The Gift Of God

[Jerry]

I am curious, how many here have heard preachers say the gift of God is faith, rather than the gift of God being salvation?

Saying faith is the gift of God sounds more like Calvinism - God choosing who would be saved or not, rather than making salvation available to all who will receive it by faith.

I am mentioning this because on Sunday a preacher in my church said this. Earlier in the same sermon (I think it was) he made one other main point that was definitely teaching Calvinism (the Holy Spirit quickening the lost so they can receive the Gospel - stated several different ways - basically stating that we are regenerated so we can be born again). Because it was the Sunday School hour, there was space for interacting with the preaching so I was able to say something and correct what he was stating. He then backed off, basically claiming wrong/bad word choices in his explanation. But this morning I remembered this other thing he said as well, so I am listening to the sermon that I recorded on my phone. I have not gotten to the part where he was referring to the gift of God yet, but I heard clearly again earlier in the sermon where he referred to this idea of man being made alive (ie. first) so he could receive the Gospel, though it was only one sentence, so I didn't catch it on Sunday).

And he made another comment from Jude when I was speaking to him before we prayed after service about something in Jude, and he referred to the word ordained in verse 4, stating that God chose that these false teachers would come into the churches (by way of testing, I think was what he was stating, but I was focussed more on the other part), that He ordained particular people to be false teachers and given over to His condemnation - rather than ordaining that any false teacher creeping into the church would be condemned. In other words, God chose those particular people to reject the faith and teach falsehoods that would damn them and potentially others.

Has anyone else seen Calvinism creep in this way into churches? The only good thing I can see here is my pastor will be back on April 3rd on. He has not been able to cross the border to come up and preach in our church since all these Covid restrictions started. Yes, he could have crossed the border into Canada in the last few months, but it is him, his wife, and son, and they would have had to pay $200 each for every border crossing into Canada. Now it seems they have removed that requirement and, Lord willing, he should be back in 1 1/2 weeks.

[BrotherTony]

I've heard this preached many times, and it's ALWAYS in a church pastored by Calvinist doctrine. We've only been a member of one church that taught this, and though we didn't particularly agree with it, it was a soulwinning church and the Lord had placed us there. We were there for a little over two years before the doctrine became so strongly entrenched in Calvinism that some of the people asked why we had to go soulwinning any longer if God had already chosen certain people to be saved...the visitation program was dropped, as was the bus ministry, and we felt led to leave. It's not Scriptural, and I can't back the doctrine, though I have many friends who ARE Calvinists. 

[Napsterdad]

This certainly does sound Calvinistic. Fortunately I have not been subject to Calvinism in the various churches I have been a member of. Nor in those I have visited (during the short time I was in them).

29 minutes ago, Jerry said:

I am curious, how many here have heard preachers say the gift of God is faith, rather than the gift of God being salvation?

 

This is an interesting take on things. It certainly doesn't read well when juxtaposed against verses like John 3:16, Romans 6:23. Ephesians 2:8, etc.

It did get me thinking, however. Salvation is THE ultimate gift of God, but the gift of salvation is really kind of like a Russian nesting doll. Once you open that initial gift, the gifts just keep on coming: charity, faith, hope, joy, etc.

[Jerry]

According to Romans, the gift is eternal life (ie. salvation) - and John 3:16 says Jesus Christ is who the Father gave (therefore a gift), but stating faith is the gift implies it is only GIVEN to those whom God chooses. All that we need for salvation comes through the Lord Jesus Christ, the ultimate gift.

My regular pastor has never said anything wacky or attempted in any way to bring in false doctrine - but this preacher from our church that has stepped up to fill the pulpit and lead the services while our pastor is away has said several questionable things over the last couple of months. Usually he clarifies or fixes what he is saying when we talk about it during the service (usually Sunday School or Wednesday night as those are the services where we can interact with what he is saying). But the fact that he has recommended questionable authors and youtube channels and keeps bringing in stuff that seems off (or outright is off), really causes me concern.

