Shut Up While I Am Preaching...

[Ukulelemike]

Anytime I ask anyone a question I tell them to answer it to their self only.

 

I was reading on another forum recently & one fellow said that during preaching service those in the congregation should be allowed to talk back to the pastor & that's the way it always been done.

 

I never seen such, & the first time I have heard of it.

 

But one Sunday morning several years back after i stated, & before I could read a verse, a woman hollered out quite loud, "Your wrong," when I stated that a saved person who is living in sin that God will not hear their prayers.

 

Ps 66:18 If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:

 

Afterwards she apologize saying I was wrong.

 

And sometime later I learned that she had gave up her young child to her husband to marry a man who had $$$$$$$$$$$ & had never had another thing to do with that child.

I suspect my reply would have been, "Let the women keep silence in church, for it is not permitted for them to speak, but to be in silence." AND I suspect I might not have remained pastor for very long.

[Ukulelemike]

If I may add a dimension to this subject, How many have a problem with prayer request time becoming, 'air one's differences with another member" time?

 

Just had this happen yesterday. We take prayer requests and while I prefer, (for this very reason), that they be written down for me, there are a few whose writing skills are less than adequate, so we do take them verbally.

 

In this case a fellow in the church piped up with, "We should pray that some people who are looking for a job should stop just looking for one job of their choosing and take any job they can." This was, mind you, squarely directed at my wife, who is a nurse and she has been looking for a nursing job. Understand, in principle, I agree, but where we live, what we would spend to get her to a minimum wage job, in gas or bus, (being 40 miles one way, or 60 miles the other to the nearest areas with jobs), would be about the same as what she would make. So its really not feasible.

  Now, this guy began to get really hot, too, because he is VERY anti-doctor and medical, and my wife being a nurse, he considers her a drug-dealer and poisoner. Oddly, he goes to the doctor a lot for his medical conditions and take medications. But., his mind is a bit feeble due to some mental issues he has.

 

Oddly again, this is the same guy who, a month ago, declared that people shouldn't use prayer request time to talk about others, after a woman had told of the many problems her family has had, (and they have).

 

BY the way, he DID apologize before the church, at least for losing his temper. he used to be much worse. This is him after improvement.

 

So, this is what I work with. Anyone else have issues like this?

[HappyChristian]

Usually on Thursday nights, before we break up into our prayer groups, the pastor will ask if anything happened that day that hadn't been able to be put on the prayer sheet (we get a list weekly and are encouraged to call requests in to be added).  He will occasionally mention that, to save time, people are encouraged to call the church with requests to be put on the paper. (I suspect it's a time saver but also to avoid a happenstance like your example, Uke).

 

I only remember one time in our over 24 years here that something akin to what you mentioned began to happen.  A man had been picking up and bringing home someone who lived in another town (this someone was pretty demanding and hard to handle at times) and needed help because he couldn't afford to do it all the time and was having a rough time with her (he always had someone with him).  Anyway, as soon as he began to mention it beyond a prayer request, the pastor spoke up (it helps that the pastor had the microphone) he said that it was a legitimate issue but it wasn't the right place or time to discuss it.  He said it nicely, and the man stopped.  (help did come for him, by the way)  I don't know if it's possible for you to do something like that - but actually what the man said in your church was an actual attack on someone, where this wasn't. It was more a frustrated plea for help.

[Salyan]

And to add to that list...

If we teach for doctrines the commandments of men, the Lord will not hear us.

Matthew 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

 

I know what doctrine you're aiming at, and I'm not going there. However, just for the sake of argument (in general, not as applied to any particular doctrine), I'd like to contend that that verse does not apply to the previous 'list.'  The psalm is speaking of believers whose prayers are not heard as they are living in stubborn sin. Matthew 15 is speaking to and of unbelievers, who claim to worship the true God but are following the doctrines of men rather than of the Lord, and thus not worshipping Him at all. One is referring to believers, the other to unbelievers. Not the same thing at all.

