Know of any cities in need of Baptist church?

[Guest Guest]

That can happen too!

Some threads reach an end point where the OP is dealt with and another good topic comes up and the thread carries on very well for awhile on the new topic.

Yeah, and sometimes off topic things distract from a thread or create confusion too.

It just depends on the thread I guess.

Imagine how many threads there would be on OB if every time someone had an off topic thought they started a new thread! :-S

True! I can't even follow the ones posted already. :lol

[John81]

Yeah, it can get real busy around here sometimes! It gets really bad when it's busy and you can't check in very often and you find there are a couple dozen threads with several posts each that are new! :eek

[Guest Guest]

So, true!

That is what happens to me---when I am taking my hiatuses. LOL. Actually, I am busy with other things. They come in "bunches" with me.

[kevinmiller]

I suspect that would mean there are no Biblical reasons and only "Frank Garlock" reasons..............(for John81' date=' Frank Garlock is a well known Christian musician and writer who has authored the series "Pop goes the music" in which he condemns all Christian music with a beat, founder of Majesty Music and father-in-law of Patch the Pirate).[/quote']
I agree. The only thing that moving the discussion to the IFB forum would do is to eliminate any fair look at the issue. In the absence of Scripture, people use clever arguments and talking points, much like the many things that Catholics have created and could apply to any man-made tradition. Without opposition, these beliefs can hold up in one's mind. That is why the Catholic church worked so hard and long to stifle opposition, because it led to a mass rejection of Catholic beliefs.

[John81]

Well, y'all can say whether or not you believe drums are good, bad neutral or what.

I certainly agree that drums played loudly are a distraction, but I believe the same thing about any instrument played so loudly the message of the song is lost; or in some cases where pastors have background music, the message of the sermon is lost.

Are drums evil? Can drums be played in an evil manner? Can they be played in an acceptable manner?

There are some who believe that candles are evil because they are used in witchcraft. They claim demons inhabit the candles and when they are lit the demons somehow are released in the smoke and can invade ones home and do whatever to those there.

Is this what the drum argument comes down to OR is there more to it?

There are pastors who claim if a pastor wears a colored (non-white) shirt to preach then there is something wrong with them. Some hold this position rather mildly while others are so militant about it they wouldn't allow the best pastor they knew to preach from their pulpit if he showed up wearing a non-white shirt under his suit jacket.

So, there are plenty of "traditions" in various churches, but what about the drum issue? Are there sound biblical reasons to abstain from anything to do with drums or not?

[trc123]

[quote="kevinmiller"][quote="trc123"]I suspect that would mean there are no Biblical reasons and only "Frank Garlock" reasons..............(for John81, Frank Garlock is a well known Christian musician and writer who has authored the series "Pop goes the music" in which he condemns all Christian music with a beat, founder of Majesty Music and father-in-law of Patch the Pirate).[/quote]
I agree. The only thing that moving the discussion to the IFB forum would do is to eliminate any fair look at the issue. In the absence of Scripture, people use clever arguments and talking points, much like the many things that Catholics have created and could apply to any man-made tradition. Without opposition, these beliefs can hold up in one's mind. That is why the Catholic church worked so hard and long to stifle opposition, because it led to a mass rejection of Catholic beliefs.[/quote]

John81 has created a post for this subject in the IFB forum.

I'm not arguing that there should be drums in a church service or even a worship concert that are "rock'n roll" in nature. Thus far, I've never seen in the Scriptures where they are specifically forbidden though.........I'd like to see those Scriptures.

[kevinmiller]

I can't see the IFB forum. I used to be against drums in music but realized that there wasn't any Scripture to support it. The fact is, since the Bible is silent on the issue, it can be nothing more than a personal standard and certainly not a sin. It is the meat-offered-to-idols of our day. Many people have problems with it's associations, just like many of the Jews had problems with the association of the meat that was offered to pagan idols. However, Paul made it clear that there was nothing wrong with eating it, so long as it was not offensive to another Christian.

