Did Curtis Hutson teach that Repentance is a work like Steven Anderson?

[mbkjpreacher]

On 7/7/2020 at 10:08 PM, Ukulelemike said:

The big issue with repentance is that it is two-fold in nature: at salvation, we repent in our hearts of SIN, not sins, plural, but sin, the very concept of it. That is part of confession of our sin, which is necessary for salvation, not confessing our sins, plural, because we could never do that; rather, we confess that we are sinners, that we sin, the very fact of it, and so, repent, or turn from that life of sin, in the heart.

Once we are saved, then the repentance of sins, plural, the work, begins, as we grow in grace and understanding of what are specifically sins in our lives, and we turn actively from them to follow the Lord.  As mbkjpreacher said above, in Nineveh, they were repentant in heart, and their actions, the fruit of repentance, then followed. 

Right !

Jonah 3: 10 does not teach repentance of sin is a work, rather the work is the fruit of repentance of sin.  

[Ukulelemike]

On 7/7/2020 at 7:33 AM, Scott Lyons said:

This is WORKS! It is Lordship Salvation! Repentance is from the Greek word Metanoia which means to change one's mind or thinking. Not repent of sin, repent of sins, turn from sin, turn from sins, none of that as those are all WORKS!

Wrong. Or you misunderstand what I was saying. To repent means to change one's mind, yes-that is what happens at salvation. But action, after salvation, is the fruit, the proof of that repentance. Faith of the heart should always be accompanied by action. Abraham was justified because he believed God, BUT, his works of faith justified him, as well. In faith, his faith declared him righteous, and then his works also declared him righteous-one of the heart, the other of action. In repentance, we repent in faith unto salvation, and when saved, we put that repentance to work. It is not a work for salvation, but OF salvation.

[Scott Lyons]

3 hours ago, Ukulelemike said:

Wrong. Or you misunderstand what I was saying. To repent means to change one's mind, yes-that is what happens at salvation. But action, after salvation, is the fruit, the proof of that repentance. Faith of the heart should always be accompanied by action. Abraham was justified because he believed God, BUT, his works of faith justified him, as well. In faith, his faith declared him righteous, and then his works also declared him righteous-one of the heart, the other of action. In repentance, we repent in faith unto salvation, and when saved, we put that repentance to work. It is not a work for salvation, but OF salvation.

That isn't what you posted in your OP! What you posted in your OP is Lordship Salvation, it is works and is heresy, a false gospel! Nice try though!

[Jim_Alaska]

Biblical Salvation stands alone; there is no such thing as "Lordship Salvation". Biblical salvation has always included repentance. The Scripture I quoted above shows this to be true. Repentance and faith, or belief; always in this order Biblically. As such, it is not a "work", but rather an integral part of salvation.

[Scott Lyons]

15 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said:

Biblical Salvation stands alone; there is no such thing as "Lordship Salvation". Biblical salvation has always included repentance. The Scripture I quoted above shows this to be true. Repentance and faith, or belief; always in this order Biblically. As such, it is not a "work", but rather an integral part of salvation.

I never said it wasn't. The problem is you have a wrong definition of repentance which results in works! Repentance is simply a change of mind, period. It is not turning from sin or repenting of sin. Your definition is what John MacArthur teaches and he is the posterboy for Lordship Salvation. So instead of saying that it isn't Lordship Salvation, why don't you research it for yourself? God bless!

[Scott Lyons]

[Jim_Alaska]

Bro. Scott, you have been asked a number of times what a person is repenting of and have yet to answer. So, I pose the question once more; what is a person repenting of if he repents?

I did not say it was not Lordship Salvation. The sentence stands alone; "there is no such thing as Lordship Salvation".
I do not teach it and go on record that it is not only a misnomer, it simply does not exist, it is an invention of the mind of man.

[John Young]

15 hours ago, Scott Lyons said:

you have a wrong definition of repentance which results in works! Repentance is simply a change of mind, period. It is not turning from sin or repenting of sin.

Actually the definition you are applying isn't the definition of repentance. The issue is taking the general definition of the Greek word that means "change of mind", equating that definition to simply a turning of the mind, and then applying that definition to the biblical context to claim the English word Repentance as used in the bible just means a mere turning of ones mind.

