"Misquoting Jesus" destroying the faith of Christians

[brandplucked]

Well Kevin, here is your big chance to prove me wrong and demonstrate to all the listening board here just how fallacious, biased and unfounded my claim is. Would you mind telling us all just exactly where we can all buy ourselves a copy of this infallible Bible you seem to think exists out there somewhere that is not the King James Bible. Go for it, Kevin. Please disabuse me of my "fallacious contention".

Waiting to hear from you on this......

Will

[kevinmiller]

Sorry Will, I know you'd like that. But I've learned the hard way that discussing anything with you is nothing more than a waste of bandwidth.

[Guest Guest]

Sorry Will' date=' I know you'd like that. But I've learned the hard way that discussing anything with you is nothing more than a waste of bandwidth.[/quote']

Typical Alexandrianism.

[Guest Guest]

I am not arguing any definitions. Inspiration means "breathed into" - based on the two root words. My argument is that the passage in Job and the passage in 2 Timothy are not both referring to the Bible' date=' just because they both use the same word. 2 Timothy is saying God breathed life into the Scriptures, He inspired them. Job is dealing with a completely different context - about giving man understanding, not about giving the Word of God.[/quote']

Jerry, I simply used the Bible to define the word "inspiration." Now, if you'd rather use your own definition, be my guest; just don't expect me or anyone else to take you seriously if you're going to ignore something as blatantly simple and straightforward as this. Again, it doesn't say what you like, so it has to mean something else, no? Either spiritualize it or explain it away: typical IFB MO.

[Guest Guest]

Being that you fail to enlighten me as to which "man-made belief system" I'm supposedly a part of' date=' I suppose I'll be left in the dark as to your implication. Oh well, I won't lose any sleep tonight.[/quote']

I may be wrong here and correct me if I am Kevin, but I believe the "man-made belief system" he is referring to is that created by those who profess a certain version (whether it be KJV, Geneva, Catholic, NIV, NRSV . . .) to be the ONLY preservation of God's word. I'll concede that a biblical author wrote in the bible that God would preserve the bible, to bad he didn't mention which version it would be. I think you'd have a lot more success at your "soul-winning" if you quit arguing over WHICH book and started working together to spread the gospel message, which is essentially the same in every bible I have ever read.

I really don't see what you guys are getting so worked up over. If the book says Jesus was God's only begotten son, he was born of a virgin, was crucified under pontius pilate for our sins, that he was buried and arose from the dead, that he ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the father, that he will one day come again in glory . . . and of course that whomever believes in him shall not parish and have ever lasting life, then I don't see what the problem is. Seems to me that as long as you have that message then it doesn't matter if its written on a piece of construction paper in crayon, i.e., you don't need a specific book to get and spread the gospel message of salvation.

[kevinmiller]

Actually, choosing not to argue with obnoxious people who simply use their time to bully and mock those with differing opinions has nothing to do with some made-up cult of "Alexandrianism." It's impossible to argue with you or Will because you are so blinded by your preconceptions that you refuse to hear what people say but, rather, simply tell them that they have no Bible as their authority. I would much rather spend my time with people who aren't hung up on worshipping the KJV but can actually obey what's in it and edify and love one another.

[Guest Guest]

I would much rather spend my time with people who aren't hung up on worshipping the KJV but can actually obey what's in it and edify and love one another.

AMEN

This is probably the most Christ like statement I have ever read on this board. Sometimes I think people place so much emphasis on the actual bible (rather than the message) that they are practicing idoltry.

[Guest Guest]

"John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day."

[Psalms18_28]

AMEN

This is probably the most Christ like statement I have ever read on this board. Sometimes I think people place so much emphasis on the actual bible (rather than the message) that they are practicing idoltry.

While what he says is true, but you can't edify and love one another without the bible (God's instructions).

Nor you can learn about God without the bible. We can go all our life saying George Washington is the first president of the U.S. but can we really know who George Washington is, what he have done, how he became the first president, etc. without any historical documents?

(BTW, just to let everyone know, I do believe there were other manuscripts before KJV)

[Guest Guest]

I don't believe that anyone is contending that the bible is no longer necessary or that it isn't the best recording we have of Christ life and ministry. The problem comes with arguing that one version is absolutely without a doubt more authorative than another. In reference to the above George Washington example, Psalm is right, we would not have a detailed account of Washingtons life without written records. However, we have several different books about George Washington, and even if those books have differences, they still say that he was the first president.

The fact is, God would have sent Christ to die for our sins as a means for our salvation whether anybody wrote it down or not. God does not need to bible. He exists without and outside of the Bible.

[Psalms18_28]

yes, God doesn't need the bible, but this is what he choose to do.

[Guest Guest]

I don't believe that anyone is contending that the bible is no longer necessary or that it isn't the best recording we have of Christ life and ministry. The problem comes with arguing that one version is absolutely without a doubt more authorative than another. In reference to the above George Washington example, Psalm is right, we would not have a detailed account of Washingtons life without written records. However, we have several different books about George Washington, and even if those books have differences, they still say that he was the first president.

The fact is, God would have sent Christ to die for our sins as a means for our salvation whether anybody wrote it down or not. God does not need the bible. He exists without and outside of the Bible.

[Guest Guest]

AMEN

This is probably the most Christ like statement I have ever read on this board. Sometimes I think people place so much emphasis on the actual bible (rather than the message) that they are practicing idoltry.

Jesus NEVER placed any importance on "the message." Neither did Paul, for that matter. The WORDS are the important part, and if you don't have God's WORDS, you have nothing.

[282Mikado]

IMO salvation is a gift from God and the scripture necessary to get you there and support it can be found In most if not all the modern versions of the Bible (though I haven't read them all).

I happen to be KJV only, but as my wife says, "if I was on a desert island I would rather have an NIV (any non-KJV Bible will fit here) than no Bible at all." If I could not get a KJV it would be good to at least have something so I could get a semblance of God's word.

Having said this, I do believe that the KJV is God's pure, inspired word for the English language and it is my soul source.

My point is: If you believe the Bible is the true and wholly inspired word of God, you have to ask yourself which english version is the correct one. There are enough significant differences between the revisions to make choosing the correct version very important. Which one you choose is between you and God, but if you truly believe in the infallible word, don't you have to choose one only? After this we can agree to disagree and hopefully have strong arguements to defend our position.

[Guest Guest]

Jesus NEVER placed any importance on "the message." Neither did Paul' date=' for that matter. The WORDS are the important part, and if you don't have God's WORDS, you have nothing.[/quote']

Jesus also NEVER requires anyone to have a bible, or even to have heard of the bible, to obtain salvation. There is no literacy requirement, nor any scholarly qualifications. And I'll respectfully disagree with the "if you don't have God's WORDS, you have nothing," part if only for the simple reason that you still have Jesus. All the Christians in communist Russia were stripped of their bibles. Some of their children never saw a bible. But they still had their faith in Christ. That's one thing you can't take away from people.

I know it's not your point, but someone would be justified in concluding that you believe the bible IS God, rather than OF God. I'm not saying that I think you believe that, just that it might appear to some that you do.