Jews preparing to rebuild Third Temple

[John81]

There can be no future temple called the temple of God, with Jewish sacrifices fo the following reasons.

Christ's sacrifice was sufficient for all, Hebrews 7:27, 9:25-28

There are no priests, and can be no priests.
The sacrifice failed in AD 70 due to there being no priests qualified to offer it. They had all been murdered in the sedition. The seditious burnt down the records office, or archives containing the genealogies, so no priest could prove his ancestry, so anyone claiming to be a priest in the future must be polluted. see Ezra 2:62.

There are Orthodox Jews who would argue against that. They have already compiled a list of who they say are Levites and those from the line of Aaron. Whether their list is accurate or not doesn't matter because they believe it is, or are willing to proclaim it is, and use such in bringing the priesthood back into being.

Such wouldn't be valid because Christ is the ultimate preist who has offered the once and for all perfect and final sacrifice. Of course the Orthodox Jews don't believe this which is why they want to bring back the temple and sacrificial system.

[Invicta]

There are Orthodox Jews who would argue against that. They have already compiled a list of who they say are Levites and those from the line of Aaron. Whether their list is accurate or not doesn't matter because they believe it is, or are willing to proclaim it is, and use such in bringing the priesthood back into being.

Such wouldn't be valid because Christ is the ultimate preist who has offered the once and for all perfect and final sacrifice. Of course the Orthodox Jews don't believe this which is why they want to bring back the temple and sacrificial system.

Exactly which is why no future temple could be called the "Temple of God."

They may build it, but I cannot see, from scripture, that the Glory of God would be there.

[John81]

Exactly which is why no future temple could be called the "Temple of God."

They may build it, but I cannot see, from scripture, that the Glory of God would be there.

Agreed. Even if they build a temple God's glory won't rest there as in some OT times.

[Covenanter]

Agreed. Even if they build a temple God's glory won't rest there as in some OT times.

Good to be able to agree, at least in part.

But I cannot see how you can argue that a prophecy in AD 50 about the temple of God was not about the temple of God then still standing. Especially as its destruction was prophesied.

[Invicta]

Are you saying that Revelation was written in AD 50? if so, I have never been able to see that, it seems to defy the evidence.

Edited September 25, 2010 by Invicta

[trc123]

Are you saying that Revelation was written in AD 50? if so, I have never been able to see that, it seems to defy the evidence.

It was my understanding that The Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ was recorded by John while on the Island of Patmos around 96 A.D.; unless of course you are of the "textual criticism" ilk, which carries no weight with me.

[Covenanter]

It was my understanding that The Book of the Revelation of Jesus Christ was recorded by John while on the Island of Patmos around 96 A.D.; unless of course you are of the "textual criticism" ilk, which carries no weight with me.

The evidence from reading Rev. is that it was given to John while the temple was standing, before the destruction. (See Rev. 11.) There are many allusions to Jesus' Olivet prophecy of the destruction.

There is clearly no further temple structure in God's plans.

Rev 11:1 ¶ And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

Rev 21:22 ¶ And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

[Wilchbla]

There is clearly no further temple structure in God's plans.

Than you haven't read Ezekiel because the dimensions of the temple in Ezekiel are not the same as those in any other portion of the Bible nor as Herod's temple.

http://www.jewishmag.com/111mag/temple/temple.htm

[Invicta]

Than you haven't read Ezekiel because the dimensions of the temple in Ezekiel are not the same as those in any other portion of the Bible nor as Herod's temple.

http://www.jewishmag.com/111mag/temple/temple.htm

That seems to be what Paul calls "Jewish Fables.".

Jesus called Herod's temple, "My father's house."

Also, the Messianic temple is the Church, as Paul and Peter tell us. Edited October 16, 2010 by Invicta

[Covenanter]

That seems to be what Paul calls "Jewish Fables.".

Jesus called Herod's temple, "My father's house."

Also, the Messianic temple is the Church, as Paul and Peter tell us.

Actually I have read Ezekiel. As the prophecy includes animal sacrifices, for that temple to be yet future would be a rejection & denial of the one true sacrifice of Christ on Calvary.

OT worship & sacrifices, even the tabernacle, prefigured Christ & his saving ministry. Jesus & his Apostles make it very clear that the New Covenant temple is the church.

Eph 2:19 ¶ Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner [stone];
21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

[MaxKennedy]

I am aware that the churches are now filled with people who are mockers, practice witchcraft, and directly talk to satan. That the churches of satan are filled with the devil possessed, the spell caster, the liar, the abominable, and the homosexual.

Remove yourselve from them. God is going to judge them. Come out of the harlot churches, and do not be mixed up with them any longer, because God is going to avenge Himself.