Repentance is not not simply a change of mind about facts and figures or one object to another but also one of changing the heart towards whom one is repenting. I agree with you that repentance in salvation is not a turning from the acts of sins but rather Repentance is the change of one's heart towards God. 

In repentance the proud spirit is humbled and the haughty heart is brought low. Repentance towards God deals with rebellion and opposition and turns it to submission and allegiance.

In this  a sinner realizes he cannot turn from his acts of sin by himself but that he can submit to God and that submission will save him from his sin. This is why almost every gospel presentation begins with the individual needing to realize they are a sinner in opposition to God. Turning from acts of sin and promising to be good is not repentance but true repentance (submitting and humbling one's self in heart and mind) will deal with his sin.

Psalm 34:18 The Lord is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.

Psalm 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Isaiah 2:11 The lofty looks of man shall be humbled, and the haughtiness of men shall be bowed down, and the Lord alone shall be exalted in that day.

James 4:6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

1 Peter 5:5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.

Edited July 11, 2020 by John Young

[Scott Lyons]

On 7/11/2020 at 12:39 AM, John Young said:

Actually the definition you are applying isn't the definition of repentance. The issue is taking the general definition of the Greek word that means "change of mind", equating that definition to simply a turning of the mind, and then applying that definition to the biblical context to claim the English word Repentance as used in the bible just means a mere turning of ones mind.

Repentance is not not simply a change of mind about facts and figures or one object to another but also one of changing the heart towards whom one is repenting. I agree with you that repentance in salvation is not a turning from the acts of sins but rather Repentance is the change of one's heart towards God. 

In repentance the proud spirit is humbled and the haughty heart is brought low. Repentance towards God deals with rebellion and opposition and turns it to submission and allegiance.

In this  a sinner realizes he cannot turn from his acts of sin by himself but that he can submit to God and that submission will save him from his sin. This is why almost every gospel presentation begins with the individual needing to realize they are a sinner in opposition to God. Turning from acts of sin and promising to be good is not repentance but true repentance (submitting and humbling one's self in heart and mind) will deal with his sin.

Psalm 34:18 The Lord is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit.

Psalm 51:17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.

Isaiah 2:11 The lofty looks of man shall be humbled, and the haughtiness of men shall be bowed down, and the Lord alone shall be exalted in that day.

James 4:6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

1 Peter 5:5 Likewise, ye younger, submit yourselves unto the elder. Yea, all of you be subject one to another, and be clothed with humility: for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble.

Submission as a requirement for salvation is works as well! That is Lordship Salvation and is a false gospel! So your definition of repentance is wrong as well my friend.

[John Young]

2 hours ago, Scott Lyons said:

Submission as a requirement for salvation is works as well!

Not when God causes it by His grace. What do you think is meant by submission to God? Rebellion and pride and self righteousness is work, not submission to God. Submission is the opposite of self work! its letting go and allowing God to have his way. First by submitting to Him in the matter and manor of salvation (by God's grace thru faith in Christ, not of our own way or works of righteousness) and then in the matter of daily cleansing from sin through submitting to the Spirit of His Word.

Romans 10:1-4 Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. 2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth. [Submission brings salvation!]

Edited July 12, 2020 by John Young

[Ukulelemike]

On 7/9/2020 at 2:28 PM, Scott Lyons said:

That isn't what you posted in your OP! What you posted in your OP is Lordship Salvation, it is works and is heresy, a false gospel! Nice try though!

I did nothing of the sort. Here is what I posted:

"The big issue with repentance is that it is two-fold in nature: at salvation, we repent in our hearts of SIN, not sins, plural, but sin, the very concept of it. That is part of confession of our sin, which is necessary for salvation, not confessing our sins, plural, because we could never do that; rather, we confess that we are sinners, that we sin, the very fact of it, and so, repent, or turn from that life of sin, in the heart." 

Notice AT salvation, we repent, (change our mind) about sin-not SINS, but SIN, the very concept, realizing that I am lost in sin. I need a change of heart about that, and this is repentance which is part of salvation. That is not a work. The work comes AFTER salvation, it is a fruit. 

So tell me, which part is Lordship salvation?

"There were present at that season some that told him of the Galilaeans, whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices.  And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things? I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish. Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?  I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish."  (Luke 13:1-5)  Seems here that Jesus, in context, is clearly speaking of the necessity or repentance from sin.