How strongly would you try to dissuade a 17-year old from getting an eyebrow barbell?

[John81]

It still isn't condoning earrings. It's just making a statement. Neither does it condemn them (on wives, as the passage speaks of). This passage doesn't refer to male ear piercing. There are other passages that do, but they can't be seen as condoning men wearing earrings...

Amen! It's so uplifting reading your "sticking to Scripture rightly divided" postings.

[farouk]

It still isn't condoning earrings. It's just making a statement. Neither does it condemn them (on wives, as the passage speaks of). This passage doesn't refer to male ear piercing. There are other passages that do, but they can't be seen as condoning men wearing earrings...

Happy Christian:

Oh okay, Now I see how you're using the phrase 'not condoning'.

I thought you meant 'not condoning' as referring to being unscriptural and indefensible, in your view.

Now I see that you were referring to it being neither one way nor the other.

[Keifer]

Keifer:

Thanks for this; the same passage seems to say about not shaving. Do you shave? and how do you handle it exegetically?

Blessings.

The passage says nothing of shaving Farouk, nor insinuates so. You need to go to the original Hebrew text for your answer. The word used in this Scripture for 'cuttings' is "sehret" which means "an incision". In modern vernacular it would mean 'piercings'. The verse is saying not to make any piercings in or tattos on your flesh.

As a father one has to do as he's led when dealing with his son. If he were mine, there would be neither piercings nor tattoos as long as he lived in my house.

[farouk]

The passage says nothing of shaving Farouk, nor insinuates so. You need to go to the original Hebrew text for your answer. The word used in this Scripture for 'cuttings' is "sehret" which means "an incision". In modern vernacular it would mean 'piercings'. The verse is saying not to make any piercings in or tattos on your flesh.

As a father one has to do as he's led when dealing with his son. If he were mine, there would be neither piercings nor tattoos as long as he lived in my house.

Keifer:

I was thinking of the previous verse (27):

'Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard. '

Just making an honest, exegetical enquiry. (Maybe it doesn't help that I don't go to an independent baptist church, and I'm not in the US, so I'm maybe not fully part of the exact, cultural scene, though I would certainly agree with a great deal of what you guys stand for.)

Blessings.

(John81: Thanks for your comments; again, it might be a cultural thing, to some extent.) Edited July 28, 2011 by farouk

[HappyChristian]

Being in an IFB church and living in the US has nothing to do with it. There's enough similarity between the culture of Canada and the US for that to be a moot issue, farouk. And, regardless of church affiliation, the Bible is to be followed.

Those verses are dealing with NOT following the fads and practices of the pagans with whom Israel was surrounded. Our application? Not following the fads of the world, not being swayed by the philosophy of the world, as per instruction in the NT to be separate from the world, to God.

[farouk]

Being in an IFB church and living in the US has nothing to do with it. There's enough similarity between the culture of Canada and the US for that to be a moot issue, farouk. And, regardless of church affiliation, the Bible is to be followed.

Those verses are dealing with NOT following the fads and practices of the pagans with whom Israel was surrounded. Our application? Not following the fads of the world, not being swayed by the philosophy of the world, as per instruction in the NT to be separate from the world, to God.

HappyChristian:

In general terms I agree, yes. There is truth to what you say.

Deb did point out the verse where sons wore earrings in the Old Testament, so it's not completely without precedent.

Blessings.

[HappyChristian]

Yes, Deb did point those out. But those verses don't condone earrings on males. Remember, they were about to make a grave image with those earrings. And where did they put those earrings in? Why, in Egypt, the picture of the world....

[farouk]

Yes, Deb did point those out. But those verses don't condone earrings on males. Remember, they were about to make a grave image with those earrings. And where did they put those earrings in? Why, in Egypt, the picture of the world....

Happy Christian:

From Exodus 32.2, it could I suppose be argued that the folk should have kept their earrings in, rather than taken them out and used them for the purpose they did. :unsure:

[John81]

HappyChristian:

In general terms I agree, yes. There is truth to what you say.

