Tragedy

[deafnva77]

There is a military school nearby where I live a boarding school too. http://www.fishburne.org I wouldn't say it is christian but here are some christian ones:

http://www.boardingschoolreview.com/chr ... chools.php

Not that I think you are interested in it , but I thought I would just let you know because I have seen military school straightened some boys up.

[John81]

That's what I thought I was hearing from your other posts--I just wanted to make sure I wasn't reading into them. I'm sorry, John, what a heartbreak it must be for you and your wife. Will pray fervently for Tim's salvation. Is your other son saved? I'm not even sure how old he is?

Our youngest son, Travis, is 10. He's not saved but he's somewhat developmentally behind so I don't think he can fully grasp the concept of salvation yet. He does know who Jesus is and what He did for us but I don't think he fully grasps it. He loves Bible stories, loves the few Bible-related DVDs we have and he loves church. Generally, he's well behaved and really hates it on the rare occasion he does get into real trouble. He's quick to repent and expresses real sorrow for doing wrong.

So yes, Tim indeed needs fervent prayer for salvation, and Travis still needs to come to Christ as well.

Your prayers are most appreciated! Thank you!!!

[John81]

There is a military school nearby where I live a boarding school too. http://www.fishburne.org I wouldn't say it is christian but here are some christian ones:

http://www.boardingschoolreview.com/chr ... chools.php

Not that I think you are interested in it , but I thought I would just let you know because I have seen military school straightened some boys up.

We had thought about a military school some time back but when we saw the cost of sending someone to those, WOW! :-S

Anyway, at this point I do believe it's his heart that really needs attention so a Christian environment is most needful.

[John81]

Unbelievable!!!

The two social worker women were here yesterday. I told them about Tim being expelled from school and why. We also received a certified letter from the school yesterday stating the official reasong for expelling him. It stated Tim had "threatened to blow up the school, shoot people and made a "hit list"". I showed this to the social workers as well. They asked what Tim's response was and I told them at first he claimed it was just a joke. Without even letting me continue, BOTH women chimed in almost in stereo, "Well, he probably was just joking". Even after I told them what the police had to say and what the principle had to say they tried to make light of the situation as if he hadn't really done anything all that wrong :puzzled:

When we mentioned considering sending him to a Christian Youth Recovery Program they claimed that was "drastic" and when they asked for examples of Tim not minding his mother my wife told them on occasions when I'm out of the house and he's supposed to be in his room doing his schoolwork, he'll continually come downstairs and mess around (often four or five times) and she (my wife) will have to tell him repeatedly and for several minutes to get back upstairs and do his work before he'll mosey back up the stairs for a bit and then come back down again and repeat the process.

The social workers response, "Well, he's 14, that's to be expected." :puzzled:

It seems to these social workers kids can do no wrong and any problems are because of the parents! They both implied that after talking with Tim about four times the past month for about 10 minutes each that they know him better than my wife, myself, our pastor or our youth pastor, and that they know what's best for him and none of us do!

There is no talking with these people, there is no reasoning with them because they are convinced the child is virtually perfect or something and the parents don't have the best interest of the child in mind.

Please continue to pray for us.

Also, I found out yesterday that part of that huge kidney stone they blasted two weeks ago is still there. Tuesday I have to go to the hospital to have dye injected into me through an IV and have more x-rays taken. Then they want to schedual me for another round of kidney stone blasting.

It really feels as if our family is under seige and we are facing almost constant bombardment.

[joyfulpraise93]

I'm so sorry!

Hopefully we can be of some encouragement to you here, John.

[1John2:15-17]

Unbelievable!!!

The two social worker women were here yesterday. I told them about Tim being expelled from school and why. We also received a certified letter from the school yesterday stating the official reasong for expelling him. It stated Tim had "threatened to blow up the school, shoot people and made a "hit list"". I showed this to the social workers as well. They asked what Tim's response was and I told them at first he claimed it was just a joke. Without even letting me continue, BOTH women chimed in almost in stereo, "Well, he probably was just joking". Even after I told them what the police had to say and what the principle had to say they tried to make light of the situation as if he hadn't really done anything all that wrong :puzzled:

When we mentioned considering sending him to a Christian Youth Recovery Program they claimed that was "drastic" and when they asked for examples of Tim not minding his mother my wife told them on occasions when I'm out of the house and he's supposed to be in his room doing his schoolwork, he'll continually come downstairs and mess around (often four or five times) and she (my wife) will have to tell him repeatedly and for several minutes to get back upstairs and do his work before he'll mosey back up the stairs for a bit and then come back down again and repeat the process.

