Matthew 24 Fulfilled

[Covenanter]

what is the pre-terrorist view anyway?

Oppressed groups who see no hope of redress by constitutional means;
Citizens of a defeated country who seek to harass the occupying power;
People who are open to 'preachers of hate' who are stirred up to try to overthrow a legitimate government.

It's a matter of definition, & in some cases the terrorists become accepted as the government, & then redefine the former government supporters as
terrorists.

Nelson Mandela was imprisoned for 25 years as a terrorist, & became president. Other former terrorists who become the legitimate government include Jomo Kenyatta & David Ben Gurion.

State terrorism, as conducted by repressive regimes is much more deadly than most opposition terrorism.


The preterist view is that OT prophecy focuses of the Lord Jesus Christ & his saving work, & a glorious future for all his redeemed, who, regardless of ethnicity are Abraham's seed.

Gal 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Gal 3:26 ¶ For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Further, the Olivet prophecy refers to AD 70, with all the signs being for the Jerusalem Christians to leave the city before the destruction. We see 2 Thes. 2 & much of Revelation as relating to AD 70. These are the events that must take place before Jesus returns for resurrection & judgement, & to bring about the NH&NE.

2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for [that day shall not come], except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Edited February 10, 2011 by Covenanter

[Covenanter]

Bro Jim - any comment on my post #11 ???

The originators of dispensationalism rejected the authority of the KJV.

[trc123]

Bro Jim - any comment on my post #11 ???

The originators of dispensationalism rejected the authority of the KJV.

Perhaps, but we are more enlightened and better equipped to judge everything within our own minds now.

[John81]

Bro Jim - any comment on my post #11 ???

The originators of dispensationalism rejected the authority of the KJV.

I would be interested to hear this expounded upon.

[Bro Jim]

The modern translation issue is not relevant to this discussion. The pioneers of disp made their own 'Bibles.'

Dispensationalism was developed by Darby, who made his own translation, & popularised by Scofield, whose notes are based on Westcott & Hort, e.g.

I reckon I'm not sure where dispensations came into this, and then is that particular subject go into the 3, 4, or 7 disp. views, I believe there is only and has been only one way to Heaven and that is by the grace of God, through the Blood of Jesus Christ.

My Bible KJB has 1Jo 5:7 "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one." I don't take Scofield or Darby or Criswell or Thompson or the Open Bible etc, etc., notes as the Gospel, any more than i would take Abbot, Clarke, Matthew Henry's commentaries as the Gospel either.

One of the reasons Bro. Coleman left the SBC was that they were going MV and that "schools" were teaching that the fallability of the Word of God.

Am I a Pretribulationist, yes, will I remain so, yes, do I blindly follow what men say, no, am I a Bible scholar, no.

[Covenanter]

Southern Baptist Evangelist says: Jesus NOT coming back soon

Most would say we should always be ready for his sudden & unannounced return.

Can you quote precisely what he wrote, or provide a link. Edited February 10, 2011 by Covenanter

[John81]

Most would say we should always be ready for his sudden & unannounced return.

Can you quote precisely what he wrote, or provide a link.

The book can be found at this link:
http://www.americanvision.com/products/Matthew-24-Fulfilled.html

[Covenanter]

The book can be found at this link:
http://www.americanvision.com/products/Matthew-24-Fulfilled.html

Thanks - interesting - I have been to that website for helpful information before. I have two of Gary DeMar's books.

I note you quoted from the resume on the link, but I did not see that sub-title.

What I did see was another book title with the question mark: Is Jesus Coming Soon?

The answer is that the Mat. 24 signs relate to AD 70, so the events of our day & other times in history where "apocalyptic signs" appeared are NOT signs that the Lord's return is imminent. Rather -

Mark 13:31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
32 ¶ But of that day and [that] hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
33 Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
34 [For the Son of man is] as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.
35 Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
36 Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.
37 And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.

[John81]

Thanks - interesting - I have been to that website for helpful information before. I have two of Gary DeMar's books.

I note you quoted from the resume on the link, but I did not see that sub-title.

What I did see was another book title with the question mark: Is Jesus Coming Soon?

The answer is that the Mat. 24 signs relate to AD 70, so the events of our day & other times in history where "apocalyptic signs" appeared are NOT signs that the Lord's return is imminent. Rather -

Mark 13:31 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.
32 ¶ But of that day and [that] hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
33 Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.
34 [For the Son of man is] as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.
35 Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:
36 Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.
37 And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.

What I posted in the OP came from an ad for the book I received via email.

[Covenanter]

What I posted in the OP came from an ad for the book I received via email.

I wonder where the s/t came from.

[Covenanter]

Where does the Bible say "Jesus is coming soon?" It says Rev 22:20 ¶ He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

"Quickly" is speed of coming, whereas "soon" means within a short time.

Knowing Jesus is coming quickly, at an unspecified time, means that we must be ready, always. Soon was a long time ago, so we can never say, "Jesus is coming soon." We do not know. All the "soon" prophets have failed.

[John81]

Where does the Bible say "Jesus is coming soon?" It says Rev 22:20 ¶ He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

"Quickly" is speed of coming, whereas "soon" means within a short time.

Knowing Jesus is coming quickly, at an unspecified time, means that we must be ready, always. Soon was a long time ago, so we can never say, "Jesus is coming soon." We do not know. All the "soon" prophets have failed.

Good points.

I believe attempts to set dates, predict the nearness of His return, "prove" we are in the 'last of the last days', has served as a major distraction for many professing Chrisians and has also served to cause many to doubt Christianity.

Even before I was saved I remember reading some material proclaiming the end was near and Christ would soon return because the Soviet Union was fulfilling end-times prophecy.

Imagine if as much time were spent upon pursuing holiness, being salt and light, being about the Father's business, so we will be found in obedience to Him, occupying until He comes at the Father's appointed time.

[JerryNumbers]

Yours use my use of the word quickly may well be much different than God's use of the word quickly.

[Crushmaster]

Where does the Bible say "Jesus is coming soon?" It says Rev 22:20 ¶ He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

"Quickly" is speed of coming, whereas "soon" means within a short time.

Knowing Jesus is coming quickly, at an unspecified time, means that we must be ready, always. Soon was a long time ago, so we can never say, "Jesus is coming soon." We do not know. All the "soon" prophets have failed.

To be fair, that doesn't seem like an accurate interpretation; . We have been in the last days since Pentecost; Christ will come, obviously, in the last days. His return has, really, been imminent since then, for a day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day, to the Lord.

After all, look at the word translated "Quickly": "5035. tachu, takh-oo'; neut. sing. of G5036 (as adv.); shortly, i.e. without delay, soon, or (by surprise) suddenly, or (by impl. of ease) readily:--lightly, quickly."

Taken from Strong's Greek and Hebrew Dictionaries.
God bless,
Joel ><>.
2 Chronicles 7:14.

[Bro Jim]

And time in Heaven compared to time here on earth, quickly to our Saviour and quickly to us can seem to be same but be two entirely different time elements or intervals. 1000 years to us and day to Him. If the twinkling of an eye is 1/32 of a second, what would that be to Him.

Edited February 12, 2011 by Bro Jim