Susan Warner / Wide, Wide World - Looking for discussion

[Chantie]

First, a bit of background - I an not a christian. I am an agnostic.  I love to read, and I read a huge variety of literature. Early last year in a used bookstore I picked up an old book strictly because it was written in the 1800s. But while the elderly status of the story may have inspired me to buy it, it didn't inspire me to read it. The book sat on my "to-read" bookshelf gathering dust for months before I summoned up the energy to pick it up and read it. The book was "The Wide, Wide World" by Susan Warner.

I was HOOKED by the end of the second page. I was obsessed by the end of the first chapter. And by the end of the book I was addicted. I found a collection of her stories and bought it on my kindle, piecing them out to myself one by one, savoring them as if they were the finest of chocolates in the hands of a chocolate starved sweet tooth. Recently I started craving the stories again and started reading them.

Ever since I first started reading The Wide, Wide World I have wanted to discuss these books and the portrayal of christianity presented in them with a christian or two. Or three. The problem is actually find a christian who has read them and enjoyed them. I have only found two christians who had read the books - both of them female. Both of them hated the book and claimed it was sexist.

Granted, this book was written back in the 1800s - and a modern portrayal of feminism it is not. But I don't find it sexist at all. In fact, I find it was a beautiful - sometimes alarmingly enticing picture of what christianity SHOULD be (as far as I am concerned, anyway). The author treats her characters with sympathetic tenderness, and her writing is beautifully descriptive. But I wonder how realistic it all is. I wonder what other christians think of it and whether it is a realistic portrayal of christianity. I realize that it is an idealized world regarding morality, etc - but specifically in regards to the christian life itself I am curious as to how it relates to modern christianity.

I put out some feelers on other social media sites and someone recommended I try to contact some more conservative fundamentalist type christians and after searching online I found this forum. I hope its ok for me to be here - definitely not looking for an argument or a debate. I just really really love these stories and really, really want to talk it over with a christian who loves them as well.

[OLD fashioned preacher]

Just picked up the book on Kendall, will read when I have the chance and get back with you on it.

btw: Howdy

[swathdiver]

I found a copy online and from the three minutes of reading, yes, Christians and folks of the Victorian era conducted themselves in this way.  The things of God were interwoven through every aspect of life back then with nearly the entire population.

My wife I believe would find such a book quite enjoyable.  I shall bring it to her attention and ask if she'd like to converse with you about it.

[HappyChristian]

The book sounds fascinating, chantie! I love books written back in that era. I've found the series on Amazon, and intend to order at least book 1 as soon as I can. 

[Chantie]

Ok this is a very short response cause I'm exhausted and about to go to bed for my overnight shift but I just HAD to say how excited I am! 

 

You are all awesome people! I can't wait to talk to you all about it. I'm gonna start re-reading it tonight and making notes. 

 

*claps hands happily* You guys seriously made me kinda squeal with happiness. I will respond more tomorrow when I get off work.

Edited May 2, 2016 by Chantie

[Ukulelemike]

While I have not read them, I will say I used to have a book called 'Civil War Etiquette', being, yes, an etiquette book written during that time, the name being applied when recently re-published.  What fascinated my wife and I was that while it is not a Christian book, yet being 'godly' and a generally moral person, by biblical standards, is considered a requirement for good etiquette in that time. A well-mannered person was one who acted with kindness, respect, modesty, and a Christian world-view. They didn't smoke, didn't drink, abstained from vulgar language. It just...Was.

[Chantie]

Alright, so this more detailed discussion post is later than expected, but I had issues getting access to my account for a few days, and then I was busy working overnights, But! Here goes:)

These quotes and discussion threads are not all from The Wide, Wide World by any means - some are from other books she has written. I will provide what book they are from for reference, but I am trying to keep enough context you won't need too.

