Only Begotten (MONOGENES)

[Madeline]

John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Here is the dictionaries definition of begotten:

BEGOTTEN - [adj] (of offspring) generated by procreation; "naturally begotten child"

Need some help from some of you bible scholars here. Does anyone know why the KJV translated it as (MONOGENES)? I read somewhere that it is an assumption that GENES is referring to "birth" whereas it comes from GINOMAI - "being, to become." MONO means "only." So it simply means "only, one and only, unique." Also at the time of the KJV translation there were several words that we did not have an accurate means of determining their meaning. Since dictionaries were not really around at the time, the best way is by comparing how words are used in other, everyday documents. If we use (MONOGENES), then JW's can turn to the Greek to prove their heretical doctrine that Jesus is a "created" being. I am open to correction. :smile

Love,
Madeline

[Bakershalfdozen]

I'm open to correction also but the plain sense of the words and passages seem to indicate to me that Jesus was the only "son" of God by procreation. Now that doesn't mean that God had sex with Mary but rather that she was overshadowed by the Holy Spirit and God imparted into her body the Something that became the God-man, Jesus Christ. This is how His birth was unique, one and only.

It also doesn't mean that God created Jesus. God simply took on human form in the person of Jesus Christ and was born through Mary.

Adam is also called a son of God. But he was created, not procreated.

Luke 3:38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.


I might be misunderstanding though.

[speerjp1]

John 3:16 - For God so loved the world' date=' that he gave his only [b']begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Here is the dictionaries definition of begotten:

BEGOTTEN - [adj] (of offspring) generated by procreation; "naturally begotten child"

Need some help from some of you bible scholars here. Does anyone know why the KJV translated it as (MONOGENES)? I read somewhere that it is an assumption that GENES is referring to "birth" whereas it comes from GINOMAI - "being, to become." MONO means "only." So it simply means "only, one and only, unique." Also at the time of the KJV translation there were several words that we did not have an accurate means of determining their meaning. Since dictionaries were not really around at the time, the best way is by comparing how words are used in other, everyday documents. If we use (MONOGENES), then JW's can turn to the Greek to prove their heretical doctrine that Jesus is a "created" being. I am open to correction. :smile

Love,
Madeline

The KJV translated monogenes as only begotten because that is the only way it makes sense in the context of John 3 and doctrinally.

Had the translators left off begotten, then the JW's could twist it more easily into their heretical view.

They were true to the Greek they were translating from. It is true that Christ came into being on earth. That happened when he was begotten.

[HappyChristian]

Following their own vain imaginations down the corrupt path of their own inner delusions in their never-ending and systematic attempt to devalue the Eternal Son of God, even the Lord Jesus Christ, the modern Anglo-Sanhedrin states that MONOGENES (monogenhV) means UNIQUE. Of course, only a non-Greek speaker or someone with a HUGE theological bent would make such an uninformed statement, as the Greek language has had a different word for UNIQUE for more than two thousand years.

That word is MONADIKOS (monadikoV) and it antedates Christianity, having been employed by Aristotle, Philo, and others. The Greek word MONADIKOS means UNIQUE or ONE OF A KIND and nothing else, as native Greeks know. Its morphology hasn't changed in over two thousand years. MONADIKOS is the word that Greek speakers have been using for UNIQUE for more than two thousand years, and it is the word native Greeks still use today when they want to say UNIQUE or ONE OF A KIND.

Neither has the morphology of MONOGENES changed in over two thousand years, and MONOGENES has always meant ONLY BEGOTTEN or its equivalent.

Just as ONLY BEGOTTEN is not equivalent to UNIQUE, so MONOGENES is not equivalent to MONADIKOS. The Greek word MONOGENES does NOT mean UNIQUE, nor has it ever. The Greek word MONADIKOS means UNIQUE. It has ALWAYS meant UNIQUE.

Had the writers of the New Testament wanted to say UNIQUE, they would have used the Greek word which means UNIQUE ? MONADIKOS.

The reason the writers of the New Testament didn?t employ MONADIKOS when they penned the New Testament is simple ? because the writers of the New Testament didn?t mean UNIQUE. The writers of the New Testament meant ONLY BEGOTTEN or its equivalent. That?s why they used the word MONOGENES instead of MONADIKOS.

Just thought you might be interested in reading this. For the rest of the explanation, check out this site.

http://www.lamblion.net/Articles/ScottJ ... ogenes.htm

[Jerry]

There were Greek lexicons as early as the second century - so the KJV translators had plenty of access to Bible word definitions.

Only begotten is referring to Jesus' humanity - He was the only person ever BORN as a Son of God. Angels were directly, individually created as sons of God; Adam was created personally as a son of God; mankind become believers and are born again spiritually as sons of God.

[lettheredeemedsayso]

Only begotten is referring to Jesus' humanity - He was the only person ever BORN as a Son of God. Angels were directly, individually created as sons of God; Adam was created personally as a son of God; mankind become believers and are born again spiritually as sons of God.

Amen

[IM4given]

There were Greek lexicons as early as the second century - so the KJV translators had plenty of access to Bible word definitions.

Only begotten is referring to Jesus' humanity - He was the only person ever BORN as a Son of God. Angels were directly, individually created as sons of God; Adam was created personally as a son of God; mankind become believers and are born again spiritually as sons of God.

