Members orvals Posted March 19, 2007 Members Share Posted March 19, 2007 Why do some consider repentance a gift? I am not debating this topic I want to know your reasoning. This puzzles me since it would seem that repentance is the acknowledgement of our sin, our plight and our judgment and turning from that knowldege, exercising faith (a gift) in trusting Christ who paid our penalty for sin, clothed us in his righteousness and gave us a right standing before God. Godly sorrow worketh repentance ... is the drawing and conviction of the Holy Spirit but I do not see repentance being a gift. The goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance If repentance were a gift would not have to be given before salvation? Where faith is given to all men I have not read the repentance is give to all men. Where does the thought that repentance is a gift come from? Please clarify ... orvals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members orvals Posted March 20, 2007 Members Share Posted March 20, 2007 I have spent several hours studying this out and would agree after the study that repentance is a gift of God. Based on Acts 11:18 (and others) and the fact that repentance works in harmony with faith and the drawing / convciting of the Holy Spirit there is really no other way to see it in my mind. orvals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jerry Posted March 20, 2007 Members Share Posted March 20, 2007 I believe, like salvation (I don't believe the Scriptures teach faith is a gift, but that salvation is the gift of God referred to in Ephesians 2:8-9) repentance is a gift offered to all through the convicting work of the Holy Spirit - however, like salvation it can be rejected and resisted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members pneu-engine Posted March 20, 2007 Author Members Share Posted March 20, 2007 I believe, like salvation (I don't believe the Scriptures teach faith is a gift, but that salvation is the gift of God referred to in Ephesians 2:8-9) repentance is a gift offered to all through the convicting work of the Holy Spirit - however, like salvation it can be rejected and resisted. Hi Jerry, :smile That's the way I see it too. :thumb I picture it like the songwriter, Charles Wesley who wrote, "And Can It Be". In my Living Hymns, #186, verse #4.Long my imprisoned spirit lay. Fastbound in sin and nature's night; Thine eye diffused a quickening ray. I woke, the dungeon flamed with light; My chains fell off, my heart was free; I rose, went forth, and followed Thee. Chorus::: Amazing love! How can it be that Thou my God shouldst die for me. When we were deep in our sinful lost state, and black as black could be in our hearts, there was no way that we could simply look up to God of our own accord and beg for cleansing, salvation or redemption. The very call of God was the first Gift. He reached out to us in loving kindness and shone His bright light of conviction into our souls. That was the second gift. We respond with a deep longing desire to have that light and be rid of our horrid sin. He then grants to us the ability to turn from (((i.e. repent))) our dark dungeons and follow Him out of it. That was the third gift. In no way could we possibly have done this on our own. We can easily see that Salvation is all of God, and yet He has given us a free-will to choose to follow Him or reject Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JerryNumbers Posted March 21, 2007 Members Share Posted March 21, 2007 And by free will one choses to repent and receive the unspeakable gift that God offers. 15 Thanks be unto God for his unspeakable gift. 2 Cor 9:15 (KJV) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Psalms18_28 Posted March 21, 2007 Members Share Posted March 21, 2007 Hi Jerry, :smile That's the way I see it too. :thumb I picture it like the songwriter, Charles Wesley who wrote, "And Can It Be". In my Living Hymns, #186, verse #4.Long my imprisoned spirit lay. Fastbound in sin and nature's night; Thine eye diffused a quickening ray. I woke, the dungeon flamed with light; My chains fell off, my heart was free; I rose, went forth, and followed Thee. Chorus::: Amazing love! How can it be that Thou my God shouldst die for me. When we were deep in our sinful lost state, and black as black could be in our hearts, there was no way that we could simply look up to God of our own accord and beg for cleansing, salvation or redemption. The very call of God was the first Gift. He reached out to us in loving kindness and shone His bright light of conviction into our souls. That was the second gift. We respond with a deep longing desire to have that light and be rid of our horrid sin. He then grants to us the ability to turn from (((i.e. repent))) our dark dungeons and follow Him out of it. That was the third gift. In no way could we possibly have done this on our own. We can easily see that Salvation is all of God, and yet He has given us a free-will to choose to follow Him or reject Him. WB, If you're back :lol your posting number is still 3333 :puzzled: ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JJJ4given Posted March 21, 2007 Members Share Posted March 21, 2007 I have spent several hours studying this out and would agree after the study that repentance is a gift of God. Based on Acts 11:18 (and others) and the fact that repentance works in harmony with faith and the drawing / convciting of the Holy Spirit there is really no other way to see it in my mind. orvals Was the church at Jerusalem speaking under the inspiration of the Holy Ghost? Look at what they said earlier: Acts 11 1 ¶ And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also received the word of God. 2 And when Peter was come up to Jerusalem, they that were of the circumcision contended with him, 3 Saying, Thou wentest in to men uncircumcised, and didst eat with them. and then: 18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life. Acts is a book that tells the way things happened. A clearly carnally minded statement on their part. It is simply what they said. In fact, it would seem to indicate that they realized that God had made the way of salvation(repentance) available to the Gentiles. Not that it wasn't already available before. In fact, Ninevah believed along with other gentiles in the OT. Anyhow, this statement coming from Judiasers who earlier contended with Peter, should not be given so much doctrinal weight. It is simply what they said and as ungodly as when they rideculed Peter for eating with the uncircumcised. They are clearly carnally minded as seen earlier in chapter 11 and throughout the book of Acts. God bless! