Music In The Independent Baptist Churches

[JimsHelpmeet]

Could you guys be wrong, about the women leading the music, If so, they cannot go up and sign a special either, where do you draw a line?.

Typically the song leader of a church (unless it is a very small church) would be considered a music minister and their duties go outside of simply leading music. My dad is the song leader at our church and he is responsible for setting the tone of the service through music. He has to be in a position of authority over the choir and our pianist. In all of the SBC churches I've attended, the music minister would be called to visit with people in the hospital or in nursing homes if the pastor had other commitments. It was always a paid, full-time ministry position. 

 

A woman singing special music isn't leading men, teaching men, placing men into subjection under her, or anything else that would be unscriptural (unless she was singing ungodly music). She's simply blessing those with the music. There are no biblical rules against women being a blessing to others. Women are supposed to encourage and edify others within the body, but they aren't supposed to be in a position of leadership over the congregation. 

 

I'll give another example. My mother and I prepare breakfast for our bus ministry kids. We're blessing the children with the food, but we are still under the authority of our pastor, if that analogy makes any sense.

[OLD fashioned preacher]

A song leader (doing what he's supposed to be doing) directs the singing. He determines whether the 4/4 song is at 70bpm or 100bpm, he determines the duration of hold on a fermata, accentuation or dynamics within a song (many times a song's message calls for feelings that are accomplished in volume changes ranging from pianissimo to fortissimo or by accelerando, crescendo or diminuendo that is not specifically written in such songs as "He Arose" or "Master the Tempest is Raging").

 

All singers (male or female) and all musicians follow the commands of the song leader -- the piano DOES NOT lead!!!!!

[swathdiver]

But the church is not for the Saints only, than this will be called a Social Cub. The churches job is to reach the lost for Jesus Christ, then to feed then Sheeps, and worship with songs and thanks giving, 

 

Heretical!   

 

Actually, the church is the saints only. The social club aspect comes in when it's all focused on their fun, and not on serving & growing in the Lord.  The church is made up of believers, who gather together to worship, learn of and serve the Lord.  That is the primary purpose in the gatherings (i.e. Sunday services). There may be special services that have a primary focus on presenting the gospel to the lost, but if every service were focused on the lost, the gathering of believers would fail to complete its primary purpose.

 

Biblical!   

[John81]

A song leader (doing what he's supposed to be doing) directs the singing. He determines whether the 4/4 song is at 70bpm or 100bpm, he determines the duration of hold on a fermata, accentuation or dynamics within a song (many times a song's message calls for feelings that are accomplished in volume changes ranging from pianissimo to fortissimo or by accelerando, crescendo or diminuendo that is not specifically written in such songs as "He Arose" or "Master the Tempest is Raging").

 

All singers (male or female) and all musicians follow the commands of the song leader -- the piano DOES NOT lead!!!!!

The piano leads in our church, unless our pastor stops them and tells them to play differently.

[OLD fashioned preacher]

The piano leads in our church, unless our pastor stops them and tells them to play differently.

Haha, I realize what common practice is -- I personally don't care if a church has congregation members call out what page they want, it's their church.

 

I was referring to the "does a song leader have any authority over anyone" yaya.

 

If someone is just giving page numbers, they don't have to flap their arms like chicken wings.

But if a song leader is used (they don't need to be paid either, or have a Bachelor's in music) and asked to direct the music, then he "calls the shots" on the doing of the song (of course I realize the pastor might say -- let's sing that verse again, etc).

[John81]

Agreed!

 

In our small church the pastors select the music, inform the piano players, the pastor announces the song and hymn page number, we stand, the piano plays, we sing.

 

Those "degreed" music and worship leaders seem most often to go a bad direction and why pay to have such?

 

I tried responding earlier but OB wouldn't let the post go through.

[Ukulelemike]

Pay a music leader? Wow-I don't even get paid as the pastor!

Seriously, I suppose if a church is large enough, and the music leader is busy on numerous fronts, ie, congregational music, a choir, special groups, etc, maybe ought to be paid at least something, dpending upon the amount of time he labours.

 

Sadly, though, too often everyone who does anything in a church seems these days to think they ought to be paid-yet what we do should not be for pay-I'm not against paying people in what they do for the church, if what they do keeps them busy enough to make it difficult to have an outside job, but we certainly should be happy to work for the lord with our eyes toward the reward in Heaven, not on earth.

[John81]

Pay a music leader? Wow-I don't even get paid as the pastor!

Seriously, I suppose if a church is large enough, and the music leader is busy on numerous fronts, ie, congregational music, a choir, special groups, etc, maybe ought to be paid at least something, dpending upon the amount of time he labours.

 

Sadly, though, too often everyone who does anything in a church seems these days to think they ought to be paid-yet what we do should not be for pay-I'm not against paying people in what they do for the church, if what they do keeps them busy enough to make it difficult to have an outside job, but we certainly should be happy to work for the lord with our eyes toward the reward in Heaven, not on earth.

Amen!!!

 

So many churches today pay somebody to do almost everything that it's infected not only the people in those churches but outside as well. Big Joe knows Slim Jim get's paid to do "this task" in that church so Big Joe thinks he's being cheated if his church isn't paying him. Eventually many tasks around the church are no longer looked at as opportunities to help, volunteer service unto the Lord and their home church, but rather as a job to angle for in order to get more money.

 

In our church the pastor and associate pastor get paid. The church secretary draws a small check. The couple who janitor the church get paid a small sum. That's it. Anything not done by these folks is done by volunteers.

[OLD fashioned preacher]

In our church the pastor gets some pay and works outside the church too. We also have some level or another of support going to 14 missionaries. That's all that get any "pay" in monetary form.

[JerryNumbers]

In our church the pastor gets some pay and works outside the church too. We also have some level or another of support going to 14 missionaries. That's all that get any "pay" in monetary form.

 

It amazes me at the way many, especially the larger churches, spends the money. I understand some of the even have paid Sunday School teachers.

 

Perhaps I'm wrong, yet it seems that some people are members & attend larger churches so they can attend church services while someone is paid to do everything so they can set in the Sunday school class, on the pew, them get up walking out leaving their religious cloak inside the church door as they leave the building until the next meeting.

 

I have been part of one church that had a paid Minister of music, he also served as the youth director. All other churches had only one person to receive any pay, the pastor. And of course usually much was expected out of him even though he worked at a full time job to support his family.

[Invicta]

Great Is Thy Faithfulness

Amazing Grace

Rock of Ages

Trust and Obey

 

 

Off the top of my head these are the most recent songs we have sang in our church.

 

We have sung all those recently in our church.

[MountainChristian]

We sing those songs too.

 

I'll fly away

at the cross

farther along

Jesus took my heart all to pieces

[John81]

I Need Thee Every Hour

 

and

 

What A Friend We Have In Jesus

 

were my two favorites from today.

[The Glory Land]

Jesus is the sweetest name I know, for it just the same as that lovely day, that the reason why I love him so, for Jesus is the sweetest name I know. :)

[Covenanter]

It is a challenge choosing hymns that a congregation will be able to sing.

Yesterday's hymns:

97 O worship the King (omit vs 5)
487 Amazing grace
I will glory in my redeemer