[Salyan]

If I may add a dimension to this subject, How many have a problem with prayer request time becoming, 'air one's differences with another member" time?

 

Just had this happen yesterday. We take prayer requests and while I prefer, (for this very reason), that they be written down for me, there are a few whose writing skills are less than adequate, so we do take them verbally.

 

In this case a fellow in the church piped up with, "We should pray that some people who are looking for a job should stop just looking for one job of their choosing and take any job they can." This was, mind you, squarely directed at my wife, who is a nurse and she has been looking for a nursing job. Understand, in principle, I agree, but where we live, what we would spend to get her to a minimum wage job, in gas or bus, (being 40 miles one way, or 60 miles the other to the nearest areas with jobs), would be about the same as what she would make. So its really not feasible.

  Now, this guy began to get really hot, too, because he is VERY anti-doctor and medical, and my wife being a nurse, he considers her a drug-dealer and poisoner. Oddly, he goes to the doctor a lot for his medical conditions and take medications. But., his mind is a bit feeble due to some mental issues he has.

 

Oddly again, this is the same guy who, a month ago, declared that people shouldn't use prayer request time to talk about others, after a woman had told of the many problems her family has had, (and they have).

 

BY the way, he DID apologize before the church, at least for losing his temper. he used to be much worse. This is him after improvement.

 

So, this is what I work with. Anyone else have issues like this?

 

We had a lady once who liked to give testimonies that were beginning to morph into speeches. Once  at church (it was some kind of special service - not Sunday morning - only the regulars were there), and when called on to give her testimony, came up to the front of the church (!) and proceeded to ramble on in a testimony/'preaching' for some 10-15 minutes. Most of us stopped paying attention - I found myself looking up the verses on not allowing a woman to speak. I asked Pastor after why he didn't stop her; he said that he considered telling her to sit down, but figured that everyone in the audience knew what she was up to anyways, so for this time he didn't. After that, though, we did stop doing testimonies in the morning service and switched to evening service. She rarely comes to that service, and it is mostly just the regulars. Pastor did say that situations like these are why some churches end up having to stop the public testimony time.

[Ukulelemike]

We had a lady once who liked to give testimonies that were beginning to morph into speeches. Once  at church (it was some kind of special service - not Sunday morning - only the regulars were there), and when called on to give her testimony, came up to the front of the church (!) and proceeded to ramble on in a testimony/'preaching' for some 10-15 minutes. Most of us stopped paying attention - I found myself looking up the verses on not allowing a woman to speak. I asked Pastor after why he didn't stop her; he said that he considered telling her to sit down, but figured that everyone in the audience knew what she was up to anyways, so for this time he didn't. After that, though, we did stop doing testimonies in the morning service and switched to evening service. She rarely comes to that service, and it is mostly just the regulars. Pastor did say that situations like these are why some churches end up having to stop the public testimony time.

We don't do a lot of the testimony times because we get either, a: "Thank God for my husband and my dog and anything at all without giving any kind of testimony at all for 5 minutes, or b: see my last post. We get very little real testimony-it just becomes time to have attention on yourself. One lady we have, again, one with some certain, shall we say, limitation, when I ask if there are question about the lesson, will pipe up with something essentially irrelevant to the lesson, but some word she picked up on, she'll pork hard at creating a question on the spot, just so she can get some attention.  

 

I have to admit, while I love my folks, we do have an odd bunch! Many damaged to one extent or another, with limited ability to really 'get it', some who seem to really care little about anything we do-never come to special meetings, unless there's food attached to it. But, these are they whom the Lord has blessed me with, and maybe it says more about me than them, eh?

[Salyan]

Sounds like they are a bunch that need extra care and compassion. If God's given them to you, that must be saying something good.

[Ukulelemike]

Sounds like they are a bunch that need extra care and compassion. If God's given them to you, that must be saying something good.

