Divorce - Remarriage & Evangelists - Missionaries

[JerryNumbers]

I suppose you know some believes that the gift of healing is still in effect, for you've got people such as Benny Hinn, Kenneth Copeland, and many more that are called faith healers. There might even be some that believe the gift of raising people from the dead is still around.

And them there is all the tongue speakers, many even calming speaking in tongues is proof one has been saved

Them in the Bible it says this.

1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

[1Timothy115]

I suppose you know some believes that the gift of healing is still in effect, for you've got people such as Benny Hinn, Kenneth Copeland, and many more that are called faith healers. There might even be some that believe the gift of raising people from the dead is still around.

And them there is all the tongue speakers, many even calming speaking in tongues is proof one has been saved

Them in the Bible it says this.

1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.

What does this have to do with the OP on Divorce - Remarriage & Evangelists - Missionaries and my reply to Seth. I think your question and comments deserve a thread of their own.

[4everHis]

We can always find a shining example for an exception to be made. We don't stand on principles and then cave on examples. A principle stands and applies to all. So, to me, evangelists, pastors, preachers and missionaries all fall under the same principles. (Would you let a woman speak in your church? No, she is unqualified. Even if she is an "evangelist". Right? The principle of having a pastor be husband of one wife should apply to evangelists and missionaries, in my reading of the Bible.) I don't understand why we always need to find the one person who should get an exemption. To me, that ALWAYS opens the door to compromise. I just read a thread on CCM by heartstrings. Everyone said, "Clearly CCM." But heartstrings said, "The Scriptures are good." You said, "Don't compromise". (Of course, I'm paraphrasing, but you get the gist.) So, why look to justify someone to serving in an area where God said, "Not eligible for this."? (Of course, divorced people can do a ton of things, and should. They just shouldn't be preaching, pastoring, missionarying etc.)

[JerryNumbers]

Is being a pastor a gift from God?

[1Timothy115]

We can always find a shining example for an exception to be made. We don't stand on principles and then cave on examples. A principle stands and applies to all. So, to me, evangelists, pastors, preachers and missionaries all fall under the same principles. (Would you let a woman speak in your church? No, she is unqualified. Even if she is an "evangelist". Right? The principle of having a pastor be husband of one wife should apply to evangelists and missionaries, in my reading of the Bible.) I don't understand why we always need to find the one person who should get an exemption. To me, that ALWAYS opens the door to compromise. I just read a thread on CCM by heartstrings. Everyone said, "Clearly CCM." But heartstrings said, "The Scriptures are good." You said, "Don't compromise". (Of course, I'm paraphrasing, but you get the gist.) So, why look to justify someone to serving in an area where God said, "Not eligible for this."? (Of course, divorced people can do a ton of things, and should. They just shouldn't be preaching, pastoring, missionarying etc.)

That's your opinion but no scripture supports your thoughts for evangelists or missionaries.

[1Timothy115]

Is being a pastor a gift from God?

Its in Ephesians 4:7-11 or read my post #13.

[4everHis]

That's your opinion but no scripture supports your thoughts for evangelists or missionaries.

Then, we differ, as I see Scripture differently than you. However, my point is simply that we can not justify our thoughts by people whom we think merit an exception. I'm not trying to engage the old "who needs to be a husband of one wife" debate. I know where I stand, I know where others stand and I leave it at that. If you have your view, base it on what Scripture says (or what you perceive it to see, no offense meant, just allowing for differences), not on what about Bro.Charlie-who-was-divorced-before-he-got-saved-and-only-against-his-will-and-he-speaks-every-native-language-fluently-in-the-country-he-wants-to-go-to-start-a-work. :icon_mrgreen:

[JerryNumbers]

I've noticed this, the way many feels about divorce has to do with people that they know that have been divorced, especially family members. Or perhaps they have even had a pastor, or deacon that has been divorce and remarried. Or even they have been divorced and remarried themselves. That seems to make them sympathetic to those who have been divorce and therefore they have a different take on what the Bible teaches.

I must admit years ago I felt different about it than I do now. The Bible is clear a person that is divorce is free to marry only after their spouse has died.

I must say this too, even though its a bit off topic. Many of our fellow Baptist that has family members, especially if its their children, that are in a church that teaches salvation by works, many of these people are very sympathetic to those churches that teaches a works based salvation, many even claiming that people in such churches are just as saved as any Baptist that believes they are save by grace though faith in Jesus.

Not saying that is the case with those disagreeing here.

[heartstrings]

We can always find a shining example for an exception to be made. We don't stand on principles and then cave on examples. A principle stands and applies to all. So, to me, evangelists, pastors, preachers and missionaries all fall under the same principles. (Would you let a woman speak in your church? No, she is unqualified. Even if she is an "evangelist". Right? The principle of having a pastor be husband of one wife should apply to evangelists and missionaries, in my reading of the Bible.) I don't understand why we always need to find the one person who should get an exemption. To me, that ALWAYS opens the door to compromise. I just read a thread on CCM by heartstrings. Everyone said, "Clearly CCM." But heartstrings said, "The Scriptures are good." You said, "Don't compromise". (Of course, I'm paraphrasing, but you get the gist.) So, why look to justify someone to serving in an area where God said, "Not eligible for this."? (Of course, divorced people can do a ton of things, and should. They just shouldn't be preaching, pastoring, missionarying etc.)

