ISIL issues hit list of U.S. churches for holiday attacks

[MountainChristian]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2016/12/22/islamic-state-urges-attacks-us-churches-during-holidays/95746982/

 

The Islamic State is urging its followers to attack U.S. churches and has published names and addresses of thousands of prospective targets, according to a report in the news website Vocativ.

Messages posted in Arabic to the group’s “Secrets of Jihadis” social media site called "for bloody celebrations in the Christian New Year." The post, under the name Abu Marya al-Iraqi, said the Islamic State, also known as ISIL, hopes to tap lone wolf attackers to “turn the Christian New Year into a bloody horror movie,” Vocativ reports.

The series of messages appeared on Telegram, a messaging app that allows users to send encrypted messages to one another. The group also uses social media to provide instructions on constructing and igniting explosives.

The information on U.S. churches was based on information already available online and includes a public directory of churches across all 50 states, Vocativ said.

Another post urged followers to attack churches, hotels, crowded coffee shops, streets, markets and public places and provided some examples in the U.S. Canada, France and the Netherlands, Vocativ said.

The SITE Intelligence Group has cited similar Islamic State postings in recent days. The Islamic State claims one of its "soldiers" carried out an attack Monday at a Christmas market in Berlin that killed 12 people. A global manhunt is underway for suspect Anis Amri, 24, a Tunisian national.

Cities across the U.S. have bolstered security around holiday events following the Berlin attack.

In New York and Chicago, law enforcement officials said police presence has been increased for holiday events despite no intelligence that indicates specific threats to their cities. In Boston, Mayor Martin Walsh said the city deployed police and put barriers in place around the Boston Holiday market.

Contributing: Aamer Madhani

 

 

[Rosie]

May God have mercy. I'm sure its coming...

[heartstrings]

On 12/22/2016 at 4:01 PM, MountainChristian said:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2016/12/22/islamic-state-urges-attacks-us-churches-during-holidays/95746982/

 

The Islamic State is urging its followers to attack U.S. churches and has published names and addresses of thousands of prospective targets, according to a report in the news website Vocativ.

Messages posted in Arabic to the group’s “Secrets of Jihadis” social media site called "for bloody celebrations in the Christian New Year." The post, under the name Abu Marya al-Iraqi, said the Islamic State, also known as ISIL, hopes to tap lone wolf attackers to “turn the Christian New Year into a bloody horror movie,” Vocativ reports.

The series of messages appeared on Telegram, a messaging app that allows users to send encrypted messages to one another. The group also uses social media to provide instructions on constructing and igniting explosives.

The information on U.S. churches was based on information already available online and includes a public directory of churches across all 50 states, Vocativ said.

Another post urged followers to attack churches, hotels, crowded coffee shops, streets, markets and public places and provided some examples in the U.S. Canada, France and the Netherlands, Vocativ said.

The SITE Intelligence Group has cited similar Islamic State postings in recent days. The Islamic State claims one of its "soldiers" carried out an attack Monday at a Christmas market in Berlin that killed 12 people. A global manhunt is underway for suspect Anis Amri, 24, a Tunisian national.

Cities across the U.S. have bolstered security around holiday events following the Berlin attack.

In New York and Chicago, law enforcement officials said police presence has been increased for holiday events despite no intelligence that indicates specific threats to their cities. In Boston, Mayor Martin Walsh said the city deployed police and put barriers in place around the Boston Holiday market.

Contributing: Aamer Madhani

 

 

Yes, I agree; cowards, not soldiers. All I can say is, let them try it in some of these little country IFB and SBC churches where many of the folks are armed.

[Alan]

It truely is a sad state of affirs in the world today. Thanks for keeping us informed.

[Invicta]

On 03/01/2017 at 9:29 PM, heartstrings said:

Yes, I agree; cowards, not soldiers. All I can say is, let them try it in some of these little country IFB and SBC churches where many of the folks are armed.

That is hardly a Christian resposne.  We recently heard of a report from believers in Aleppo who siad "Don't pray for us to escape, pray thay Muslims may be converted."  That is the Christian response.

Matt 5:11  Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
Matt 5:44  But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
 

[weary warrior]

2 hours ago, Invicta said:

That is hardly a Christian resposne.  We recently heard of a report from believers in Aleppo who siad "Don't pray for us to escape, pray thay Muslims may be converted."  That is the Christian response.

Matt 5:11  Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
Matt 5:44  But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
 

Brother, I gently disagree with you. There is nothing un-Christian about defending ones wife and children, and the weak and helpless, from a bunch of invading, murdering, raping thugs. In our country, and in yours, we are not under the edict of Romans 13 here, the muslims are not our government, and we are not Biblically subject to them and their deprivations. If we do not provide for our family we are "worse than an infidel". I believe that means more than just providing beans and blankets. 

