Church *of the* Laodiceans

[2 Timothy 4:18]

Ever noticed this in Revelation 3...."church *of the* Laodiceans"? All the other churches were addressed as "the church in ___". Many people try to use this passage as evidence that salvation can be lost. Since we know salvation can't be lost, I figure these are the people following the likes of "chrislam" and the churches forming that think homosexuality is okay. Any thoughts?

[MountainChristian]

Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write

And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write

And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write

And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write

And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write

And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write

And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write

In the Greek Ephesus, Smyrna, and Laodiceans do not have "in". 

Edited July 11, 2015 by MountainChristian
correction

[No Nicolaitans]

The church of the Laodiceans was aptly named according to its description given in Revelation 3, and its name also aptly describes the state of the church today...

Laodiceans:

Λαοδικεύς Laodikeus (lah-od-ik-yooce') n/g.
1. a Laodicean, i.e. inhabitant of Laodicia
[from G2993]

G2993 Λαοδίκεια Laodikeia (lah-od-ik'-ei-ah) n/l.
1. Laodicia, a place in Asia Minor
[from a compound of G2992 and G1349]

G2992 λαός laos (lah-os') n.
1. a people

G1349 δίκη dike (dee'-kay) n.
1. right (as self-evident)
2. justice (the principle, a decision, or its execution)

So, Laodiceans is a compound word meaning...

A people's right/justice.

Doesn't that aptly describe what is going on in mainstream "Christianity" today! Rather than the church standing solid on God's word, they are more concerned with pleasing people and standing up for people's rights/justice. The rights of sin and sinners take precedence over God's word.

[Genevanpreacher]

Only 3 of the churches have the word 'at' in the verses of my bible. The rest say 'of'.

Church of Ephesus

Church of the Smyrnians

Church, which is at Pergamus

Church which is at Thyatira

Church which is at Sardi

Church which is of Philadelphia

Church of the Laodiceans

Matches the greek.

 

 

Edited July 12, 2015 by Genevanpreacher

[Alan]

No Nicolaitans hit the nail on the head.

We are now living in the age of Laodicea. The Laodiceans, "use," the scriptures as they see fit for their own agenda and own beliefs (or the beliefs of their denomination). I f they cannot twist meaning of the scriptures to fit their own doctrines or  beliefs, they change the scriptures: the KJV of 1611, and translate it into a "new" version.

The Bible is not the final authority and many of the saints do not love the scriptures as the other churches did.  

[Covenanter]

No Nicolaitans hit the nail on the head.

We are now living in the age of Laodicea. The Laodiceans, "use," the scriptures as they see fit for their own agenda and own beliefs (or the beliefs of their denomination). I f they cannot twist meaning of the scriptures to fit their own doctrines or  beliefs, they change the scriptures: the KJV of 1611, and translate it into a "new" version.

The Bible is not the final authority and many of the saints do not love the scriptures as the other churches did.  

What an extraordinary statement, Alan. I hope you didn't mean what you wrote. 

[2 Timothy 4:18]

Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write

And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write

And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write

And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write

And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write

And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write

And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write

In the Greek Ephesus, Smyrna, and Laodiceans do not have "in". 

I should have been more specific. The words "of" or "in" are not the key focus. It is "of the Laodiceans". In other words, the church doesn't belong to God, but to the Laodiceans. Apparently God isn't welcome.

[Alan]

Covenanter said, and I quote,"What an extraordinary statement, Alan. I hope you didn't mean what you wrote." The question you ask already implies I said something horrific. So, any way I answer I am made to look bad.

1. Why is that an extraordinary statement? Please explain yourself.

2. Even before I answer, you condemn me. You stated, "Alan, I hope you didn't mean what you srote." Why should I answer? It sounds like you want to belittle my position, in front of the godly brethren, even before you hear it and I have a chance to explain myself.

Ian, forgive me if I say so, you are not my judge, I am of the persuasion that your two statements are Pharisic, and, you are trying to bait me into an argument.

So, at this time I will forbear answering.

 

 

[No Nicolaitans]

 

The Bible is not the final authority and many of the saints do not love the scriptures as the other churches did.  

What an extraordinary statement, Alan. I hope you didn't mean what you wrote. 

Alan was simply saying that today's church has that attitude; he wasn't saying that he believed that.