Presbyterians

graceonlinelibrary.org
hwww.reformed.org
Westminster Confession of Faith (1646)

"There is no other head of the church but the Lord Jesus Christ: nor can the Pope of Rome in any sense be head thereof; but is that antichrist, that man of sin, and son of perdition, that exalteth himself in the church against Christ, and all that is called God."
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Baptists

www.grace.org.uk/faith/bc1689/
www.spurgeon.org/~phil/creeds/bcof.htm
Baptist Confession of Faith 1689

26.4 The Lord Jesus Christ is the head of the church. In him is vested, by the appointment of the Father in a supreme and sovereign manner, all authority for the calling, institution, order and government of the church.1 The Pope of Rome cannot in any sense be the head of the church, but he is the antichrist, that 'man of lawlessness', and 'son of destruction', who exalts himself in the church against Christ and all that is called God, whom the Lord shall destroy with the brightness of his coming.2
(1) Col 1:18; Eph 4:11-16; 1:20-23; 5:23-32; 1Co 12:27-28; Joh 17:1-3; Mat 28:18-20; Act 5:31; Joh 10:14-16
(2) 2Th 2:2-9
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Congregational (Puritans)

http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/creeds3.v.i.i.html
The Savoy Declaration 1658

"There is no other head of the Church but the Lord Jesus Christ; nor can the Pope of Rome in any sense be head thereof; but it (he) is that Antichrist, that man of sin and son of perdition that exalteth himself in the Church against Christ, and all that is called God, whom the Lord shall destroy with the brightness of His coming."
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Methodists

John Wesleys Commentaries
John Wesley’s commentaries on the bible, 2 Thessalonians 2
John Wesley is the founder of the Methodists

”2:3 .. Unless the falling away - From the pure faith of the gospel, come first. This began even in the apostolic age. But the man of sin, the son of perdition - Eminently so called, is not come yet. However, in many respects, the Pope has an indisputable claim to those titles. He is, in an emphatical sense, the man of sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled, the son of perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers, destroyed innumerable souls, and will himself perish everlastingly. He it is that opposeth himself to the emperor, once his rightful sovereign; and that exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped - Commanding angels, and putting kings under his feet, both of whom are called gods in scripture; claiming the highest power, the highest honour; suffering himself, not once only, to be styled God or vice - god. Indeed no less is implied in his ordinary title, "Most Holy Lord," or, "Most Holy Father." So that he sitteth - Enthroned. In the temple of God - Mentioned Revelation 11:1.Declaring himself that he is God - Claiming the prerogatives which belong to God alone.
2:6 And now ye know - By what I told you when I was with you. That which restraineth - The power of the Roman emperors. When this is taken away, the wicked one will be revealed. In his time - His appointed season, and not before. “
(I quoted it to 2:6 to show that Wesley believed in a historical church history approach, and that it also contradicts other claims by the apostate church.)
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Lutherans

Smalcald Articles, confession of faith
written in 1537 by Martin Luther
http://www.bookofconcord.org/smalcald.html
http://web.archive.org/web/20071013031852/http://www.iclnet.org/pub/resources/text/wittenberg/wittenberg-boc.html#sa

Article IV: Of the Papacy
10] This teaching shows forcefully that the Pope is the very Antichrist, who has exalted himself above, and opposed himself against Christ because he will not permit Christians to be saved without his power, which, nevertheless, is nothing, and is neither ordained nor commanded by God. 11] This is, properly speaking to exalt himself above all that is called God as Paul says, 2 Thess. 2, 4. Even the Turks or the Tartars, great enemies of Christians as they are, do not do this, but they allow whoever wishes to believe in Christ, and take bodily tribute and OBedience from Christians.
Article IV: Of the Papacy
14] [...] Lastly, it is nothing else than the devil himself, because above and against God he urges [and disseminates] his [papal] falsehoods concerning masses, purgatory, the monastic life, one's own works and [fictitious] divine worship (for this is the very Papacy [upon each of which the Papacy is altogether founded and is standing]), and condemns, murders and tortures all Christians who do not exalt and honor these abominations [of the Pope] above all things. Therefore, just as little as we can worship the devil himself as Lord and God, we can endure his apostle, the Pope, or Antichrist, in his rule as head or lord. For to lie and to kill, and to destroy body and soul eternally, that is wherein his papal government really consists, as I have very clearly shown in many books.
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Calvanists

John Calvin's Institutues of the Christian Religion
http://web.archive.org/web/20071013031852/http://www.ccel.org/ccel/calvin/institutes.iv.iv.viii.html?bcb=0

7. Of the Beginning and Rise of the Romish Papacy, till it attained a height by which the Liberty of the Church was destroyed, and all true Rule overthrown.

To the dishonest arts of Boniface succeeded fouler frauds devised in more modern times, and expressly condemned by Gregory and Bernard. sec. 19-21. V. The Papacy at length appeared complete in all its parts, the seat of Antichrist. Its impiety, execrable tyranny, and wickedness, portrayed, sec. 23-30.

