in Christ. 

I've seen too many people messed up with the lie that repentance isn't necessary for salvation...as well as others messed up by Lordship Salvation - which is something nobody on here has advocated.

[Jim_Alaska]

1 hour ago, HappyChristian said:

I've seen too many people messed up with the lie that repentance isn't necessary for salvation...as well as others messed up by Lordship Salvation - which is something nobody on here has advocated.

I'm going to openly show my ignorance here i guess. I must have always lived a very sheltered existence. I have been saved for almost forty years and have never heard of Lordship Salvation until coming to this forum almost four years ago. I have no idea what "Lordship Salvation' is.

I am quite sure it is not a good thing, but also have to say that there is only one kind of Salvation according to Scripture. This is the Salvation all the world is called to, and given to a lost and dying world by God through the sacrifice of His Son, for sin.

[HappyChristian]

3 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said:

I'm going to openly show my ignorance here i guess. I must have always lived a very sheltered existence. I have been saved for almost forty years and have never heard of Lordship Salvation until coming to this forum almost four years ago. I have no idea what "Lordship Salvation' is.

I am quite sure it is not a good thing, but also have to say that there is only one kind of Salvation according to Scripture. This is the Salvation all the world is called to, and given to a lost and dying world by God through the sacrifice of His Son, for sin.

The teaching of Lorship Salvation is what led to the heresy that repentance is a work, IMO. 

This is a quote from a man named David Stewart (no relation to my former brother-in-law. hehe). It sums it up pretty well.

“Like an infectious disease, the heresy of Lordship Salvation is everywhere today. “Lordship Salvation” is the false teaching that acknowledging one's guilt of sin in the eyes of a holy God, and believing the Gospel are insufficient to save a person. In addition, proponents of Lordship Salvation teach that in order to be saved, a person must surrender their life in obedience to Christ's lordship, forsake the world, cease from sinful bad habits, confess Christ openly before men, and make a commitment to follow Jesus (or a variation thereof). Lordship Salvation is 100% based in human effort, which is a works-based false plan of salvation.”

It actually fits quite neatly into the calvinist view.