 

One reason I haven't converted to Christianity except for one brief flirtation with it when I was younger is because - too be quite frank - there is not enough evidence to me that it makes a difference in someone's life. Since there is no real physical proof of God, then the proof must be in the impact God has on his followers. The brief flirtation I had with Christianity when I was younger yielded no real change in me, and when I found myself frequently forgetting I was supposed to be a christian, I decided it wasn't real and moved on with life. There are, of course, some very interesting examples of the impact christianity can have on someone's life. But those seem to be exceptions rather than the rule. And there is nothing to prove to me that it is specifically christianity that is making the difference, and another religion wouldn't have had the same affect.

I say all that because one of the more interesting refrains I find in Warner's works is that there is a middle ground between not being a christian and being a "full-out" christian. Basically where you may not completely WANT or possibly even believe - but you are taking the first steps on a matter of faith alone.

Some examples:

-From "A Letter of Credit"
"Why, how can I be a Christian, when I don't want to?"

"How can you do anything else that you do not want to do? Duty remains duty, does it not?"

-From "Melbourne House""

Daisy, the good Lord wants you to give Him your heart.:

"But suppose, Mr. Dinwiddie..."

"Yes, what?"

"Suppose I can't. I don't know how."

"Do you want to do it?"

"Yes, sir. Indeed I do."

"Very well, the Lord knows just what your difficulty is, you must apply to Him."

"Apply to Him?" said Daisy.

"Ask Him."

"How, sir?"

"Pray to Him. Tell the Lord your trouble, and ask Him to make it all right for you."

-From "The Wide, Wide World" Context: Ellen is speaking on a boat to a Christian gentleman about being a Christian. She has expressed a willingness, but is uncertain if she can. I am not sure if it is due to disbelief or not.

"When a person is in earnest, how does he show it?"

"By doing every thing he possibly can to get what he wants."

"Quite right," said her friend, smiling: "And has God bidden us to do nothing besides pray for a new heart?"

"Oh yes, Sir. He has told us to do a great many things."

"And will he be likely to grant that prayer, Ellen, if he sees that you do not care about displeasing him in those "great many things"? Will he judge that you are sincere in wishing for a new heart?"

"Oh no, Sir."

"Then, if you are resolved to be a Christian, you will not be contented with praying for a new heart, that you will being at once to be a servant of God. You can do nothing well without help, but you are sure the help will come, and from this good day you will seek to know and to do the will of God, trusting in his dear Son to perfect that which conerneth you. My little child," sad the gentleman, softly and kindly,  "are you ready to say you will do this?"

So am I misunderstanding all this? Am I understanding it correctly but you think she is wrong? 

 

Another thing that has...attracted to me to these books is the stern regard of what is considered sin and the complete refusal to believe any level of sin is acceptable. While I do not believe I could personally live up to such expectations, the firm belief and willingness to practice their belief makes the characters very attractive and inspiring to me. When they say their entire lives should be dedicated to God, they mean it. From the way they choose to dress and spend their money:

-From: "Pine Needles"

"Stop, Miss Flora. The servant himself belongs to his lord; therefore he must make of himself the very best he can. For this, books will certainly be needed, and to some degree all the other things you have named, except jewels and what you call rich dresses. The only question in each case is - 'How can I do the Lord's work best? How can I spend this money to honour and please Him the most?' That will not always be by the cheapest dress that can be bought, nor by checking the cultivation of taste and the acquiring of knowledge, nor even by the foregoing of arts and accomplishments. Only the question comes back at every step, and must at every step be answered - 'What does the lord want me to do here? Does he wish me to spend this money - or time - on myself, or on somebody else?"

To what sort of things they read:

"From "The Wide, Wide World:

"Read no novels."

"I never do, John. I knew you did not like it, and I have taken good care to keep out of the way of them."

 

Of course reading novels is not named as a sin anywhere in the book, but it is still treated as such - at least the beginning of a road leading to sin. 

So a question for you guys - do you agree? Is this how you live your life, or how you believe you should? Or is this more of the culture of the time period and less of the culture of christianity?

[OLD fashioned preacher]

We actually have a couple of things going on here (in the above quoted sections and the related questions) at once. I will respond in more depth after I return for church (leaving in about 45 minutes). Let me dip my toe in the water in this post by stating that one does not become a Christian (according to the Bible) by resolving to live a life in accordance with the Bible or "Christian values" (Ephesians 2:8-9  For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.    --- emphasis mine.)

