Why so many anti Ruckman?

[Jerry]

Let's use your argument and say that Ruckman was only 95% percent right - why would I want to use someone's material that has continually proven himself to be 5% wrong? There is enough in his writings that I have read to show me he is emotional (ie. uses emotional arguments, undependable, hypocritical (knocks those who use Greek and Hebrew study tools - AND THEN TURNS AROUND AND USES THEM HIMSELF!!), slanderous and is a reviler, has very many wacky doctrines, adds to the Bible. I don't need that kind of junk.

Some of his wacky doctrines

[Will]

Guys,

I have been looking around and saw many anti Ruckman comments. Why are thee so many anti Ruckman folks on here? Even if you do not agree with him on everything. You will still agree with him about 95% of the time.

As an example I do not agree with my wife 100% of the time but I still love my wife and she is a good wife. Ruckman has helped many people out in the ministry. He has had many attend PBI his college. He has stood up for the KJV for many years. Just to name a few good things that Dr. Ruckman has accomplished.


Atlas

Because he's a heretic.

[Kubel]

I agree with Kevin and others here. Doctrine aside, he gives everyone else a bad name. So if someone asked me why I'm anti-Ruckman, I would list my complaints in this order:

1) Attitude. It doesn't say "I'm a follower of Christ". Instead, it says "I am full of hate". And it gives a lot of other people a bad name. Let's assume for a moment that he is actually qualified to be a pastor, and that his doctrine is 100% correct. I still would not condone his method of delivering what he feels is truth in a spirit of hatred.

2) Doctrine. You could probably lump "sanity" in there too. Jerry had a good article in his post. His movement border on that of a cult. Here's another: http://www.wayoflife.org/articles/ruckman.htm. And as much as I love his tracts and the blessing they are to many, Chick has similar problems with conspiracy theories and sane thinking. But at least he isn't full of hatred.

3) Qualifications. Scripture is very clear here. He is not qualified to be a pastor. That's also covered in the Way of Life article. There are many other areas where he could serve, but being a pastor has some tough requirements. Some would argue, "well, nobody really is qualified". My answer to that would be that Ruckman is amongst the most unqualified. How many wives did he have? Three? I understand why the first two left! This #3 could probably be #2, but I don't go to his church, so it's less of a concern for me.

[atlas]

Guys,

I am not a " Ruckmanite " nor do I even like that word. I like many men. I have read books by O.B. Greene and also like him so am I also a " Greeneite? " I think you see my point on this issue. I think many people use the word " Ruckmanite " as some kind of insult. If I am an kind of " ite " I am a " Jesusite! " I can and will be all of your friends, however if I feel I need to bring up Dr. Ruckman or something he said I will do so. Just as I may bring up any other man I have learned something from. Like C.I. Scofield for an example.

I just used the 95% as a random number of all of us agreeing with him on. It may be a little higher or a little lower. It was just a number I pulled off the top of my head. What ever that number is, it is very high number.

I do not see Ruckman as any kind of cult leader any more than any other leader in our movement. I think that is just kind of crazy. What cult that you know of the believes in Jesus like we all do? I do not know of any cult like that.

I also hope some of you that use the Scofield Bile feel the same way about him as you do Ruckman. I am also real big on consistency. That is always an issue with me on everything. I think both were good men and did a good work. I use both of these men's work to help me. I also use the works of other men to help me learn more about God. I do not think any man is 100% right. If he was he would be perfect.

The bottom line is I like Ruckman and many of you do not. I will not change and you will not change. Therefore there is no need to fuss about this issue. I would advise anyone to read some of his books. I think he can help you learn more and be a better Christian. Ruckman is not the only man that can help you, he is just one of many. He is just one of the best and has helped me far more than many others.

Atlas

[Will]

Guys,

I am not a " Ruckmanite " nor do I even like that word. I like many men. I have read books by O.B. Greene and also like him so am I also a " Greeneite? " I think you see my point on this issue. I think many people use the word " Ruckmanite " as some kind of insult. If I am an kind of " ite " I am a " Jesusite! " I can and will be all of your friends, however if I feel I need to bring up Dr. Ruckman or something he said I will do so. Just as I may bring up any other man I have learned something from. Like C.I. Scofield for an example.

I just used the 95% as a random number of all of us agreeing with him on. It may be a little higher or a little lower. It was just a number I pulled off the top of my head. What ever that number is, it is very high number.

I do not see Ruckman as any kind of cult leader any more than any other leader in our movement. I think that is just kind of crazy. What cult that you know of the believes in Jesus like we all do? I do not know of any cult like that.

I also hope some of you that use the Scofield Bile feel the same way about him as you do Ruckman. I am also real big on consistency. That is always an issue with me on everything. I think both were good men and did a good work. I use both of these men's work to help me. I also use the works of other men to help me learn more about God. I do not think any man is 100% right. If he was he would be perfect.

The bottom line is I like Ruckman and many of you do not. I will not change and you will not change. Therefore there is no need to fuss about this issue. I would advise anyone to read some of his books. I think he can help you learn more and be a better Christian. Ruckman is not the only man that can help you, he is just one of many. He is just one of the best and has helped me far more than many others.

Atlas

Nah, I don't believe in aliens.

[Jerry]

Touche.

[MilkmanDan]

I got a bad feeling this is gonna get ugly fast.

Will some admin lock this please??!

[Anon]

Atlas, nobody is fighting. You started this thread, you asked a question, I think everybody has answered factually and calmly.

If there's any fight to this, sorry but you seem to be picking one. I will go ahead and lock this.

[Pastorj]

Atlas,

I have read some of his works. His early writings are pretty good. The issue is that at some point (late 60's to early 70's), Peter Ruckman left what the Word of God teaches and has come up with his own teachings and he has developed a cult like atmosphere where his followers worship him much like Jack Hyles.

Peter Ruckman believes that the KJV was double-inspired. 1st with the original and 2nd with the translators. Though we can hold up our KJV Bible and call it inspired, it is because God has preserved his word, not because he inspired every translator.

Schofield may have had some weird teachings also (Gap and Rev. 1), but he held to a proper doctrine of Bibliology. (Doctrine of the Bible). We can differ on minor doctrine, but when it comes to the Bible, I cannot fellowship with someone who holds to a heretical teaching on God's Word, whether they believe in double-inspiration, or a faulty belief in preservation. They are not in agreement doctrinally with me.

[Pastorj]

I unlocked the thread to give Atlas the final word if he chooses. Please do not post in this thread any longer. I will re-lock it after Atlas responds.

Pastor J

[atlas]

Guys,

I was not picking any fights. I do not understand why you may think so either. I do not have anything against any of you. I think I said that in my last post also. We just disagree on this issue and it is not worth fussing about. I also think I said that in my last post. I can disagree with folks and be a nice guy. I am sure others can do the same. That is why I said a few times I am not looking for any fights.

I have not been ugly nor has anyone else. I do not understand why this is even being locked. If you want to lock it feel free to do so. That is up to you. I will have to say I have never saw anything get locked when there is not a fight going on. This may be a new concept. The preemptive lock out, that is an interesting concept. I am sure it will work. I have just never saw it happen before.



Atlas

[Pastorj]

The reason for locking a thread can differ based on each situation.

Ruckman's heretical teaching has been thoroughly discussed in numerous threads. It is not a topic that the moderators typically have much patience with.

You asked a question, we gave you multiple answers. However, it is obvious you disagree with our answers.

I will lock this thread now as Atlas has had his opportunity to respond.

edited** I removed a statement at the request of a poster that he felt was offensive.