[...]
25. To some we seem slanderous and petulant, when we call the Roman Pontiff Antichrist. But those who think so perceive not that they are bringing a charge of intemperance against Paul, after whom we speak, nay, in whose very words we speak. But lest any one OBject that Paul’s words have a different meaning, and are wrested by us against the Roman Pontiff, I wil1 briefly show that they can only be understood of the Papacy. Paul says that Antichrist would sit in the temple of God (2 Thess. 2:4). In another passage, the Spirit, portraying him in the person of Antiochus, says that his reign would be with great swelling words of vanity (Dan. 7:25). Hence we infer that his tyranny is more over souls than bodies, a tyranny set up in opposition to the spiritual kingdom of Christ. Then his nature is such, that he abolishes not the name either of Christ or the Church, but rather uses the name of Christ as a pretext, and lurks under the name of Church as under a mask. But though all the heresies and schisms which have existed from the beginning belong to the kingdom of Antichrist, yet when Paul foretells that defection will come, he by the description intimates that that seat of abomination will be erected, when a kind of universal defection comes upon the Church, though many members of the Church scattered up and down should continue in the true unity of the faith. But when he adds, that in his own time, the mystery of iniquity, which was afterwards to be openly manifested, had begun to work in secret, we thereby understand that this calamity was neither to be introduced by one man, nor to terminate in one man (see Calv. in 2 Thess. 2:3; Dan. 7:9). Moreover, when the mark by which he distinguishes Antichrist is, that he would rOB God of his honour and take it to himself, he gives the leading feature which we ought to follow in searching out Antichrist; especially when pride of this description proceeds to the open devastation of the Church. Seeing then it is certain that the Roman Pontiff has impudently transferred to himself the most peculiar properties of God and Christ, there cannot be a doubt that he is the leader and standard-bearer of an impious and abominable kingdom.

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King James Bible (preface)
http://web.archive.org/web/20071013031852/http://mb-soft.com/believe/txh/KJavpref.htm
Preface to the King James Bible, 1611

…And this their contentment doth not diminish or decay, but every day increaseth and taketh strength, when they OBserve, that the zeal of Your Majesty toward the house of God doth not slack or go backward, but is more and more kindled, manifesting itself abroad in the farthest parts of Christendom, by writing in defence of the Truth, (which hath given such a blow unto that man of sin, as will not be healed,)
[…]
For when Your Highness had once, out of deep judgment, apprehended how convenient it was, that, out of the Original sacred Tongues, together with comparing of the labours, both in our own and other foreign languages, of many worthy men who went before us, there should be one more exact translation of the Holy Scriptures into the English Tongue; Your Majesty did never desist to urge and to excite those to whom it was commended, that the Work might be hastened, and that the business might be expedited in so decent a manner, as a matter of such importance might justly require.
[…]
“…acceptance of our labours shall more honour and encourage us, than all the calumniations and hard interpretations of other men shall dismay us. So that if, on the one side, we shall be traduced by Popish Persons at home or abroad, who therefore will malign us, because we are poor instruments to make God's holy Truth to be yet more and more known unto the people, whom they desire still to keep in ignorance and darkness;”
William Tyndale was murdered at the stake by the Roman Catholic church for his work in translating the bible. 90% of the new testament in the King James version is still William Tyndale's translation. William Tyndale prayed when he was burning at the stake; “Lord, open the eyes of the King of England”. The King James Bible was the answer to that prayer.
http://www.williamtyndale.com/0biblehistory.htm

Edited October 18, 2010 by MaxKennedy

[1Timothy115]

Philippians 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always OBeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

Hell proof and heaven bound...take as many with you as God will provide grace. We all feel the approaching day; its the expression of that knowledge we need to be concerned with.

[John81]

Philippians 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always OBeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

Hell proof and heaven bound...take as many with you as God will provide grace. We all feel the approaching day; its the expression of that knowledge we need to be concerned with.

[LindaR]

That seems to be what Paul calls "Jewish Fables.".

Jesus called Herod's temple, "My father's house."

Also, the Messianic temple is the Church, as Paul and Peter tell us.

The Messianic temple is not the Church....Israel is Israel and the Church is the Church.

Israel is not the Church:

Israel and the Church

A Comparison and Contrast Between

Israel is a nation chosen by God and sustained by covenant promises (Deuteronomy 7:6-9). Not all individuals in this chosen nation are saved (Romans 9:6; 11:28).

The Church is a called out assembly of believers who have been baptized into the body of Christ (1 Corinthians 12:13). Every member of the body of Christ is saved, though there are multitudes of professing Christians who may not be saved (2 Timothy 2:19).

Israel traces its origin to Abraham, Isaac and JacOB (JacOB being the father of the twelve tribes).

The Church traces its origin to the day of Pentecost (Acts 2) when believers were first placed into the body of Christ.

In God’s program for Israel, His witnesses comprised a nation (Isaiah 43:10).

In God’s program for the Church, His witnesses are among all nations (Acts 1:8)

God’s program for Israel centered in Jerusalem (Matthew 23:37) and will again center in Jerusalem during the Tribulation (Matthew 24:15-20) and during the Millennium (Isaiah 2:1-5).

God’s program for His Church began in Jerusalem and extended to the uttermost parts of the earth (Luke 24:47; Acts 1:8). The Church is identified with the risen Christ, not with any earthly city.

The rest of these distinctions between Israel and the Church are found here

[Wilchbla]

That seems to be what Paul calls "Jewish Fables.".

Jesus called Herod's temple, "My father's house."

Also, the Messianic temple is the Church, as Paul and Peter tell us.

The temple in Ezekiel is a "Jewish fable"?