 

Upon my return, I will address the position of alienation from God and the need for reconciliation (and its significance in relation to your stated and implied questions.)

 

[Jim_Alaska]

It would seem that your questions all revolve around "doing" something. This is called "works" in the Bible. The Bible says this about doing any "works" to please God.:

 Eph 2:7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. 
 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 
 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 
 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

So, I would have to both agree and disagree concerning your last question. The first and most critical aspect is being saved.

 Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

Without possessing His salvation there is nothing we can do to please God.

It is quite possible that you may never understand this concept while trying to see it through the eyes of unbelief. For it is only through faith and belief that Jesus died for your sins and has set you free to follow Him that you pass from death unto life and then are able to make sense and determine what it is that God wants of you.

I would suggest another book for you to read: The Bible, for it is God's Word and will set you on the right path without you having to guess. Another critical step is to find a good, Bible believing Independent Baptist Church and attend it so that God, through His Holy Spirit might open you eyes of understanding. here is another Scripture that underlines why I say this:

 1Cor 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. 
 19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. 
 20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? 
 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. 
 22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: 
 23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; 
 24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

You seem to be obviously seeking, but you will not find your answers on a message board; you will only find the answers to your questions in His Word, the Bible. While men may help and guide you, the answers will, in the end, come from God.

[Ronda]

Dear Chantie,

John 3:16-18
16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
17 "For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved."
18 "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

It's really very simple. Every person has a choice to make:
Believe upon Jesus for salvation and have eternal life...
OR deny Him/refuse to accept Him and be condemned to hell for eternity.

People who trust in their OWN "good works" to "get them to heaven" are not trusting in Jesus. There are even "religious" people who try to teach people this. But that goes against what God's word says.
You can do all the good works in the world, and still go to hell. Why? Because we ALL have sinned.

Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God"

What can WE do about that sin? Good works? NO!!! Accept and believe on Jesus alone for salvation.
He was the only perfect and acceptable propitiation for our sin. 
It's kind of like this simplistic story... a thief goes to court and the judge sentences him to death. But someone walks in and offers to PAY for the crimes. That innocent person paid the price for the guilty man's sins.
But Christ is FAR MORE than just an innocent person. He is God in the flesh.
(John 10:30 "I and my Father are one." )

Romans 5:8-12
8 "But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."
9 "Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him."
10 "For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life."
11 "And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement."

As for "good works", they are by no means frowned upon... BUT they won't get you to heaven. Only Christ can do that.
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."
The fact of the matter is that AFTER you have accepted/believed on Jesus alone for salvation, the Holy Spirit will indwell you and you will long to do things pleasing to God.
Just so long as you understand, it's not your OWN good works that "save" you. Only Jesus can save you!

I've do not know you, but I have said a prayer for you. I asked the Lord to lead you to His truth in Jesus. 
I would also like to suggest some reading for you as well. The King James Bible. 
God's plan for this age of grace is outlined in Romans to Philemon. Those books can explain to you why we are now under grace and not works.
What Christ did for us, how he willingly went to the cross, died, was buried, and resurrected, and how He now is in heaven preparing a place for those who have believed on Him is also must-read as well.
This is found in the gospels of Matthew-John. 
Other very valuable information from when Christ appeared after He was resurrected, to the early church to how the gentiles (anyone not born a Jew) were also brought into God's plan is found in Acts. The books of 1st-3rd Jon are also excellent.
ALL books of the Bible are profitable for learning. But it's important to note that the old testament was written about and for different dispensations (periods of time). The old testament books are excellent to read after you have digested the new testament. But they may confuse you if you start there, because they deal with the "law" and works.
We are not under "law" nor works anymore, but under grace. Christ paid the price that we couldn't pay ourselves. 

1 John 1:8-9
8 "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."
9 "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

Romans 10:9
"That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."