Hey friend,
If you're going to quote someone, quote the whole thing in context.

[John81]

I've noticed this, the way many feels about divorce has to do with people that they know that have been divorced, especially family members. Or perhaps they have even had a pastor, or deacon that has been divorce and remarried. Or even they have been divorced and remarried themselves. That seems to make them sympathetic to those who have been divorce and therefore they have a different take on what the Bible teaches.

I must admit years ago I felt different about it than I do now. The Bible is clear a person that is divorce is free to marry only after their spouse has died.

I must say this too, even though its a bit off topic. Many of our fellow Baptist that has family members, especially if its their children, that are in a church that teaches salvation by works, many of these people are very sympathetic to those churches that teaches a works based salvation, many even claiming that people in such churches are just as saved as any Baptist that believes they are save by grace though faith in Jesus.

Not saying that is the case with those disagreeing here.

Yes, it's sad that many Christians out there will rightly denounce Charismatics for basing much of their "faith" and stances upon personal experience while at the same time doing the exact same thing in a different context. How often I hear a Christian say they agree with the Bible about divorce, or another topic, only to follow that by saying "but..." or "except..." or something of this sort. Then they go on to explain a story about their best friend, sibling or sometimes even themselves. After telling their story they declare there are exceptions to Scripture because things don't always neatly follow what the Bible says.

There is a way to justify anything and a way to get around or deny what the Word says regarding anything, yet we are called to accept the Word as is and to live according to the Word of God, not our own experience or anything else.

[1Timothy115]

Then, we differ, as I see Scripture differently than you. However, my point is simply that we can not justify our thoughts by people whom we think merit an exception. I'm not trying to engage the old "who needs to be a husband of one wife" debate. I know where I stand, I know where others stand and I leave it at that. If you have your view, base it on what Scripture says (or what you perceive it to see, no offense meant, just allowing for differences), not on what about Bro.Charlie-who-was-divorced-before-he-got-saved-and-only-against-his-will-and-he-speaks-every-native-language-fluently-in-the-country-he-wants-to-go-to-start-a-work.

What scripture exactly do you see differently? I'm still looking for someone to give one scripture which precludes the divorced/remarried from the work of an evangelist or missionary. I would like to study those scriptures and would really like to understand if it is based on personal feeling or God's word.

[heartstrings]

Offices

Bishop
Origin:
before 900; Middle English; Old English bisc ( e ) op < Vulgar Latin *ebiscopus, for Late Latin episcopus < Greek epískopos overseer, equivalent to epi- epi- + skopós watcher; see scope

Deacon
Origin:
before 900; Middle English deken, Old English diacon < Late Latin diāconus < Greek diā́konos servant, minister, deacon, equivalent to diā- dia- + -konos service



Not listed as Offices

Evangel 1
Origin:
1300–50; Middle English < Late Latin evangelium < Greek euangélion good news ( see eu-, angel); replacing Middle English evangile < Middle French

Evangel 2
Origin:
1585–95; < Late Latin evangelus < Greek euángelos (adj.) bringing good news. See evangel 1

The words "mission", "missions", "missionary" or "missionaries" are not found in the KJB.
We are all given the command to proclaim the good news of the gospel.The "husband of one wife" is only mentioned of the "offices" of Bishops and deacons, but it is always the best for everyone.

[1Timothy115]

Offices

Bishop
Origin:
before 900; Middle English; Old English bisc ( e ) op < Vulgar Latin *ebiscopus, for Late Latin episcopus < Greek epískopos overseer, equivalent to epi- epi- + skopós watcher; see scope

Deacon
Origin:
before 900; Middle English deken, Old English diacon < Late Latin diāconus < Greek diā́konos servant, minister, deacon, equivalent to diā- dia- + -konos service



Not listed as Offices

Evangel 1
Origin:
1300–50; Middle English < Late Latin evangelium < Greek euangélion good news ( see eu-, angel); replacing Middle English evangile < Middle French

Evangel 2
Origin:
1585–95; < Late Latin evangelus < Greek euángelos (adj.) bringing good news. See evangel 1

The words "mission", "missions", "missionary" or "missionaries" are not found in the KJB.
We are all given the command to proclaim the good news of the gospel.The "husband of one wife" is only mentioned of the "offices" of Bishops and deacons, but it is always the best for everyone.

Thanks. I wish someone would come forward with the scripture they interpret as precluding divorced/remarried from sharing the good news.

[4everHis]

Hey friend,
If you're going to quote someone, quote the whole thing in context.