Very kind of you to say. I just figured, you know, "Sweets for the sweet", and I have a bunch of nuts? LOL

 

Seriously, I love these folks-they drive my wife a bit crazy, but I keep reminding her that she's called to be my wife, not their co-pastor.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

I know what doctrine you're aiming at, and I'm not going there. However, just for the sake of argument (in general, not as applied to any particular doctrine), I'd like to contend that that verse does not apply to the previous 'list.'  The psalm is speaking of believers whose prayers are not heard as they are living in stubborn sin. Matthew 15 is speaking to and of unbelievers, who claim to worship the true God but are following the doctrines of men rather than of the Lord, and thus not worshipping Him at all. One is referring to believers, the other to unbelievers. Not the same thing at all.

So it's perfectly OK for Believers to teach for doctrines the commandments of men.

Unbelievable! 

[MountainChristian]

Some times when the preacher is preaching about making errors and running himself down, I'll say "me too preacher" because I've done the same stupid things.

[Salyan]

So it's perfectly OK for Believers to teach for doctrines the commandments of men.

Unbelievable! 

 

That's not what I said, and you know it. I'm just challenging your application of that particular scripture. I don't doubt that if a Christian knowingly teaches false doctrine, that God won't hear their prayers - because it will fall under the stubbornness addressed in Psalms. Whether or not He will hear their prayers if they are unknowingly teaching it is another question for discussion. The passage you quoted in Matthew applies to unbelievers, and is thus inapplicable to the discussion on Christians. Take it and roll with it, or don't, but don't go getting all accusatory.

[JerryNumbers]

It is tempting to get the members involded, but this can lead a good message into a disaster.

 

I can understand why it could be tempting at times to say something out loud while the pastor is preaching. For they may say something we totally disagree with. Yet that would be the wrong time, & if we would think about it for a while, count to 10, we just might change our mind. Plus we should want to hold our tongue thus showing respect to everyone else that's listening as well as the pastor. Plus in a sudden outburst we may say something we wish we did not.

 

I forget the Scriptures, but there's one in the New Testament that implies we should do everything in Jesus' Church in a decent & orderly manner. If everyone spoke out during preaching I don't believe that would be decent & orderly.

 

Now that's my opinion on the matter at hand.

[JerryNumbers]

You may be getting near the danger zone in my opinion. For doing this in the service, not for bible study or Sunday school.

 

I agree. Who knows, one may leave that church & become a member of another church somewhere else & blurt out a question during the sermon & disrupt the service. Plus it make kill the train of thought for someone else who is there that may be coming under convictions. Just last Sunday there was a young woman trying to talk to her younger brother who was setting in front of her, & I feel positive this killed his train of thought. No telling how many times something such as that happens during preaching services & a person walks out lost instead of saved.

 

And stopping to answer a question can change the topic, one can lose their train of thought & the pastor may not make the point God intended him to. As for me I do my best to carry a message to each service that I feel God has led me to give them. Of course I'm human & fail at times.

[JerryNumbers]

I don't agree with the statement that God will not hear their prayers. How is one to seek God's help in sin if not in prayer?

 

Are you saying you disagree with this verse?

 

Ps 66:18 If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:

 

In a situation such as this the only prayer God will hear is that person asking for forgiveness, confessing their sin or sins. Sin separates a person from God. The above verse, iniquity is referring to sin, & the Lord will not hear is referring to their prayers.

[JerryNumbers]

I suspect my reply would have been, "Let the women keep silence in church, for it is not permitted for them to speak, but to be in silence." AND I suspect I might not have remained pastor for very long.

 

The best thing to do in such a situation is to keep on preaching the truth, & not get upset, no blurt out something you will be sorry for. My wife bragged on me that Sunday, that is unusual for her. She said the moment it happened she feared what I would do, yet I stayed calm & went on & explained what I had stated & everything turned out for the good.

 

And besides that, afterward the services the woman who done this apologized asking me to forgive her saying, "I was completely wrong in what I stated, I should  not done have it & I thank you very much for the way you handled it. Its a fact I was wrong & you were right."

 

So what good would it have done as you say you might have?