The social workers response, "Well, he's 14, that's to be expected." :puzzled:

It seems to these social workers kids can do no wrong and any problems are because of the parents! They both implied that after talking with Tim about four times the past month for about 10 minutes each that they know him better than my wife, myself, our pastor or our youth pastor, and that they know what's best for him and none of us do!
There is no talking with these people, there is no reasoning with them because they are convinced the child is virtually perfect or something and the parents don't have the best interest of the child in mind.

Please continue to pray for us.

Also, I found out yesterday that part of that huge kidney stone they blasted two weeks ago is still there. Tuesday I have to go to the hospital to have dye injected into me through an IV and have more x-rays taken. Then they want to schedual me for another round of kidney stone blasting.

It really feels as if our family is under seige and we are facing almost constant bombardment.

I'll keep praying for you brother. It is truly sad when the state thinks they know a child better than the parents (another sign of the endtimes?).

IMO, (and I'm still learning) I believe you are under attack (and I bet you feel the same) as Satan will try to tell you that you are wrong for following God. Satan hates true believers, but that, according to my pastor doesn't always mean he will stop attacking. If there is a "weak spot" (lack of better words for me), such the difficulties with your son, then unfortunately Satan will try to attack there. This has no reflection on you and your faith or walk with God. I believe you are trying to do the right thing and Satan is just trying to mess it up.

My ex's oldest son was in and out of our house when we were married...addicted to drugs and alcohol...in and out of jail, dropped out of high school. Some "experts" tried to tell us he was just "expressing himself" over the death of his father...however, all of that began way before that. I never bought into that line of thinking and still don't. It is just sad that the social workers reacted the way they did when you mentioned a Christian Recovery program...just shows how far Christ has been removed from so many facets of society.

Keep the faith and remain strong. God will get you through. :pray

[Anon]

Oh wow....what horrible social workers.

Have you ever considered contacting the Christian Law Association? If they try to keep you from doing what needs to be done with your son, definitely contact them to see if they can help. Or even the Homeschool Legal Defense Association. They may be able to help even more.

[deafnva77]

Terrible. If they wanted to be parents, they should just take him away.

But anyway, are they willing to let you homeschool since the school expel him?

They probably will try to justify it to the school and even explain that this kid have been abuse so give him a chance.

repeat Running away, lying about parental abuse, death list is a sure sign that he need to go to a recovery program.
Does he get in a fist fight with his brother (well, that's usually normal for brothers) ? Does he blow up and knock everything down? They may say it's drastic but did they say no you can't do that? social workers will say stuffs to make you think you are not allow to do anything.

You need to call someone. I do n't know who, but you need to have someone to tell these social workers to back off.

[Anon]

The only person who can make them back off would be some sort of lawyer or something I think....that's why I'm thinking call one of the Chrisitian law firms or something...or find someone in the area that gives free consults and ask advice. Tell the social workers next time you have a lawyer and they might think twice about how they act. Right now, they know you are at their mercy. If you want to keep your kid, they can tell you to flip backwards off a skyscraper and you'd do it....

[TheBibleSender]

Man' date=' that stinks that they ONLY believe the child, with NO evidence. Children who truly are abused as your son said would have some marks or scarring. Sad.[/quote']

Sadly I have seen this type of thing happen in my line of work with Vunerable adult and minors. It seems like when there is no evidence at all the social workers are all over it, but when their is strong complaints and evidence for abuse physical and sexual the don;t even seem to look into the matter. Anyway I will be praying John81 I just seen this topic this morning otherwise I would have responded sooner. God bless. :)

[deputydog530]

Praying John. Im soo sorry brother. Having worked around this system for over 20 years, i have seen the same thing over and over.

I have investigated homes where the kids need removed for safety and mom and dad need to be in jail. Nothing happened, (accept for waht law enforcement could do) but the kids were left in th wind so to speak.