Sorry. For those who didn't read it, this is the quote. Not trying to take it out of context, or make it seem like you are CCM or not. My point is that in the area of music, even a song that quotes Scripture, that may even have blessed you, if it is deemed CCM, is still CCM. I am trying to communicate, albeit unsuccessfully, that principles, not feelings, should rule in every situation. (So, in music, if it's rock, but has Scripture, it would not be song you'd use, even if you knew someone who'd been blessed by it. So that if the husband of one wife verse is the principle, then even if we know the nicest guy in the world who is divorced, he has rendered himself ineligible.) My deepest apology that you felt I had misquoted, misrepresented or mis anythinged your post. Please forgive me if you are irked, vexed, angry, offended. I'm truly sorry for your offense. So here's the quote--I did copy paste, not the fancy quote feature here.

A friend of mine had a whole collection of the Maranatha albums which he loaned to me once. Alot of the songs were 'tame' like the second one, but a few were leaning heavily toward being rock music. I will say, though, that the ones which quote scripture, expecially the Psalms, did bless me when I listened to them. I like "As the Deer" and see nothing wrong with it except maybe tweaking the words to line up with the KJB. I could do without the drums in the first one, but do enjoy the singing. So how did y'all like "Purple Robe" by the Stanley Brothers? No one commented yet Edited May 4, 2011 by 4everHis

[HappyChristian]

Thanks. I wish someone would come forward with the scripture they interpret as precluding divorced/remarried from sharing the good news.

Sharing the good news doesn't mean one has to do it from a pulpit. Missionaries, evangelists, pastors all proclaim the good news from a pulpit, in a leadership position. Those who sit in the congregation do tend to follow spiritual leaders...whether they be missionary/evangelist, pastor or even deacon.

The consensus of most pastors is that it would not apply to an evangelist. I lean the other way because in interpreting God's word and when the Scriptures are not specific about a particular situation, we must apply the relevant principles in God's word to determine what God would want us to do.
In principle you have a man carrying God's message whose personal life is not a good example because he is divorced and remarried. He is a man who represents the Lord and thus is under a higher standard that those that are not preachers. He may be a fine Christian man, but the fact is a cloud over his ministry and his divorce and remarriage, in the minds of many, reflects on his character and devotion to the Lord and brings it into question. He has two wives, probably two families with children from both marriages. He has broken the the vow he made before God that "till death do us part." Even if he was the one wronged in the marriage and was divorced by his wife....he chose to remarry, which means he put his own desires before God's. The man who is divorced and remarried has openly committed adultery. That is a serious sin for a man who sets himself up to teach other men and preach God's truth. Publicly he has willingly ignored God's word and commited willful sin. If he is a spiritual man, called of God to preach, then he should put the Lord first in everything. (Rom. 12:1-2, Col. 1:18) He can't really tell people give their all to the Lord, because he did not do it himself. Had he chosen to remain unmarried this testimony would be blameless.

God hates divorce and I can find nowhere in the New Testament where God says He approves of remarriage. 1 Cor. 7 presents the instruction that separation is allowed, but the passage does not condone or address remarriage. Some try to use verse 15 to say remarriage is approved, but I strongly disagree. The passage is specifically talking about a situation (case) where a lost spouse leaves and God is saying that the saved spouse is not bound to remain with the lost spouse. But that passage only approves of separation not remarriage. Verses 16-17 says it is better to try and stay with the unsaved. That means having an unsaved spouse does not by itself allow separation. In fact the situation is that the saved spouse can be a good influence on the unsaved spouse and may win them to the Lord. Verse 17 says, "But as God hath distributed to every man, as the Lord hath called every one, so let him walk. And so ordain I in all churches." God's principle then, stated by Paul, is that believers are to remain with the spouse that God has provided for them, lost or saved if possible. I think that in allowing separation God is making provision for mixed marriages where the unsaved spouse abuses the saved spouse. I am to uphold God's Word, which teaches the marriage is sacred and that God hates divorce and does not condone remarriage. Based on the principles I find in God's word, I would be compromising that word to allow a man to preach before my congregation who was divorced and remarried. I believe we are to uphold God purest principles. If God requires that a deacon who is not biblically a leaders in a church, but an elected servant to the congregation, I think it is clear that God would require that standard of all who stand in pulpits and preach God's word and that would include an evangelists. By the way, an evangelist biblically is a missionary who goes forth and preaches God word.

What I have stated is not the popular view. Many respond by saying what a great evangelist the man is, but the matter is not about ability, but about upholding biblical principles. Some would counter and say, but look at all the souls saved. But once again, we must be apply the principle. The Word of God stands on its own. I know of a number of people that were lead to the Lord in false churches such as the Pentecostals and who love the Lord and in time left these churches that teach false doctrine and now attend biblical churches. It is never right to do wrong to do right. (Bob Jones, Sr.). I agree...

You might be interested in this site, Dave:
http://bible-truth.org/FAQ-Divorce-preachers.html