Deb did point out the verse where sons wore earrings in the Old Testament, so it's not completely without precedent.

Blessings.

Could you answer post #90 so we may have a better idea of what you have in mind?

I noticed when you were addressed directly on an issue in the thread on swimming pools you locked the thread rather than answering. In another thread when you were asked about the meaning of your screen name, given it's Arabic roots and possible conotations, you brushed them off.

[HappyChristian]

John, I don't know if farouk's name is actually that (your name can be whatever you want, farouk), but I do know the meaning of the name is "person who knows right from wrong." Perhaps, if that isn't his real name, that's why he chose it? :icon_smile:

[farouk]

John81:

A lot of questions there, some of them not quite on topic, but here goes:

Re. screen name, I'm not Arab, actually. There was a king years ago called Farouk, anyway, who was in the news a lot.

Re. swimsuits: I must confess that I've not moved in church circles where such stringent control is exercised by church members on other people's swimwear. I'm not an expert and I guess part of me says, don't interfere, although it would be nice to think that people wanted to stay modest.

Re. your local church customs: whether one uses the word culture or not, it's true that there is often a whole lot of unspoken assumptions from one sort of local church to another and sometimes when things may seem generally the same among those who share similar theological and doctrinal convictions, there is some unspoken thing which can arise.

Hope this clarifies.

(I'm thinking the jewelry aspect is being lost here a bit, now.)

Blessings.

(PS: Haven't had lunch, yet, so I'll be back later.)

Edited July 28, 2011 by farouk

[John81]

John, I don't know if farouk's name is actually that (your name can be whatever you want, farouk), but I do know the meaning of the name is "person who knows right from wrong." Perhaps, if that isn't his real name, that's why he chose it?

I wasn't saying that was his real name, which is why I mentioned "screen" name. I was simply pointing out that another had asked him about it and he brushed it off, similar as he did a couple other times he was questioned.

In any event, thank you for your input, if I recall, one of the reasons the person asked about his name was because of that meaning.

Not that it matters, that was a side issue if even an issue at all.

While I have the opportunity, I want to thank you for the many good posts you have put forth of late. They have been edifying and encouraging.

Now it's time to do some Bible study and have quiet time with the Lord. I'm thankful I don't need an apron for that today, it's HOT!

[John81]

John81:

A lot of questions there, some of them not quite on topic, but here goes:

Re. screen name, I'm not Arab, actually. There was a king years ago called Farouk, anyway, who was in the news a lot.

Re. swimsuits: I must confess that I've not moved in church circles where such stringent control is exercised by church members on other people's swimwear. I'm not an expert and I guess part of me says, don't interfere, although it would be nice to think that people wanted to stay modest.

Re. your local church customs: whether one uses the word culture or not, it's true that there is often a whole lot of unspoken assumptions from one sort of local church to another and sometimes when things may seem generally the same among those who share similar theological and doctrinal convictions, there is some unspoken thing which can arise.

Hope this clarifies.

(I'm thinking the jewelry aspect is being lost here a bit, now.)

Blessings.

(PS: Haven't had lunch, yet, so I'll be back later.)

This doesn't really answer my questions...

With regards to swimsuits, it's not about any church having control, it's about what the Bible says with regards to modestly. Most one piece swimsuits are immodest while all bikinis are exceedingly immodest. No one who is not married should see another of the opposite sex showing that much and those parts of their body.

That's Scripture, not church control.

Regarding your screen name, I didn't actually ask about that, another did in reference to it's meaning. I never said you were an Arab, even if you chose the name of an Arab king.

[HappyChristian]

:ot: Let's get back to topic, now... (farouk - that king was a nutter!)

[1John2:15-17]

This seems to happen every now and then, a non-IFB joins in and "seemingly" tries to convince OB of worldly ways.

I agree with the comment above, geography matters not when it comes to scripture.