A TOUGH CALL

[John81]

Some of you may have heard the latest: the pastor has called off the burning, and is supposedly meeting with the immam who desires to build the mosque.

If this is the case Muslims will see this as a great victory, thanks to the media hyping the story, and they will be that much more emboldened to push against what they see as weak American Christians.

[Invicta]

That was the prOBlem from the beginning. You couldn't win. Th pastor, if he was a Christian, had only authority to preach the gospel, outside the church.

The Anglican church gets itself into similar scrapes because it interferes in matters that don't concern it.

[Annie]

That was the prOBlem from the beginning. You couldn't win.

Right, Invicta. This man got himself into a no-win situation when he decided to burn Korans. This is a case in point of a major prOBlem with charismatic (noncessationist) theology...God can "tell" you to do things...and then--oops--maybe He didn't after all. Not a good reflection on Christ or the gospel. Maybe other pastors who have been prone to outrageous behavior will take notice and learn something (not holding my breath).

[irishman]

Well we have been backed down again; a victory for the Muslims as they creep forward for world dominance.

"All's well that ends well"?

[John81]

This morning the news is saying that two FBI agents visited the pastor and convinced him to not hold the burning. The FBI refused to comment upon what they said or what was discussed. Hmmmm...

[Annie]

Well we have been backed down again; a victory for the Muslims as they creep forward for world dominance.

Irishman, how have we "been backed down"? (Or maybe I should ask, "Who do you mean by we?") This man (not "we") placed himself in a no-win situation when he acted outside God's will for Christian pastors and "took a dog by the ears," as Proverbs says. To my knowledge, his planned actions found little or no support from Christians.

"All's well that ends well"?

Irishman, ultimately nothing on this sin-cursed earth "ends well." That's why I'm glad my home is in heaven!

If this is the case Muslims will see this as a great victory, thanks to the media hyping the story, and they will be that much more emboldened to push against what they see as weak American Christians.

John, if the Muslims see this as a "great victory," then they are (as you say) revealing that they are as susceptible to media propaganda as most Americans. And, you have to admit, American Christians are indeed weak. The American church has given itself over to apathy, ease, market-driven gimmicks, and watered-down gospel. The thing is that Muslims don't have the correct perspective on this, either. To them, it's about a "holy war"...Muslims vs. Christians and Jews. But, although America was founded on Judeo-Christian principles, it can hardly be called a "Christian" nation today. Muslims might think they are "winning" against Christianity...kind of like a young kid thinks he is "winning" a card game in which all of the other (adult) players are only pretending to try hard. American Christianity (talking mainstream Christianity) is already tottering on the brink of disaster. It will take a lot less than a jihad to push it off the cliff.

This pastor may have been well-meaning, but he has certainly damaged the cause of Christ. I feel sorry for him, as he seems to have been deceived by his own false doctrine. That's where his "weakness" lay...not in the fact that he changed his mind about the burning.


EDITED TO ADD: Found this online "quiz" perfectly representative of the kind of political, "thought-police" nonsense that forms the basis for how most (unsuspecting, unthinking) Americans categorize this kind of thing in their minds:


Take our Poll
Burning questions
Do you agree with a Florida church's plan to burn Korans in protest on the anniversary of Sept. 11?

Yes, it's freedom of speech.
No, it's hate, pure and simple.
Who cares what one tiny church in Florida does?

How 'bout..."none of the above."



Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2010/09/09/2010-09-09_rev_terry_jones_koran_burning_rally_is_security_risk_for_americans_interpol_fbi_.html#ixzz0z8FYRZZL Edited September 10, 2010 by Annie

[trc123]

This pastor may have been well-meaning, but he has certainly damaged the cause of Christ. I feel sorry for him, as he seems to have been deceived by his own false doctrine. That's where his "weakness" lay...not in the fact that he changed his mind about the burning.

I would add, that it is not weakness to change one's mind about doing the wrong thing. To insist on going forward with an action, even though you now know it to be wrong, is called pride and stubbornness in the Bible.

[HappyChristian]

The papers are full of his mind change...and perhaps another mind change. He claims his decision to not burn the korans came from meeting the imam in FL, who supposedly promised that the location for the mosque in NY would be moved...He says there are witnesses to that fact, and that they were (he and the FL imam) going to be in NY on 9/11 for the activities there.

The imam in NY (who wants to bring all religions together and so is planning worship space for Jews and Christians in his mosque) says he's not changing his plans and never said he would...

The imam in FL says he didn't promise to get it moved but that he would do what he could to influence a move...

The pastor is claiming he was lied to and may go ahead with the burning....

And then the pastor emphatically stated that NO ONE else should burn any korans. *scratching head in confusion* Wait a minute: if it's a good idea for him, why not anyone else?

I don't see his initial change of mind as being weak. But once he stated he wouldn't do it, and then came back and said he might, he began to sound petulant to me. I'm thinking he likes the publicity....

[trc123]

The papers are full of his mind change...and perhaps another mind change. He claims his decision to not burn the korans came from meeting the imam in FL, who supposedly promised that the location for the mosque in NY would be moved...He says there are witnesses to that fact, and that they were (he and the FL imam) going to be in NY on 9/11 for the activities there.

The imam in NY (who wants to bring all religions together and so is planning worship space for Jews and Christians in his mosque) says he's not changing his plans and never said he would...

The imam in FL says he didn't promise to get it moved but that he would do what he could to influence a move...

The pastor is claiming he was lied to and may go ahead with the burning....

And then the pastor emphatically stated that NO ONE else should burn any korans. *scratching head in confusion* Wait a minute: if it's a good idea for him, why not anyone else?

I don't see his initial change of mind as being weak. But once he stated he wouldn't do it, and then came back and said he might, he began to sound petulant to me. I'm thinking he likes the publicity....

Understood.

Also, someone's lying.......I know who my money's on!

[John81]

I don't know if anyone said the pastor changing his mind was weak, but Muslims around the world will takt it as a sign of weakness; and moreso they will take the overwhelming outcry against the pastor by so many American leaders and supposed Christian leaders as weakness.

As I've said all along, I don't think this pastor went about any of this in a good or right way. That said, had the media not turned this unknown pastor from a tiny church with a small burning planned, into a major media story there never would have been an international spectacle.

[JerryNumbers]

Understood.

Also, someone's lying.......I know who my money's on!

Who?

[trc123]

Who?

The one who's religious beliefs allows his "brethren" to strap on explosive vests; lying and pretending to be a groups friend and then blowing them up on a suicide attack on innocent men, women and children. That's who my money's on as a prime candidate to be lying.

[Invicta]

On again, last I heard.

If this man is a Christian, his jOB is to preach the gospel to these people, nothing else.

[JerryNumbers]

The one who's religious beliefs allows his "brethren" to strap on explosive vests; lying and pretending to be a groups friend and then blowing them up on a suicide attack on innocent men, women and children. That's who my money's on as a prime candidate to be lying.

Thanks for the answer, I thought that is what you meant. I surely hope it we not the pastor from Florida lying.

[JerryNumbers]

Hyping Koran-burning pastor? It’s unfortunate but necessary
September 11, 2010

THE HIGH-POWERED attention being directed at Florida pastor Terry Jones — a backwater extremist whose prominence derives solely from his plan to burn the Koran — is painful to most Americans. more

And they call this man an extremist, yet the extremest teaching are contained only in the koran he spoke of burning and by those who put this man down for burning this book written by man about a false god that teaches hate toward those who walk with Jesus Christ. It also teaches them to murder Christians if they refuse to convert to Islam.