Doctrines of Grace

[hermanj]

I agree with Kitagrl. I'm somewhere in between #1 and #2 (probably leaning more towards #2).

[Psalms18_28]

combination of #2 and #3 but I had to pick one didn't I? So I picked #2

[Mountainview]

2 and 3. But I could not say that I am closer to either one or the other and therefore did not actually vote for either.

[JerryNumbers]

I can't chose none of them because you use this word, prerequisites.

Grace is offered, but it has conditions, without conditions everyone would receive it, that is not the case.

One has to repent before it is offered. With out repentance there is no grace offered to anyone.

I will not go no further, you said you did not want a debate.

[Psalms18_28]

I agree, Jerry.


btw, I lead toward #1 too

1, 2, and 3.

[duttn]

I believe that the election is unconditional. God did not look down the corridor of time in order to choose whom he wanted. He chose those whom he wanted based on his sovereign will, not on sinful man. to say that man would "choose" God is false. The Bible says that man is at war with God or at enmity with Him and wants nothing to do with him. For example, this has to do with iresistable Grace. when you draw water out of a well, you must lower the bucket and woo the water in with smooth words right? WRONG! you do not talk to the water, you lower the bucket and draw it unto yourself and the water has no say so. the same is true for man. To say man has a right to refuse God means that God is ultimately not in control over everything.

[JerryNumbers]

I believe that the election is unconditional. God did not look down the corridor of time in order to choose whom he wanted. He chose those whom he wanted based on his sovereign will' date=' not on sinful man. to say that man would "choose" God is false. The Bible says that man is at war with God or at enmity with Him and wants nothing to do with him. For example, this has to do with iresistable Grace. when you draw water out of a well, you must lower the bucket and woo the water in with smooth words right? WRONG! you do not talk to the water, you lower the bucket and draw it unto yourself and the water has no say so. the same is true for man. To say man has a right to refuse God means that God is ultimately not in control over everything.[/quote']

So, you think man has no choice in the matter. That he is a robot, that God forces Himself on everyone.

[Guest Guest]

[kevinmiller]

I believe that the election is unconditional. God did not look down the corridor of time in order to choose whom he wanted. He chose those whom he wanted based on his sovereign will' date=' not on sinful man. to say that man would "choose" God is false. The Bible says that man is at war with God or at enmity with Him and wants nothing to do with him. For example, this has to do with iresistable Grace. when you draw water out of a well, you must lower the bucket and woo the water in with smooth words right? WRONG! you do not talk to the water, you lower the bucket and draw it unto yourself and the water has no say so. the same is true for man. To say man has a right to refuse God means that God is ultimately not in control over everything.[/quote']
Actually, I tend to agree with him. I would actually be more of #3 now, based on Romans 9.

V.11 For the children being not yet born, neither having done good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;

V.18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

V.21 Hath not the potter power of the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishounour?

[okjac80]

I am a Calvinist and I choose #4.
Can I explain it? No, I can't,nor will I try. God's ways are not our own. Just b/c we don't understand His will doesn't mean we can change it to human terms. Nor can we if we think His will is inconsistant.

Could someone please explain
Eph 1:5
Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will

[kevinmiller]

I am a Calvinist and I choose #4.
Can I explain it? No, I can't,nor will I try. God's ways are not our own. Just b/c we don't understand His will doesn't mean we can change it to human terms. Nor can we if we think His will is inconsistant.

Could someone please explain
Eph 1:5
Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will

You're right, God's ways are not our own, as Paul says in Romans 9.

v.19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God?

[1Timothy115]

I had some difficulty between 1 and 2. I finally landed on 1. The short def. for 1. caused me to look twice. I see from my past looking back God was availing scripture for me. So, I'm a (1.5)

1. Made it appear, God forgive me, as if you're pulling up for a fast food order, "Faith by request"...I'll have a number #1. So, just the wording.

2. Looking back, I could have chosen 2.

Romans 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Romans 5:15 But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

[Guest Guest]

God's Righteousness At Christ's Expense and that's enough for me!!!