Luk 22:36  Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

If you read the verses that precede this one, Jesus says to the disciples that he had given them one set of instructions before (this would be your Matthew 5, the instructions for the Kingdom of Heaven) but now those instructions were changed, as the Jews had rejected the Kingdom of Heaven and it had not been ushered in after all. It would have to wait till the Millennial Reign. Now they were to see that they had some means to defend themselves, as they would surely be coming under attack. 

Armed defense is a prickly subject, to be sure, and certainly not for everywhere and for every situation. But I don't think it can just be dismissed out-of-hand as being un-Christian.

Again, my disagreement with your view is a gentle one, and in no way meant to be argumentative or disrespectful. I know this particular subject can be divisive, and I have no wish for that.

Edited January 5, 2017 by weary warrior
grammar edit

[Invicta]

17 minutes ago, weary warrior said:

bunch of invading, murdering, raping thugs.

That "bunch of invading, murdering, raping thugs." are people for whom Christ died.  Just as were those who murdered HIM. How can they be saved if you murder them?  

Acts 3:15  And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.

If any christian had the authority to kill anyone it would have been the diciples but instead they preached Jesus to them.

And Jesus did not offer the kingdom to the Jews, in fact when they offered to make Him king He rejected it.  

[weary warrior]

14 minutes ago, Invicta said:

That "bunch of invading, murdering, raping thugs." are people for whom Christ died.  Just as were those who murdered HIM. How can they be saved if you murder them?  

Acts 3:15  And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.

If any christian had the authority to kill anyone it would have been the diciples but instead they preached Jesus to them.

And Jesus did not offer the kingdom to the Jews, in fact when they offered to make Him king He rejected it.  

Defending one's life from murder is not murder. That concept is almost ludicrous. If the disciples had killed those who had killed Christ it would have been a three-fold wrong. It would have been revenge murder since they were not in danger, it would have been taking up the sword against their rightful government, and it would have flown in the face of prophesy and the very purpose of Christ's coming. It's not even remotely the same.

If I take the life of someone who is actively trying to destroy my wife, you're absolutely right. He won't get saved. He'll go to hell. And it will be a choice he made himself. He will reap the results of decisions he made, not that I made for him. I will not sacrifice the lives of the innocent for the sake of the lives of the destroyers. 

[Invicta]

When the Zealots desecrated the temple by bringing arms into the Holy Place, in the Roman war 66-70 AD they were wiped out.  When the Huguenots had pastors who forbade them to carry arms against those who wanted to wipe them out, the church mostly prospered despite intense persecution. But after the pastors were cruelly murdered or exiled, there arose a new kind of leader who taught them through visions that they should take up arms against the king's troops, they were exterminated.  At one time they were estimated to be 45% of the population in France. By bringing arms into the sanctuary, you are desecrating it, just as the   Zealots desecrated the Temple.  By 'sanctuary' I refer to the church/  Not the building but the true church of whom Paul said:

1Co 3:16  Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1Co 3:17  If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
2Co 6:16  And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
 

Edited January 5, 2017 by Invicta
spelling

[Jim_Alaska]

So Invicta, you would contend that The Lord would not use His people, or weapons to defend His people, or to further His cause?

 Jos 10:19 And stay ye not, but pursue after your enemies, and smite the hindmost of them; suffer them not to enter into their cities: for the LORD your God hath delivered them into your hand. 
 20 And it came to pass, when Joshua and the children of Israel had made an end of slaying them with a very great slaughter, till they were consumed, that the rest which remained of them entered into fenced cities. 
 21 And all the people returned to the camp to Joshua at Makkedah in peace: none moved his tongue against any of the children of Israel.

 Jg 15:6 Then the Philistines said, Who hath done this? And they answered, Samson, the son in law of the Timnite, because he had taken his wife, and given her to his companion. And the Philistines came up, and burnt her and her father with fire. 
 7 And Samson said unto them, Though ye have done this, yet will I be avenged of you, and after that I will cease. 
 8 And he smote them hip and thigh with a great slaughter: and he went down and dwelt in the top of the rock Etam. 
 9 Then the Philistines went up, and pitched in Judah, and spread themselves in Lehi. 
 10 And the men of Judah said, Why are ye come up against us? And they answered, To bind Samson are we come up, to do to him as he hath done to us. 
 11 Then three thousand men of Judah went to the top of the rock Etam, and said to Samson, Knowest thou not that the Philistines are rulers over us? what is this that thou hast done unto us? And he said unto them, As they did unto me, so have I done unto them. 
 12 And they said unto him, We are come down to bind thee, that we may deliver thee into the hand of the Philistines. And Samson said unto them, Swear unto me, that ye will not fall upon me yourselves. 
 13 And they spake unto him, saying, No; but we will bind thee fast, and deliver thee into their hand: but surely we will not kill thee. And they bound him with two new cords, and brought him up from the rock. 
 14 And when he came unto Lehi, the Philistines shouted against him: and the Spirit of the LORD came mightily upon him, and the cords that were upon his arms became as flax that was burnt with fire, and his bands loosed from off his hands. 
 15 And he found a new jawbone of an ass, and put forth his hand, and took it, and slew a thousand men therewith.