Where is the scripture that supports the strange belief that Angels have ever been called [bible]sons of God[/bible]? I agree with you that Jesus was born as the Son of God. I also believe that Adam was a son of God; and that Born-Again Believers are sons of God. I also believe that when the translators were preserving God's word, that they translated Angels for angels, and sons of God for sons of God. Where does it say in the scriptures that Angels are also known as sons of God?

[heartstrings]

Where is the scripture that supports the strange belief that Angels have ever been called [bible]sons of God[/bible]? I agree with you that Jesus was born as the Son of God. I also believe that Adam was a son of God; and that Born-Again Believers are sons of God. I also believe that when the translators were preserving God's word, that they translated Angels for angels, and sons of God for sons of God. Where does it say in the scriptures that Angels are also known as sons of God?

1. Genesis 6...sons of God.....believers...men who "call upon the name of the Lord"...."took them wives" from unbelievers. They were not "perfect in their generations" like Noah was. Noah had one wife and he wasn't "marrying and giving in marriage" like the other "sons of God" were. The sons of God still were saved by Grace through faith and on their way to Heaven, but they died before the flood came.

2. Job 1:7 and Job 2:1.....sons of God....believers came to present themselves "before the Lord". Abraham "stood yet before the Lord", standing on planet earth. When believers pray, or "present themselves" evil is present, as Paul said. When you get close to God, Satan is not far away, waiting for his chance. Satan comes right on into Independent Baptist Churches too. I believe these events took place on earth, not in Heaven. Satan was kicked out of Heaven.
The book of Job also uses the word angels. Why not "sons of God" there also?

3. Job 38:7....sons of God....believers....."shouted for joy" at the same time the "foundations of the earth" and cornerstone" were laid. I seriously doubt that this happened at the creation of the earth. The earth has no physical foundations or cornerstone. In Genesis 5, it says "then began men to call upon the name of the Lord" this could have been that at that time. The "foundations", I believe ,are faith itself and the cornerstone is Christ. Once again, the earth has no physical cornerstone and neither is Christ a physical cornerstone.

4. The Book of Jude....This passage mentions angels. But these angels "kept not their first estate". They "despised dominion". They did not go after "strange flesh". Sodom and Gomorrah did that. Saying that the book of Jude referrs to angels cohabiting with women is a failure to rightly divide the word.

Absolutely nowhere does it say that angels are sons of God. It does say that believers are.

[IM4given]

:amen: Aaaaaaaaymen! Good post!

[heartstrings]

Aaaaaaaaymen! Good post!

There are still some unanswered questions, sister, but that's the way it looks so far.

[IM4given]

I do not see what is so difficult to believe about this verse of scripture as it is written, or why anyone would have any difficulty with the translation of it? There is only one Jesus Christ, and he is the One and Only Son of God. Mary and Joseph had many children after Jesus was born, but there is only one Jesus Christ, who fulfilled all of the prophesies in the Old testament with his Virgin birth.

John 3:16 - For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

[Jerry]

Job 38:4-7 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof; When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

In the order presented here in this passage, this is referring to day two or three of creation - man was not around, but the angels were. Compare the order presented here with Psalm 104 - same scenario:

Psalms 104:2-5 Who coverest thyself with light as with a garment: who stretchest out the heavens like a curtain: Who layeth the beams of his chambers in the waters: who maketh the clouds his chariot: who walketh upon the wings of the wind: Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire: Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.

The firmament, the separation of the waters, the creation of angels, the laying of the foundation of the earth. Man wasn't there when the foundation of the earth was laid on day three of creation as they were not created until day six.

[heartstrings]

Jerry,
Supposing "laid the foundations of the earth" was the creation:

Laying a foundation is the very first thing that is done, when something is built.

But Genesis says "....and the earth was without form and void...." That tells me that the earth is in existence here....foundation would already be laid here.

Then it says "and darkness was upon the face of the deep" So, it was:
#1. dark
#2. there was apparently an ocean..."the deep"
#3 No firmament yet

So you already have a foundation laid....BUT...it's still dark at this point.
Not only that, there is no atmosphere or "firmament" at this point.
So if the sons of God "shouted for joy WHEN....the foundations were laid" as it says in Job 37, then how can there be morning stars?
Morning stars are not "morning stars" without being PERCEIVED as such, because all stars look look the same when it is dark.

To have "morning stars" there must be....
#1. An atmosophere
# 2. The sun
# 3. An observer, standing on earth.

Otherwise, there is no such thing as a morning star.


Job 38:4-7 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof; When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

Two simultaneous events.

How could it be dark...with morning stars?
It can't. This is not speaking of the creation.

[Jerry]

There was evening and morning before the Sun was created.

The foundations of the "earth".

Genesis 1:9-13 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so. And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good. And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And the evening and the morning were the third day.

[IM4given]

Are you saying that the KJV translators made a mistake when they forgot to translate the phrase from "sons of God" to "angels?"

I would think that if it was supposed to mean "angels" then they would have just come right and said "angels" instead of using some other phrase to supposed mean angels.

Everywhere else in the Bible "angels" mean "[bible]angels[/bible]."

When Abraham and Sarah were visited by angels, the scriptures came right out and said so.

When Lot and his family were visited by angels, the scriptures came right out and said so.

When you start making balloon animals out of scriptures, it gets twisted and confused until people start even believing that there are some sort of wierd space alien half-breed creatures in the Holy Bible, and that doesn't even make sense. God creates angels as creatures who do not have sex or get married, so where do these false angel doctrines come from?

Then Hollyweird gets ahold of these weird false angel doctrines and they turn it into a good tale that makes them a whole lot of money, but in the end just serves to confuse people even more.