 

[OLD fashioned preacher]

Chantie: in further reflection, I realized that I should have asked you a couple of questions first. I did, however, say that I would mention reconciliation and therefore will briefly mention it, that I might keep my word.

 

The Bible declares that we are alienated from God (Eph 4:17-19  This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,  Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:  Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.)

What's more, we (mankind as a whole) are the enemies of God (Jas 4:4  Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.) Now, this may seem rather harsh and possibly a rash statement. In reality it's not. People (if they think there may be a God) tend to form God's actions and reactions after what their values would place Him into.They often assume that some people are wicked enough to deserve Hell and it wouldn't be right for them to ever see a glimpse of Heaven (Hitler, Pol Pot, child molesters) and that most are good enough that God would turn a blind eye to their little indiscretions. We rebel at the idea of God not handling life, this world and us according to our idea of right and just.So, we choose to alienate ourselves from Him when He doesn't do to suit us.

There is a reconciliation necessary, provided and available (Col 1:20-22  And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven  And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled  In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight) (2Co 5:17-19  Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.  And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation  To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.)

 

We may continue in this vein at a latter time but for now I have 2 questions that I would like to invite a frank and honest personal answer to:

1) At this time what is your opinion on the Bible?

2) At this time what is your opinion of Jesus of Nazareth, the one commonly referred to as "the Christ"?

 

 

 

 

[Chantie]

Ok, so a few responses to go throughJ I will respond to individuals, but anyone can feel free to respond to my questions or confusions.

 

@Jim_Alaska:

I agree I need to read the Bible. When I really started to think about it I was kind of surprised I had not read the Bible through, considering as much as I read. I haven’t skipped the Bible entirely of course, I have read bits and pieces here and there, but I am rather embarrassed at how little of it I have read. I plan on starting to remedy that today at work with my Kindle.

“It is quite possible that you may never understand this concept while trying to see it through the eyes of unbelief.”

That is rather discouraging. J Can you believe without completely believing? Can you accept something on faith without being entirely convinced of it?

“You seem to be obviously seeking, but you will not find your answers on a message board; you will only find the answers to your questions in His Word, the Bible.”

Not sure where you are going with this. Should I leave the forum? I was rather nervous coming here but there didn’t seem any rules banning non-christians so I registered. But if it is preferred I go elsewhere with my questions I can do so. I definitely understand why some people just need a place to be among their own so to speak, and if this is that case I would willingly bow out.

 

@Ronda (and most of the others):

I don’t really see those quotes as saying that doing something gets you saved persay. I believe these quotes are encouraging behavior that does not conflict with what the Bible has laid out as proper WHILE you work on the salvation issue, which I agree the Bible makes clear is through an issue of faith. But faith is a somewhat nebulous term. As I asked above – is it possible to have faith without having complete belief in something?

I appreciate you pointing me towards what exactly to read in the Bible. Since I am already somewhat familiar with the story of Jesus I will begin in the Romans to Philemon area you mentioned.

@Old fashioned preacher:

It is interesting how you talk about nonchristians being enemies of God, and going further in explaining that people often classify the actions of God according to their own values. One complaint I often see from people is “How can God allow pain to innocent people/christians/etc in life?” They often toss up stories of tragedy – young children with cancer, dedicated Christians suffering tragedies in their lives, etc. This complaint always makes me roll my eyes, and I am always quick to point out that if God is real, he is operating on a whole different level than we are. Children often think their entire world has ended when they find themselves under punishment from their parents, not understanding that the punishment is intended for their betterment. All the kids know is it hurts and ITS NOT FAIR! I figure the relationship between God and people would be that relationship on steroids. So what seems horrible and injust to us is mild to God, and not worthy of the temper tantrums it would earn.

Now that is not saying I don’t struggle with some things, but I understand that some things just aren’t easy for us to get.

“Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.  And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation”

This is a very interesting bible quote. I think I have heard it before. But…is the newness obvious to you? I mean, if you become saved, do you sense you are different? What changes in your life/heart? What would your response be to people who say they got saved and are Christians, but definitely don’t act like the Bible instructs them to act?