[Rebecca]

Of course Alan believes the Bible is our final authority! It's quite obvious by the context that the sentence is talking about the churches today who disregard God's Word, it is not their final authority. Alan is correct, in this day and age more and more churches are laying aside the Bible in favor of books written by man. Once upon a time, the Bible was revered, it was considered holy, and it was treated as such by those in the churches throughout the world. But, in this day and age the Bible is offensive even to some of those in the church so they disregard it or change it to suit their warped beliefs. If the churches truly loved the Word of God, there would not be so many perverted bibles on the market today, the people of God would be too terrified to change God's holy words. But they're not scared, not even a tad bit worried. And that's because they don't believe the Bible is the very Word of God, to them it's just a book.

[Alan]

Rebecca,

Amen and amen! Praise the Lord!

I am in agreement with every word that you wrote and the spiritual attitude that you wrote it in. May God in heaven be praised.

"Thy word is very pure: therefore thy servant loveth it." Psalms 119:140

After a very careful study of the manuscript issues concerning the Authorized Version, the King James Version of 1611, I am of the persuasion that it the "pure" word of God in the English language. And, is the preserved word of God, in the English language, as described in Psalm 12:6-8

Furthermore, for the record, I am also thankful for, and heartedly agree with, the stand by Matt on OnLine Baptist on the following link: http://www.onlinebaptist.com/home/topic/8749-regarding-the-kjv-issue/  I would recommend all of the brethren visit his thread, "Regarding the KJV issue."

Alan

[2 Timothy 4:18]

I saw the comment from "Covenanter" and figured he had misunderstood. I wanted to point out what you meant Alan, but figured being new here I had best get to know people better first. I figured you would have a reply so I figured it best to let you handle it yourself, and you sure did!

[Ukulelemike]

One thing to remember about the Laodicean church, is that, their candlestick was still in its place. For all their problems and worldliness, and that Jesus was outside knocking to go it, it was STILL seen as Jesus' church. As such, we need to be very careful in how they are judged. Certainly we need to call out false teachers and false doctrines, but we need to be careful when we seek to call out what churches are false and true, because even Laodicea was in its place before the Lord, shakey though that place may have been. 

[2 Timothy 4:18]

One thing to remember about the Laodicean church, is that, their candlestick was still in its place. For all their problems and worldliness, and that Jesus was outside knocking to go it, it was STILL seen as Jesus' church. As such, we need to be very careful in how they are judged. Certainly we need to call out false teachers and false doctrines, but we need to be careful when we seek to call out what churches are false and true, because even Laodicea was in its place before the Lord, shakey though that place may have been. 

I have a little different understanding of this church. Not that I am correct, but just that my understanding is different. I see this as an apostate church. Not a church that has "lost" anything, but has never gained it, which is why Jesus was knocking. Verse 17 and 18 doesn't look to be descriptions of people that are saved, especially being "naked" in need of "white raiment". This had to be a spiritual reference as these people were rich.

[Potatochip]

Ever noticed this in Revelation 3...."church *of the* Laodiceans"? All the other churches were addressed as "the church in ___". Many people try to use this passage as evidence that salvation can be lost. Since we know salvation can't be lost, I figure these are the people following the likes of "chrislam" and the churches forming that think homosexuality is okay. Any thoughts?

I don't know anything about the Laodicean "age" or church you get one opinion then you get another.  It's one of those questions I table in my mind and wait on.  I pretty much attribute "churches" that think being sodomite is ok to being harlot church's.  The RCC has harlots.  What that amounts to in my opinion is working your way to heaven.  The same for muslims "Allah" adds up all your marbles at the end if your missing some marbles for doing good works then you lose all your marbles and go wherever they think hes sends them, I guess.  So what you are dealing with with the RCC in addition is a lot of idolatry.  Works that are based coming from the law adds up to ones conscience by law.  The press the pope the harlot churches try to make you feel extra guilty about a plethora of things.   So if you don't save the whole world from social malfeasance in essence your in trouble with God.  I don't bother listening to their filthy rags rants. 

So I guess there is nothing wrong with helping if its from a pure motive like from Salvation.  The bad news is your never going to "fix" the world its a fallen world that makes for a really leaky boat your going to keep patching its going to spring ten more leaks while your trying to patch it  and of course eventually its going to sink.   The good news of course is Jesus has overcome the world and you can actually help people get saved and guess what that's permanent. 

 

Titus 1:14-16

14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.

16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Edited July 14, 2015 by Potatochip