KJV 1 (The Rapture)

[Richg]

Hello all, I am an independent Baptist for decades but recently in the last 4 or 5 yrs have discovered some truths in scripture that disagree with the traditional teachings of Baptist preachers ! My entire purpose for writing this is that hopefully, you won't allow ANY preacher to interpret your Bible for you, that's what I did out of trust (of the preacher) & laziness ! Matt. 24:29 clearly says AFTER (after what?, after what the author just spent 10 verses describing!!!) the tribulation the sun goes dark and the moon turns to blood which means what? The Rapture ! I understand this will be,at first, a shock to your mind that will take some adjustment, it did me anyway, but the point is ,is it better to adjust to the truth of the Word or just keep on believing lies because it's more comfortable?

 

 

Edited March 10, 2022 by PastorMatt
Added "Rapture" to the title to properly reflect this thread

[BrotherTony]

52 minutes ago, Richg said:

Hello all, I am an independent Baptist for decades but recently in the last 4 or 5 yrs have discovered some truths in scripture that disagree with the traditional teachings of Baptist preachers ! My entire purpose for writing this is that hopefully, you won't allow ANY preacher to interpret your Bible for you, that's what I did out of trust (of the preacher) & laziness ! Matt. 24:29 clearly says AFTER (after what?, after what the author just spent 10 verses describing!!!) the tribulation the sun goes dark and the moon turns to blood which means what? The Rapture ! I understand this will be,at first, a shock to your mind that will take some adjustment, it did me anyway, but the point is ,is it better to adjust to the truth of the Word or just keep on believing lies because it's more comfortable?

 

 

I don't believe you're properly interpreting that verse. That is talking about the very end....not the rapture. This is one reason I had started a thread a while back about pastors and laypeople mixing the two events up and misinterpreting scriptures concerning each event.

 

[Richg]

I am properly interpreting it, absolutely positive on this one, it's also in Mark 13:24, I mean seriously, how could it be any clearer? Mark 13:27 tells us exactly what's going on here, the Rapture, unless gathering the saints from the 4 corners of the earth is the end, starting at verse 5 Jesus explains what WE, the elect will endure, I would say the persecution & the killing of the Christians qualifies as great tribulation ! There is like 10 places in the Bible that mention the stars falling to earth along with the sun & moon going dark and they all refer to one event, the Rapture.

[BrotherTony]

11 minutes ago, Richg said:

I am properly interpreting it, absolutely positive on this one, it's also in Mark 13:24, I mean seriously, how could it be any clearer? Mark 13:27 tells us exactly what's going on here, the Rapture, unless gathering the saints from the 4 corners of the earth is the end, starting at verse 5 Jesus explains what WE, the elect will endure, I would say the persecution & the killing of the Christians qualifies as great tribulation ! There is like 10 places in the Bible that mention the stars falling to earth along with the sun & moon going dark and they all refer to one event, the Rapture.

The Rapture is supposed to come as a "thief in the night" is it not? No moon turning to blood, no stars falling to earth. You're going to have to do a better job of presenting it than this to convince some of us YOUR interpretation is correct. I've taken Eschatology, and I have to tell you, you're nowhere near lining up with what is taught in Scripture.

Edited March 3, 2022 by BrotherTony

[SureWord]

You are getting the Rapture and Second Coming mixed up. 

One of the keys to proper interpretation is proper division and also understanding who the Lord is addressing at the time. Many heresies are a result of failing to do so.

 

[Jerry]

For those who want a Biblical look at some things about the rapture, and how the Bible teaches it as Pre-Trib (showing the distinction between the rapture and the second coming), there are two videos in this series that cover it somewhat:

Bible Prophecy as Light on the 21st Centurey (wayoflife.org)

[Richg]

the Rapture is the second coming are you kidding, Jesus came already and the next time he won't come all the way to earth but we will be caught up to meet Him, the next time,after the millennium He comes down to earth to fight the battle of Armageddon which is the last event after the 1000 yr. Millennium

[Jerry]

How can Jesus rule and reign from Jerusalem for those 1000 years (which many passages teach) without coming to earth? Sorry, you missed the boat. It is one thing to reject traditions that contradict the Bible, it is another thing to reject clear Bible teaching for your own opinions.

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

That's the millennium. Quite clearly states Jesus is on the earth reigning for those 1000 years. That means His second coming comes BEFORE the millennium (otherwise referred to as Pre-millennium), and based on the book of Revelation itself all seven years of the Tribulation (found in chapters 6-19) comes before that point.