 Ex 17:8 Then came Amalek, and fought with Israel in Rephidim. 
 9 And Moses said unto Joshua, Choose us out men, and go out, fight with Amalek: to morrow I will stand on the top of the hill with the rod of God in mine hand. 
 10 So Joshua did as Moses had said to him, and fought with Amalek: and Moses, Aaron, and Hur went up to the top of the hill. 
 11 And it came to pass, when Moses held up his hand, that Israel prevailed: and when he let down his hand, Amalek prevailed. 
 12 But Moses' hands were heavy; and they took a stone, and put it under him, and he sat thereon; and Aaron and Hur stayed up his hands, the one on the one side, and the other on the other side; and his hands were steady until the going down of the sun. 
 13 And Joshua discomfited Amalek and his people with the edge of the sword. 
 14 And the LORD said unto Moses, Write this for a memorial in a book, and rehearse it in the ears of Joshua: for I will utterly put out the remembrance of Amalek from under heaven. 

[Invicta]

2 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said:

So Invicta, you would contend that The Lord would not use His people, or weapons to defend His people, or to further His cause?

 Jos 10:19 And stay ye not, but pursue after your enemies, and smite the hindmost of them; suffer them not to enter into their cities: for the LORD your God hath delivered them into your hand. 
 20 And it came to pass, when Joshua and the children of Israel had made an end of slaying them with a very great slaughter, till they were consumed, that the rest which remained of them entered into fenced cities. 
 21 And all the people returned to the camp to Joshua at Makkedah in peace: none moved his tongue against any of the children of Israel.

 Jg 15:6 Then the Philistines said, Who hath done this? And they answered, Samson, the son in law of the Timnite, because he had taken his wife, and given her to his companion. And the Philistines came up, and burnt her and her father with fire. 
 7 And Samson said unto them, Though ye have done this, yet will I be avenged of you, and after that I will cease. 
 8 And he smote them hip and thigh with a great slaughter: and he went down and dwelt in the top of the rock Etam. 
 9 Then the Philistines went up, and pitched in Judah, and spread themselves in Lehi. 
 10 And the men of Judah said, Why are ye come up against us? And they answered, To bind Samson are we come up, to do to him as he hath done to us. 
 11 Then three thousand men of Judah went to the top of the rock Etam, and said to Samson, Knowest thou not that the Philistines are rulers over us? what is this that thou hast done unto us? And he said unto them, As they did unto me, so have I done unto them. 
 12 And they said unto him, We are come down to bind thee, that we may deliver thee into the hand of the Philistines. And Samson said unto them, Swear unto me, that ye will not fall upon me yourselves. 
 13 And they spake unto him, saying, No; but we will bind thee fast, and deliver thee into their hand: but surely we will not kill thee. And they bound him with two new cords, and brought him up from the rock. 
 14 And when he came unto Lehi, the Philistines shouted against him: and the Spirit of the LORD came mightily upon him, and the cords that were upon his arms became as flax that was burnt with fire, and his bands loosed from off his hands. 
 15 And he found a new jawbone of an ass, and put forth his hand, and took it, and slew a thousand men therewith.

 Ex 17:8 Then came Amalek, and fought with Israel in Rephidim. 
 9 And Moses said unto Joshua, Choose us out men, and go out, fight with Amalek: to morrow I will stand on the top of the hill with the rod of God in mine hand. 
 10 So Joshua did as Moses had said to him, and fought with Amalek: and Moses, Aaron, and Hur went up to the top of the hill. 
 11 And it came to pass, when Moses held up his hand, that Israel prevailed: and when he let down his hand, Amalek prevailed. 
 12 But Moses' hands were heavy; and they took a stone, and put it under him, and he sat thereon; and Aaron and Hur stayed up his hands, the one on the one side, and the other on the other side; and his hands were steady until the going down of the sun. 
 13 And Joshua discomfited Amalek and his people with the edge of the sword. 
 14 And the LORD said unto Moses, Write this for a memorial in a book, and rehearse it in the ears of Joshua: for I will utterly put out the remembrance of Amalek from under heaven. 