[Hugh_Flower]

The only time I hear it being a gift is when we ask for more ( after being saved ) but I think maybe that’s a fruit.  
 

[Jerry]

Yes, one of the fruit of the Spirit is faith. When we walk with the Lord, our faith grows - of course, it grows as we keep reading and studying the Word of God. See Romans 10:17 and Galatians 5:22-23.

But faith for salvation comes through hearing the Gospel. It is our response to what God has says. We place faith in His Word, in the truth, and He saves us. God doesn't give us the faith, He gives us the Gospel, and we respond in faith. The other way the Calvinists state it is putting the cart before the horse.

[TheGloryLand]

6 hours ago, Jerry said:

I am curious, how many here have heard preachers say the gift of God is faith, rather than the gift of God being salvation?

Saying faith is the gift of God sounds more like Calvinism - God choosing who would be saved or not, rather than making salvation available to all who will receive it by faith.

I am mentioning this because on Sunday a preacher in my church said this. Earlier in the same sermon (I think it was) he made one other main point that was definitely teaching Calvinism (the Holy Spirit quickening the lost so they can receive the Gospel - stated several different ways - basically stating that we are regenerated so we can be born again). Because it was the Sunday School hour, there was space for interacting with the preaching so I was able to say something and correct what he was stating. He then backed off, basically claiming wrong/bad word choices in his explanation. But this morning I remembered this other thing he said as well, so I am listening to the sermon that I recorded on my phone. I have not gotten to the part where he was referring to the gift of God yet, but I heard clearly again earlier in the sermon where he referred to this idea of man being made alive (ie. first) so he could receive the Gospel, though it was only one sentence, so I didn't catch it on Sunday).

And he made another comment from Jude when I was speaking to him before we prayed after service about something in Jude, and he referred to the word ordained in verse 4, stating that God chose that these false teachers would come into the churches (by way of testing, I think was what he was stating, but I was focussed more on the other part), that He ordained particular people to be false teachers and given over to His condemnation - rather than ordaining that any false teacher creeping into the church would be condemned. In other words, God chose those particular people to reject the faith and teach falsehoods that would damn them and potentially others.

Has anyone else seen Calvinism creep in this way into churches? The only good thing I can see here is my pastor will be back on April 3rd on. He has not been able to cross the border to come up and preach in our church since all these Covid restrictions started. Yes, he could have crossed the border into Canada in the last few months, but it is him, his wife, and son, and they would have had to pay $200 each for every border crossing into Canada. Now it seems they have removed that requirement and, Lord willing, he should be back in 1 1/2 weeks.

I never heard faith is the gift of God. 

Heb.11

[1] Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

[Jerry]

I think they get it from this passage:

Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

But from Romans 6:23 and John 3:16 and other places, we know the gift is salvation. I have read Calvinistic authors, such as MacArthur, Pink, and some others state that the gift is faith (ie. the faith to believe and receive the Gospel).

[SureWord]

Salvation in Christ is the gift but anyone lacking faith can ask God for faith or help to believe. Mark 9:24. So in a sense that is a gift also.

This would not suggest there's no freewill.

[MikeWatson1]

There is of course the spiritual gift of faith,  with hope and love also.. as seen in Corinthians.

Ththis though I think would be an outcome of being saved first rather than being given the gift of faith and then being converted 

[Jerry]

The Bible speaks about faith, hope, and love, but does not state they are gifts. It does state that charity/love is greater than all the sign gifts, and that these three things you mentioned remain after the sign gifts are done away with.

1 Corinthians 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

[MikeWatson1]

Wouldn't christian faith, hope and love be gifts because they are supernaturally given and empowered? 

But yeah..  sign and ministry gifts have also done their job and not for today like you say.

[1Timothy115]

I have a study of gifts I did in 2011. 

 

Gifts of Spirit and of Grace (Edits).docx