The NIV's Got Ghosts!

[Jerry]

We had a staff meeting today at the Gospel Mission, and the message was based on Luke 24. The Director quoted this verse in the NIV:

Luke 24:39
Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have.

This is what the KJV has:
Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

A spirit is a creature without a body - not necessarily something that has died. God is a Spirit, angels are spirits, and those in Heaven are referred to as the spirits of just men made perfect. Here Jesus is stating that a spirit does not have a body, does not have flesh and bones. A ghost (in most usages) is someone that has died and their spirit comes back from the dead - they are without a body.

There is no such thing as a ghost in that sense - everyone that has died is in Heaven or Hell awaiting the resurrection of life or damnation. Yet, the NIV Jesus affirms that there are such things as ghosts! I just thought that was a change/difference worth noting.

[Will]

We had a staff meeting today at the Gospel Mission, and the message was based on Luke 24. The Director quoted this verse in the NIV:

Luke 24:39
Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have.

This is what the KJV has:
Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

A spirit is a creature without a body - not necessarily something that has died. God is a Spirit, angels are spirits, and those in Heaven are referred to as the spirits of just men made perfect. Here Jesus is stating that a spirit does not have a body, does not have flesh and bones. A ghost (in most usages) is someone that has died and their spirit comes back from the dead - they are without a body.

There is no such thing as a ghost in that sense - everyone that has died is in Heaven or Hell awaiting the resurrection of life or damnation. Yet, the NIV Jesus affirms that there are such things as ghosts! I just thought that was a change/difference worth noting.

Hmmmm...On first glance, I'm thinking there's nothing inherently wrong with this. After all, the disciples would likely be thinking they were looking at a "ghost."

[Jerry]

Maybe they thought that in their ignorance - maybe they didn't. HOWEVER, the Bible does not teach there is such a thing as a ghost - YET, here you have Jesus in the NIV declaring there is such a thing. That is the problem. It is one thing when fallen man believes a myth or superstition, it is quite another thing to have God Almighty declaring it as such. See the problem?

[Will]

Maybe they thought that in their ignorance - maybe they didn't. HOWEVER, the Bible does not teach there is such a thing as a ghost - YET, here you have Jesus in the NIV declaring there is such a thing. That is the problem. It is one thing when fallen man believes a myth or superstition, it is quite another thing to have God Almighty declaring it as such. See the problem?

I don't think Jesus is stating that there is such a thing as ghosts. It would be like me walking into a dark room and scaring somebody else and me saying "Hey, I'm not the boogeyman." I'm not saying that the boogeyman exists, I'm just saying "Hey, don't be scared, it's just me, not some monster."

[dwayner79]

Holy Ghost - used 89 times in the KJV. Ghost and spirit are interchangable. This is a weak one.

[Psalms18_28]

I don't think Jesus is stating that there is such a thing as ghosts. It would be like me walking into a dark room and scaring somebody else and me saying "Hey, I'm not the boogeyman." I'm not saying that the boogeyman exists, I'm just saying "Hey, don't be scared, it's just me, not some monster."

. He is trying to show that he did in fact, rose from the dead, and all in flesh and bone (and notice that he didn't mention blood). He was in a uncorruptible body, and this what we will have too.

[Anon]

Holy Ghost - used 89 times in the KJV. Ghost and spirit are interchangable. This is a weak one.

I don't believe in the NIV but I have to agree with this because also doesn't the KJV say "and he gave up the ghost" meaning spirit?

[kevinmiller]

Holy Ghost - used 89 times in the KJV. Ghost and spirit are interchangable. This is a weak one.

Even though I don't agree with the NIV, I too agree that it is a weak argument to use.

P.S. Thanks for posting Suzy. I knew I wouldn't get flamed if a moderator said it first. :lol:

[pneu-engine]

The argument is neither weak nor is it unfounded.

When the KJV says spirit, it means spirit, and when it says ghost it means ghost. There is a very grave error we human creatures engage in when we second-guess God and re-arrange and interchange His Words and placements of His Words. It is a very eggregious wrong to be doing this and the studious Bible scholar will avoid it at all costs.

[kevinmiller]

Yes, it means ghost when it says it and spirit when it says it. But if they are both the exact same words, how can it be used for an argument against the NIV when they can be used interchangeably?

[pneu-engine]

Yes, it means ghost when it says it and spirit when it says it. But if they are both the exact same words, how can it be used for an argument against the NIV when they can be used interchangeably?

Show me how they are the same words. :smile

[Anon]

Well...what does it mean when the Bible says "And he gave up the ghost" and "Father into thy hands I commend my spirit?"

[Jerry]

Weak argurment for what? I was pointing out something that bothered me the other day. Yes, the KJV refers to the Holy Ghost, and in various places ghost and spirit are used interchangeably - but in the passage that I am pointing out the NIV context makes it as though Jesus Himself is confirming the existence of ghosts - ie. dead spirits coming back.

In the KJV, He is stating He is not a spirit - but that He had a body; however, the NIV says He is not like a ghost which has... therefore stating there are such things as ghosts. Seems a pretty logical conclusion to make from the context.

[dwayner79]

I see clearer why that bothered you.

I disagree with your assessment, but I see why it may cause someone to question it.

[anime4christ]

Russians get off easier I guess, we just use the word "д