Today's New International Version (TNIV)

[JerryNumbers]

Wow, you don't believe all of God's words are pure?

Of course, haven't you ever paid any attention to comments I've made about the KJ Bible?

"Things That Are Different Are Not The Same"

A very good book by Micky Carter that will help you out on the subject at hand.

Great sermon by
Curtis Hutson.

You might be able to listen to it here.

[Lisa Anne]

This isn't the TNIV but the NIV. Kind of interesting. I found while hunting around tonight about more differences.

http://www.chick.com/information/bibleversions/articles/nivquiz.asp

That is not the original site I found it from. I can't find it in my history but OBviously it is popular and many may have seen it already. But quite interesting nonetheless. I

http://www.biblica.com/niv/accuracy/niv-KJV-verses.php
By Edwin H. Palmer

I love the King James Version. I was converted under it, my first memory verses were taken from it, and I have been blessed by it. And God still uses the KJV to bring many people to salvation in Christ. This version was translated by godly men who did an excellent jOB with the tools they had in the language of four centuries ago. Countless millions have been converted, sanctified, and nurtured through it. Thank God for that marvelously used translation.

The KJV is not, however, the best translation to use today. This is so for two reasons: (1) it adds to the Word of God and (2) it has now-OBscure and misleading renderings of God's Word.
Additions to the Word of God

The KJV translators did not intend to add to the Word of God. They did their best, but all they had to work with was a handful of copies of the Greek manuscripts of the New Testament books. These were very late copies dating from a thousand (!) years after the New Testament was written. In a few sections they had no Greek manuscript at all! Instead, they had to rely on the Latin Vulgate's rendering of what they thought must have originally been in the Greek!

Through the providence of God, many more Greek manuscripts had been preserved and were subsequently discovered—in fact, more than five thousand of them. Some were very old indeed, dating back much farther than the relatively few the KJV translators used. Some of the Greek manuscripts date back to the four hundreds and three hundreds—even to about a.d. 200. These ancient manuscripts were more reliable and accurate, not being corrupted by errors made during countless times of copying, such as occurred with the late manuscripts used by the KJV.

As a result we know today, with a high degree of accuracy, what was in the original writings.1 Uncertainty now exists in only an infinitesimally small part of the New Testament (the difference would be comparable to that between "don't" and "do not" or "street" and "way").

Some examples of verses that the KJV added to the Word of God, even though it did so unwittingly and in all innocence, are

* Matthew 17:21; 18:11; 23:14
* Mark 7:16; 9:44, 46; 11:26; 15:28
* Luke 17:36; 23:17
* John 5:4
* Acts 8:37; 15:34; 24:7; 28:29
* Romans 16:24
* 1 John 5:7b-8a

In addition many phrases and words were also added.

This saddens me that someone raised and converted under the KJV would turn right and say "it is not the best version."

[anime4christ]

Really?

If you want to be biblical, God clearly said his words were pure and that He promised to preserve them - so where are they today?

You're shifting the burden of proof. The KJVO position claims that the only true word of God in all the world. No other version in any other language can be the perfect word of God if the KJVO position is correct for the reason I mentioned. You are the one who must prove that claim.

@Jerry: I just want to clarify that I do not consider you guys stupid, or cultish, or whatever.. and I do love the KJV more than any Bible I have read, but I just can't see that it is the only one that is the true word of God.

[JerryNumbers]

New versions of the Bible comes about for at least 2 reason, maybe even more.

1. They want a version that better teaches and agrees with what they teach.
2. Its generally a money maker.

I have given a reference to a very good book on this subject. It amazes me at the many people who chose to assume all Bibles are the same without rightly studying the issue, and understanding the BIG differences in them.

[John81]

You're shifting the burden of proof. The KJVO position claims that the only true word of God in all the world. No other version in any other language can be the perfect word of God if the KJVO position is correct for the reason I mentioned. You are the one who must prove that claim.

@Jerry: I just want to clarify that I do not consider you guys stupid, or cultish, or whatever.. and I do love the KJV more than any Bible I have read, but I just can't see that it is the only one that is the true word of God.

Some KJO believe that only the KJ is perfect in any language. Some KJO believe the KJ is the perfect English Bible but there are Bibles in other langauges which is God's perfect Word in that language.

Narrowing the focus down to just English versions now, if there is a perfect English version that necessarily means any other English version that differs from the perfect version is imperfect.

[Pastor Matt]

You're shifting the burden of proof. The KJVO position claims that the only true word of God in all the world. No other version in any other language can be the perfect word of God if the KJVO position is correct for the reason I mentioned. You are the one who must prove that claim.

Since you are the one making the statement, I think you are the one that must prove that claim. I'm KJVO and I do not believe the bold part to be a true statement. I believe the KJV to be God's preserved Words in English, and He is capable of doing it in other languages also.

Seeing how this topic is about a "English" version, I think this topic should remain discussing the English versions.

[anime4christ]

Since you are the one making the statement, I think you are the one that must prove that claim. I'm KJVO and I do not believe the bold part to be a true statement. I believe the KJV to be God's preserved Words in English, and He is capable of doing it in other languages also.