In response to your questions:

My opinion on the Bible is vast. Intellectually I see it was an ancient group of books that has had a huge impact on society and individuals throughout history. I believe there is a lot of wisdom and knowledge to be found in it, and I think the lifestyle it teaches is a good one to follow. Emotionally when I read the Bible I find it comforting. I have read several Bibles before but seem to prefer the older King James Version because of the ancient syntax. It reads like poetry.

I do however find the Bible confusing in many aspects. I don’t really understand how a lot of the books relate to each other – particularly in regards to the Old Testament vs New Testament. I believe that there is confusing language that results in doctrinal uncertainties – I have often heard “Make a statement and I can find a verse in the Bible that seems to support it.”

Do I believe the Bible is absolute truth? I don’t know. There is a part of me that feels like it is, and part of me that laughs at the idea of it.

My opinion on Christ…this is a bit more tricky. I suspect after I actually read all of the Gospels it may change, but right now…I think he was a good guyJ A teache, a revolutionary, a charismatic pacifist. Do I believe he is God? I dunno….I’m not even sure he thought so.

[OLD fashioned preacher]

Chantie,

Thank you for returning. Don't think that you are not welcome here, incidentally I don't believe Jim was implying that you aren't. He was merely starting that if you want Biblical truth, go to the Bible not 45 opinions on 64 questions. As to a desire to discuss things "amongst you own kind" without dealing with "strangers in the yard", the owner and administrator of this site (Bro.Matt) created limited access areas so that the general view areas would be open for those who are curious, etc so long as they "behave" (petty much the common courtesy you would exhibit when invited into someone else's home).

I am currently at a track meet (I drive a bus for the public school system, among other jobs), my computer isn't booting up, I failed to bring a stylus for my tablet and trying to post is proving quite laborious under my present circumstances. If I can't get my issues resolved before I get home (in about 14 hours), I will continue my response then.

Incidentally, most folk around here just abbreviate my screen name to OFP (save your typing fingers some effort).

[Ronda]

Dear Chantie, 
God (the father), Jesus (the son), and the Holy Spirit are one. This is what we call the trinity.

9 hours ago, Chantie said:

Do I believe he is God? I dunno….I’m not even sure he thought so.

"I and my Father are one" (John 10:33)

He made another such statement in John 8:58 
"Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am."

I don't know how much you know/dont know about the Bible, or if you realize who Abraham was. 
This was quite a statement for Jesus to make, seeing that Abraham was alive about 2000 years before Jesus' virgin birth.
So not only was He telling them He has been in existence much longer than Abraham, but He made the statement "I AM".
This probably doesn't sound like much to anyone who doesn't know the account of how God Himself came to Moses to reveal His will for His people Israel.
In Exodus 3, Moses was asking the Lord God what name He should tell the Israelites, and here is the account of His answer:

Exodus 3:14-15
"And God said unto Moses, I Am That I Am: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I Am hath sent me unto you.
And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, the Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations."

So it was a HUGE deal when Jesus said "I AM"... the Jewish people knew exactly who He was claiming to be, it enraged many because they knew who the great "I AM" is. God Himself.
(But I also need to mention, not ALL Jewish people then were outraged, some already understood that Jesus was the Messiah).
One of his disciples (Thomas) recognized this aloud as well, here's Thomas' words when he addressed Jesus:
John 20:28 " And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God."

In the book it Titus, Paul is addressing Christian believers when he says:
Titus 2:13 "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ"

These above show clearly the deity of Christ.
There are other like verses, if you wish I will bring forth more for you. 

Isaiah 53 also gives many prophetic words about how the Messiah would be treated by many of them... how they would hide their faces from Him, despise Him, and more.
Here are a couple of essential verses pertaining to what was foretold Christ would do on the cross:
Isaiah 53:5-6
"But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed."
"All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the Lord hath laid on him the iniquity of us all."