[1Timothy115]

18 minutes ago, Richg said:

the Rapture is the second coming are you kidding, Jesus came already and the next time he won't come all the way to earth but we will be caught up to meet Him, the next time,after the millennium He comes down to earth to fight the battle of Armageddon which is the last event after the 1000 yr. Millennium

You do know that you're speaking to an audience who reads and studies the Bible and doesn't just listen to everyone who comes along with a new or worn-out attempt to insert another doctrine. I won't speak for everyone, but we have for decades studied this here on OB and personally. You are mistaken my friend on your understanding. I'm sorry you put your trust in a man who obviously caused you distress. Most of us are pre-millennia.

Edited March 3, 2022 by 1Timothy115

[Richg]

It amazes me that a man will refuse to look at the truth, what part of "AFTER" THE TRIBULATION (not in one, but in two different verses !!!!) of those days don't you get ? I'll help you, the major problem that (Baptists) have is is that (me to for 40 yrs. !) they think the tribulation & the wrath of God is the same event & in scripture it clearly is not, Rev. ch. 6 trib. ch. 8 wrath starts, if you read it with a slightly open mind it would be very easy to see, it was for me, you see, when the truth in God's Word is the only thing that matters, you will take an honest look. Rev. ch.6 vs. 12 is the rapture, if its not, can you explain to me what Jesus is sending his angels to gather from the 4 corners of the earth (Mark 13:27) 

[BrotherTony]

11 minutes ago, Richg said:

It amazes me that a man will refuse to look at the truth, what part of "AFTER" THE TRIBULATION (not in one, but in two different verses !!!!) of those days don't you get ? I'll help you, the major problem that (Baptists) have is is that (me to for 40 yrs. !) they think the tribulation & the wrath of God is the same event & in scripture it clearly is not, Rev. ch. 6 trib. ch. 8 wrath starts, if you read it with a slightly open mind it would be very easy to see, it was for me, you see, when the truth in God's Word is the only thing that matters, you will take an honest look. Rev. ch.6 vs. 12 is the rapture, if its not, can you explain to me what Jesus is sending his angels to gather from the 4 corners of the earth (Mark 13:27) 

You are trying to build a doctrine on two verses that aren't even involved in your timing of the events mentioned. You truly should get a book on rightly dividing the Word of God...a book on Hermeneutics/Exegesis. It will help you greatly in how to understand and correctly interpret the Bible. I'm sure that several of the pastors here could recommend one on a starter level. 

[Richg]

My brother, that's your first mistake, never use man's book to interpret God's word , the Bible is self explanatory 95% of the time and when it's not, we're probably not meant to know that yet. I,m not saying extra knowledge is a bad thing except when it come to a man teaching another man his or her interpretation, I don't do interpretations, just what scripture says !

[BrotherTony]

37 minutes ago, Richg said:

My brother, that's your first mistake, never use man's book to interpret God's word , the Bible is self explanatory 95% of the time and when it's not, we're probably not meant to know that yet. I,m not saying extra knowledge is a bad thing except when it come to a man teaching another man his or her interpretation, I don't do interpretations, just what scripture says !

 

37 minutes ago, Richg said:

My brother, that's your first mistake, never use man's book to interpret God's word , the Bible is self explanatory 95% of the time and when it's not, we're probably not meant to know that yet. I,m not saying extra knowledge is a bad thing except when it come to a man teaching another man his or her interpretation, I don't do interpretations, just what scripture says !

Well then, you need to be comparing the whole of the subject's verses...Scripture to Scripture, not just those two verses...I cheard an evangelist back in the early 1970s say that there was a man who was trying to get direction from God on verses concerning a subject and he came to the first verse....And Judas went out and hanged himself...the second verse he found as direction said "Go thou and do likewise!" Compare the whole of the scriptures on the subject, not just the two or three you've been using. You're way off base and doing yourself more harm than good.

[Jim_Alaska]

• Richg, it is customary when visiting a new forum where you are not known, to go to the "Introduction" thread and introduce yourself, and tell a bit about yourself. Please consider doing so.

[Pastor Matt]

19 hours ago, Richg said:

the Rapture is the second coming are you kidding, Jesus came already and the next time he won't come all the way to earth but we will be caught up to meet Him, the next time,after the millennium He comes down to earth to fight the battle of Armageddon which is the last event after the 1000 yr. Millennium

Where in Rev 18-20 do you get this timeline? Please, break it down for us who apparently don't use the Bible, but rather just teach what we  "allow ANY preacher to interpret our Bible for us"