Seeing how this topic is about a "English" version, I think this topic should remain discussing the English versions.

The prOBlem is I am Russian and understand it well enough to tell that some verses have different meanings in the KJV and the RST. They're usually not big doctrinal ones, but the point is that the meaning is not identical.

[Brother Rick]

The prOBlem is I am Russian and understand it well enough to tell that some verses have different meanings in the KJV and the RST. They're usually not big doctrinal ones, but the point is that the meaning is not identical.

There are some variances in belief amongst the KJVO camp about this issue, but what we all agree on is that the word of God is preserved infallibly in the English in the King James Bible. We at least know where the word of God is in our language.

I personally believe that the word of God is before me in English in the KJV, and if I'm going to translate Scripture to another language (which I have) I'm going to use what I KNOW to be God's word - the KJV. Others think they have to go back to the Greek to translate to another language and reinvent the wheel all over again - they are wrong. If the KJV is pure and perfect, then go from it. There is no such thing as an original or perfect Greek manuscript, they have all faded away.

If the Bible in Russian was translated from corrupt English versions or from where we got the corrupt English versions (corrupt Greek manuscripts) then there is no infallible word of God in Russian.

If you balk at that, I would like to remind you that we who are in the KJVO camp are the ONLY people out there that will tell you that infallible word CAN BE FOUND somewhere. The apostate Bible correcting scholars of the Alexandrian texts will tell you there is NO SUCH THING as an infallible Bible ANYWHERE.

If there is a Russian Bible that was translated from the English KJV then it is the preserved and infallible word of God in Russian. If there are subtle differences that do not effect doctrine, that is fine (there always are when you go from one language to another) it is still the word of God and it is still perfect and infallible. There were DOZENS of inspired translations in the original Greek texts. Whenever a NT writer quoted an OT writer, he was translating. When he wrote it down into Greek it was without any shadow of a doubt the inspired word of God - therefore it is possible for a translation to be given by inspiration.

I'm going to be writing something on this soon, hopefully at least. If you study Jeremiah 36, 45, and 51 you'll see that the originals were cut up and burned once, then the second set of originals were tossed into a river, and then a third set of originals were written but the words varied on them from the first set.

Jer. 36:22, "Then took Jeremiah another roll, and gave it to Baruch the scribe, the son of Neriah; who wrote therein from the mouth of Jeremiah all the words of the book which Jehoiakim king of Judah had burned in the fire: and there were added besides unto them many like words."

The third set of originals said the same thing, but they varied slightly. There were no doctrinal changes. Many of the Bible correctors like to point out the extremely minor variances from the KJV editions to say that there's no way God preserved His words. The truth is, God does it how He wants when He moves it from one language to another and if there are subtle non-doctrinal variances it means nothing. If what you have in Russian is translated from the English KJV then it doesn't matter if there are variances as long as the doctrine is the same it is the infallible word of God.

[John81]

For myself, what I stand upon is the fact that God specifically directed me to the KJB.

[anime4christ]

@Rick: The RST was translated from the Masoratic Text and the Textus Receptus, using also an old Slavonic translation for reference, like they used the Geneva Bible and several others for reference when translating the KJV.

[JerryNumbers]

For myself, what I stand upon is the fact that God specifically directed me to the KJB.

The KJ is the only Bible I have every used, its never seemed broken, so I have seen no need of changing or updating it, its far from being like a car and or house having a need of being updated from time to time.

[DennisD]

Was told by one of our Russian missionaries he preaches in Russian from the Synododal translated from the Majority Text in the mid 1800's he believes.

[Brother Rick]

@Rick: The RST was translated from the Masoratic Text and the Textus Receptus, using also an old Slavonic translation for reference, like they used the Geneva Bible and several others for reference when translating the KJV.

Interesting! In that case, so long as it doesn't have any doctrinal issues/complete contradictions to the KJV I would use it with full and absolute confidence.

[1Timothy115]

I believe the original texts are the divinely inspired Word of God in its entirety, written by men as they were moved by the Holy Spirit, and that it is the sole authority for the Christian's faith and conduct. I believe the King James Version of the Bible is the preserved Word of God for teaching and preaching to English speaking people. This is what I will use when I quote scripture. I believe other English translations contain the Word of God including the latest Roman Church, Douay, authorized version, The New American Bible, Saint Joseph Edition. (2 Timothy 3.16-17; 2 Peter 1.20-21)

...the 1769 KJV fits me and I believe God is honored that I have it settled.

Besides the above...I cannot submit to memory the newer EVs. It's too much like casual conversation which, lends to discard or minimalize a great percentage when someone is speaking. We have to remember this is God speaking to us and answering questions we have so, casual, discard, or minimalism are not options. The KJB makes me pause and think about the meaning also; in many cases I look up meaning. It causes me to meditate on God's Word and I know that pleases Him. (2 Timothy 3:15)

[Brother Rick]

Amen Brother Dave, well put!