Brfo Jim,

They are all OT references, the lastest NT references say "Put up thy Sword"

Mattt 26:52  Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
John 18:11  Then said Jesus unto Peter, Put up thy sword into the sheath: the cup which my Father hath given me, shall I not drink it?

 

[heartstrings]

Romans 13: 1 

Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. 2Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. 3For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. 5Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. 6For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing. 7Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.

I know that is referring to government, per se. But my Bible says that I, as the husband, am to "rule" my house, and it says the "Elders" are to "rule" the church. However you want to interpret that is your business. Just know that if anyone tries to shoot up our church or break into my house to "do evil" to my family  they will very likely be met with "the sword". After the emergency at hand has been dealt with and If they're still conscious after they're laid flat, then we'll tell them about Jesus.

Edited January 6, 2017 by heartstrings

[Invicta]

1 hour ago, heartstrings said:

Romans 13: 1 

Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. 2Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. 3For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. 5Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. 6For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing. 7Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.

I know that is referring to government, per se. But my Bible says that I, as the husband, am to "rule" my house, and it says the "Elders" are to "rule" the church. However you want to interpret that is your business. Just know that if anyone tries to shoot up our church or break into my house to "do evil" to my family  they will very likely be met with "the sword". After the emergency at hand has been dealt with and If they're still conscious after they're laid flat, then we'll tell them about Jesus.

Yes that refers to the government.  The Anabaptists thought so as they refused to take up arms against the government saying the sword is for the magistrate.  There was a breakaway group who were called Anabaptist that rebelled and set up a city state, but they were probably not Anabaptist at all or even Christian. 

As one hymn says,

Arrows all around me fly, 

Till He wills I cannot die

Not a single dart can hit

ill the God of Love sees fit.

 

 

 

[Jim_Alaska]

14 hours ago, Invicta said:

Brfo Jim,

They are all OT references, the lastest NT references say "Put up thy Sword"

Mattt 26:52  Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.
John 18:11  Then said Jesus unto Peter, Put up thy sword into the sheath: the cup which my Father hath given me, shall I not drink it?

 

Context Invicta, Jesus said these words simply because if his disciples had come to his defense it would have upset the whole of God's plan and reason for his coming.

I do understand that what I posted is OT, but the principle of God protecting his own and even commanding that oppressors be destroyed remains. An armed response from God's people against wrong by their government is not the same as an armed response in protection of one's life, the life of their families, or the lives of innocent victims.

We have a God given right of self protection which God graciously gave to all creatures. This can be observed in all of his creation, even the gentlest creature will fight back in response to a threat to its life or the life of its offspring.

Man is different in that he is made in the image of God and created with a sense of right and wrong. He is higher than animal life and able to reason, therefore he has the ability to determine when his God given right of self protection should also include defense of the helpless.

Does God care if his people are threatened or oppressed?

 Mt 18:5 And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me. 
 6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. 
 7 ¶ Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh! 
 8 Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire. 
 9 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire. 
 10 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. 
 11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. 
 12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? 
 13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. 
 14 Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. 

Does God use his people to protect his people? (my previous OT quotes answer, yes.)

Does god use his people in defense of his purposes and to punish evil? (again my previous OT quotes answer, yes.) And he will use his people again at a future time.  Rev 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

What are armies used for?

[Invicta]

2 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said:

Does God care if his people are threatened or oppressed?

Bro Jim, Of course he does.  His people are being murdered and oppressed today in many countries of the world, Pakistan, Saudi, Iraq, Syria, Malaysia, china, Noth Korea, not just a few in the USA.    

John 16:33  These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

Romans 5:3  And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;

2 hours ago, Jim_Alaska said:

What are armies used for?

To obey the will of the state. which may not be defence. But that is a different matter,.  

All that is not what my original answer to HS was about.  

On 03/01/2017 at 9:29 PM, heartstrings said:

All I can say is, let them try it in some of these little country IFB and SBC churches where many of the folks are armed.

Dayesh jihadists count it an honour to die if they can kill a few christians first.  If they have assault rifles they could kill quite a few, and if they have suicide belts they could kill many.  Remember that in the Charlie Hebdo attack in Paris, there were armed police protecting the building but they were the first to die.  

Anyway we have said all this before. 

Just to repeat what I said in a previous thread, that you live in a country where many love guns, even wordhip them, but we live in a country where the vast majority hate guns. 

If you polute the Church with arms, how can you be blessed my God?

 

Edited January 6, 2017 by Invicta