[HappyChristian]

I already posted in the IFB forum (BTW, Kevin, I don't think your assessment of a discussion being unfair because it's posted there is correct! Nor was it very kind :cooldude: ).

I don't have a problem with drums if used in the right way. We have drums in our orchestra, and no-one could say that we play ungodly music. Well, yes, people could SAY so, but they'd be wrong! :Green The music glorifies God and uplifts the people...and isn't that what it's supposed to do?

[kevinmiller]

Yes, but why can't music with a drum set glorify God if the focus of the music is on worshiping God?

[HappyChristian]

Yes' date=' but why can't music with a drum set glorify God if the focus of the music is on worshiping God?[/quote']
Did I say it couldn't? Or give the impression that it can't? (didn't mean to, if I did!) Although, to me, a "drum set" smacks too much of Ringo Starr and the drummers that followed him. I don't really see the necessity of a church having their music area set up like a rock concert. To me, that sets a mood that is more fleshly than spiritual. I've been to many churches that are like that.

We have a kettle drum, and a snare drum (I used the wrong terms in the IFB forum) in our orchestra, and they work well. They add to the beautiful music our orchestra plays - no instruments, unless they are playing a solo, outdo the others - they blend wonderfully.

[kevinmiller]

Fair enough. :smile
I agree that church can become to focused on one's feelings and the flesh. Although, that can happen with or without the presence of a drum set. If it is your or anyone else's preference to not have them in church, I can respect that. Because of its past associations, it can be offensive to many people just like the meat was offensive to many Jews.

[HappyChristian]

Absolutely!! The presence or absence of a drum does not indicate spirituality of a church. I do think the usage of it does, though! :Green

Let me explain - I don't find it offensive, per se. I'm not going to get derailed in my Christian walk and become bitter if someone uses a drum set in their services. But I have to say - the churches I know of (and here again - it's from personal experience, and others may have had different experience) that have drum sets, set their music areas up to look like rock concert stages - some even going so far as to having the smoke and colored lights, etc. This is pandering to the flesh, and does not promote real worship...as you said in your first statement, it focuses on feelings and flesh. Now, don't get me wrong - feelings are usually stirred in worship, and music is a large part of that. But I think we can all agree that the feelings that fleshly music stirs up are much different than the feelings that spiritual music stirs up! :Green

It is up to each church to make that decision, following the dictates of the Holy Spirit. But, personally, I think it would be the wiser part of valor (discretion, in other words) to avoid the trappings that are obviously linked with the world (i.e. rock music and rock bands...).

[Guest Guest]

It is up to each church to make that decision' date=' following the dictates of the Holy Spirit. But, personally, I think it would be the wiser part of valor (discretion, in other words) [b']to avoid the trappings that are obviously linked with the world (i.e. rock music and rock bands...).

Great posts...LuAnne!

to the highlighted area. :-)

[OLD fashioned preacher]

I can't see the IFB forum. I used to be against drums in music but realized that there wasn't any Scripture to support it. The fact is' date=' since the Bible is silent on the issue[/b'], it can be nothing more than a personal standard and certainly not a sin. It is the meat-offered-to-idols of our day. Many people have problems with it's associations, just like many of the Jews had problems with the association of the meat that was offered to pagan idols. However, Paul made it clear that there was nothing wrong with eating it, so long as it was not offensive to another Christian.

I hear this frequently (see bold, italicized, underlined portion of quote), yet that is not quite accurate.

I personally know how easy it is for a percussionist to get carried away by the flesh when playing and no longer play percussion (drum, tamborine, etc). We have piano, banjo, fiddle, harmonica, guitar, mandolin, autoharp, trumpet, and even bagpipes in our services (specials and congregationals) but no organ or drums (organs sound like a funeral).

That said - look in Ps 150 and you will find all 4 parts of an orchestra: including percussion. So it is not silent on the subject.

[John81]

Engaging posts about drums. Thank you!