Jesus willingly went to the cross to bear the burden of all of our sins. He bore "the iniquity of us all".
And YES, He did bear my sins and your sins, and the sins of all the world... BUT you are not "automatically" forgiven and saved from the condemnation of hell. You must believe on Christ alone to save you (John 3:16-18, John 14:6, Romans 10:9-10, Acts 4:12, Eph. 2:8-9, 2 Cor. 5:15-21 and many others)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Now as for what brother Jim said, he is correct in that you won't be able to fully grasp what the Bibe has to teach until after you have accepted Christ alone for salvation.
He (and I) do not mean it as a slight or offense to you... it is this verse (and others like it) with which he drew from to make that statement:

1 Cor. 2:14 "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned."

As I tried to explain above, that when you believe and accept Jesus alone for salvation, the Holy Spirit will then indwell you.
I hope you see the dilemma there... you can only understand so much before having the Holy Spirit indwelling to lead and guide.
He will reveal to you enough for you to know that you (as we all are) are a sinner... in need of a savior. None of us can "save ourselves", as I attempted to explain above.
He has already revealed that you (as we all have) have a choice to make... the most important choice ever.

John 3:18 "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

Those are strong words, but essential to allow the Lord to speak to you through those words. 
The good news is you can come to Christ just as you are... you don't need to try to do "good works" or improve yourself BEFORE coming to Christ for salvation.
He gives an open offer to whosoever will. Do you understand that you (as everyone is) are a sinner? Do you realize that God is righteous and demands payment for sin? 
Do you realize that you can't "save yourself", that only One who is perfect and sinless can pay that price for you?
Sadly... many people get hung up on those 3 things... they don't want to admit they are sinners.
Next, they don't want to admit they are accountable to the One who made all things.
And last, they refuse to recognize that only One who is perfect and sinless is the only acceptable atonement to God. We can't do that ourselves, and very sadly this is where many will stumble. Pride is the biggest culprit. Some try to "make" God fit into what their idea of what they think God "should be" to them. This is by far the biggest mistake. God's word reveals to us His attributes, His righteousness, His plan for mankind. But first we have to come to Him on His terms... not make up our own terms.

9 hours ago, Chantie said:

I don’t really see those quotes as saying that doing something gets you saved persay. I believe these quotes are encouraging behavior that does not conflict with what the Bible has laid out as proper WHILE you work on the salvation issue, which I agree the Bible makes clear is through an issue of faith. But faith is a somewhat nebulous term. As I asked above – is it possible to have faith without having complete belief in something?

I'm not trying to discourage you... I just hope you realize how important it is to come to the Lord on His terms instead of our own (make them up as we go type) of terms. 
These verses below (and others like them) are God's terms.. we can't twist them around to fit what we want to them to say.
I have been praying for you, Chantie, and praying that the Lord will open your eyes to what He is trying to reveal to you:

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
17 "For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved."
18 "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

Romans 10:9-10
9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
10 "For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

So I'm sorry to say that we ourselves don't "work on the salvation issue", the salvation issue has already been worked out by God who sent Christ to pay for our salvation. But we have a choice to make... accept/believe upon Christ alone for salvation, or reject Him and His salvation. Can you have faith in something (or someone) you don't believe? In this case, I would say no. Those verses are clear... belief is a requirement.

[Jim_Alaska]

Chantie,

Both Ronda and OFP are correct in clarifying what I meant in my reply to you. I am sorry if it seemed like I was saying you were not welcome here, because you certainly are welcome.

I am sure that everyone here would be more than happy to answer any questions you may have. But in the end, any answers to your questions must come from God and His Word.

While folks here may be able to give guidance and point you in the right direction, only God can affect a change in your life through His Holy Spirit. This is why I suggested that your primary focus should be turned to His Word (the Bible) and His Church.

God speaks to us through both mediums. His Holy Spirit inspired the Bible and is therefore very important:
2Tim 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

His church is indispensable simply because when the church meets, His Holy Spirit is present with them. His function in church capacity is as The Divine Teacher. 
 John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

When God's Word is preached His Holy Spirit is able to empower the word preached in such a way that it will show people their real condition before a Holy, Just and Righteous God and also present Jesus Christ as the remedy of our fallen condition.