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JerryNumbers Posted March 21, 2007 Members Share Posted March 21, 2007 <> Wasn't the path to God for the gentiles open in the days of the Old Testament? I hear some say that this path for the gentiles was only opened in the New Testament. I can't help but to think of Rahab. 31 By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace. Heb 11:31 (KJV) 25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? James 2:25 (KJV) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members orvals Posted March 21, 2007 Members Share Posted March 21, 2007 JJJ, Hi brother, Not to get into a great debate but Acts 11:1 says "they heard that the gentiles had also recieved the word of God" verse 1 conects us with verse 18 "Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life". Between verses 1 and 18 is the coversation sorrounding the event in which Peter was accused of breaking the law by going in among the Gentiles of which he recounted all that happend and concluded that the events were just like what happened to them at pentecost. ... Acts 11:16-18 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost. Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God? When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life. Orvals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JJJ4given Posted March 21, 2007 Members Share Posted March 21, 2007 JJJ, Hi brother, Not to get into a great debate but Acts 11:1 says "they heard that the gentiles had also recieved the word of God" verse 1 conects us with verse 18 "Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life". Between verses 1 and 18 is the coversation sorrounding the event in which Peter was accused of breaking the law by going in among the Gentiles of which he recounted all that happend and concluded that the events were just like what happened to them at pentecost. ... Acts 11:16-18 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost. Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God? When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life. Orvals Hello again brother Orvals, What was the gift that Peter was referring to in Acts 11:17? It wasn't repentance: Acts 10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jchahl Posted April 10, 2007 Members Share Posted April 10, 2007 Maybe it's just me, but after reading this thread and another thread in this forum (Is Repentance needed for Salvation?), it seems that there are two completely different views being supported and accepted. I am a little confused by this. :puzzled: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members pem315 Posted April 11, 2007 Members Share Posted April 11, 2007 can someone explain the difference between repentance and conversion to me.. :Bible: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jerry Posted April 11, 2007 Members Share Posted April 11, 2007 Conversion means turning - true repentance (which is a change of mind resulting in a change of conduct) would certainly involve turning from sin to the Lord, but they are different concepts. One involves our mind and heart - the other involves what we do. There are OT passages that refer to turning from sin, turning to the Lord - those would be converting from one state to the other. Converting may or may not be in reference to salvation - it depends upon the context of the person using the term. For example, James 5 uses it in reference to a backslidden believer converting from the error of his ways, from the sin he has wandered into, back to the Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Madeline Posted April 11, 2007 Members Share Posted April 11, 2007 Conversion means turning - true repentance (which is a change of mind resulting in a change of conduct) would certainly involve turning from sin to the Lord, but they are different concepts. One involves our mind and heart - the other involves what we do. There are OT passages that refer to turning from sin, turning to the Lord - those would be converting from one state to the other. Converting may or may not be in reference to salvation - it depends upon the context of the person using the term. For example, James 5 uses it in reference to a backslidden believer converting from the error of his ways, from the sin he has wandered into, back to the Lord. James 5:20 - Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. Sounds more like an unbeliever than a believer. How can we save a "saved" persons soul from death? Correct me if i'm wrong. So you say that convert here means to restore a backslidden believer (Lk. 22:32), so would death imply physical death by which sometimes God punishes His disobedient children? (Acts 5:5-10; 1 Cor. 11:30; 1 Jn. 5:16). Thanks in advance! Love, Madeline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members JerryNumbers Posted April 11, 2007 Members Share Posted April 11, 2007 Save them from the sin unto death. 16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. 1 John 5:16 (KJV) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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