Then i have investigated homes where there is a problem with the child but the parents are good folks and doing thier best. They are either run through the ringer or not helped at all. (seemingly your case)

The whole system is getting worse. The CLA needs to drop the hammer on these folks and get thier attention.

I feel so helpless. But our God is a mighty God and has control of all. Its easy for me to say, but look for the lesson in this from God. I may be simply to build your faith, or to help someone in the future that goes through it. i dont know. Praying for you.

[JerryNumbers]

Their much like a psychiatrist, think they can spend a few minutes talking with some one and know everything about that person.

The psychiatrists are the one who say a murdered and rapist has been cured and recommend them to be released where they can murder and rape again.

[trc123]

John,

I continue to pray for you.

You are right, the episode with the note having threatening language, resulting in police involvement and expulsion from school is very serious and to be addressed as such and should not be taken lightly by anyone (including the social workers).

Concerning the other behavior cited by your wife to the social workers, I must say that the example she gave (in my opinion) really is to be expected. That does not mean that Tim shouldn't be trained and corrected; but I don't see that particular behavior as anything other than youth and immaturity. Remember, the mind can only absorb what the seat can stand. That was our saying back when we home schooled our children. You can fight it all you want, but children have a lot of pent up energy and they will always find themselves going off task (more so the younger they are) just because all that energy is racing through their mind and bodies. They want to be moving, exploring, experiencing and such. It is not natural for children (not even most adults) to attend school for 6 to 7 hours and then want to sit another 2 or 3 hours to do more studying and they are going to push back concerning it. It is not a personal assault upon you as parents (even though it really seems like it sometimes) and your authority.

This particular behavior to me is aggravating and frustrating when you are the parent and in the middle of trying to train and get your child to "mind" you; but now sitting on this end of my life and having all these grand children and observing them with their parents and remembering how things were when they were little..................that really is the little stuff and not nearly as abnormal or rebellious as you might think.

I remember as the boys started to get older they wanted to wear their hair a little longer and one wanted his ear pierced. We fought them on it and then an older Christian couple reminded us that our children today are resisting the devil's temptations to sin by drugs, alcohol, fighting in school, fornication and the such and the least of our worries should be them having one inch more hair on their head. As far as the ear ring though..........my wife hated the idea of him getting one and I knew if we didn't even hear him out it would be a huge battle. I knew his request was driving my wife crazy and I also knew he was asking because it was pushing her buttons and that he probably wouldn't really want one and if he did he wouldn't have the patience in the long run to properly take care of it. So I (being the type who doesn't like to give someone else the satisfaction of pushing my buttons) told him he could pierce his ear as long as he did it the same way as his mother had done her's when she was a young woman. Much to my chagrin, he did! His sister got a potato, iced his ear until it was numb, placed the potato behind the ear, and put a large sewing needle through his ear! Needless to say the whole experience wasn't nearly as "cool" as he had envisioned. The ear ring was gone in one week never to return. As far as his hair, he went into the US Military and that's never been an issue either.

I said all of that to say, we had to learn to pick our battles and determine what was "childish" behavior and what was rebellion and then correct accordingly. If you think about it, this is how God deals with, corrects and disciplines we adults as well. He doesn't always come down on us like a "ton of bricks" for every thing that we do that is contrary to His Word; and he corrects differently for different infractions and circumstances.

Sorry, I got a little chatty........but I was praying for you and your family and just started to type down some thoughts as I remembered the challenges we had with our children.

I will continue to pray for you all,

TRC

P.S. Our youngest son's name is Timothy!

[deafnva77]

What John was trying to say is that he can't even train and correct his son. He's been saying that in the beginning. That nothing seem to be working. I mean do you want your child to fail school because he too rebellious?

anyway, the social workers had no rights to tell him what school his son can go. If John fear for his and his family life because he can't trust his son, he have every rights to send him to a recovery program so he can regain that trust again.

[Anon]

trc I appreciate your post, but I think John's situation is more extreme than you realize...we have been following this for awhile now, as every so often he would mention problems with his son. There is also a spiritual battle going on here too.

Also should mention that there are lots of things to say "yes" to our children...and at least in my family, having longer hair or piercing their ears (even the homemade kind LOL that was kinda funny) will never be an option for my kids.