A Non-Denominational church is a Denomination

[Pastor Matt]

Agree or disagree with the following:

"Nondenominational" refers to religious organizations or congregations that do not align themselves with any particular established denomination or sect within a religion. However, despite not affiliating with a specific denomination, nondenominational groups can still be considered a denomination themselves, albeit with some nuances.

Here's why:

1. Distinct Identity: Nondenominational churches or religious groups often have their own distinct identity, beliefs, practices, and organizational structures. While they may not adhere to the specific doctrines of a particular denomination, they still form a cohesive group with shared beliefs and practices.

2. Organizational Structure: Although they may not have hierarchical structures like denominations, nondenominational groups often have their own leadership, clergy, and organizational frameworks. They may have local congregations, national headquarters, and sometimes even international networks.

3. Theological Perspectives: While nondenominational groups may claim to be nonsectarian and open to a variety of theological perspectives, they typically have a set of core beliefs or doctrines that distinguish them from other groups. These beliefs may not align precisely with any one denomination but still serve to define the group's identity.

4. Community and Fellowship: Like denominations, nondenominational groups provide a sense of community and fellowship for their members. They often gather for worship, religious education, social activities, and community service, creating a cohesive religious community.

5. Recognition and Affiliation: While nondenominational groups may eschew formal denominational labels, they often seek recognition from legal and regulatory bodies, such as tax-exempt status from government authorities. They may also affiliate with broader networks of nondenominational churches or organizations for support and cooperation.

In summary, while nondenominational groups may not fit neatly into traditional denominational categories, they still exhibit many characteristics of denominations, including distinct identity, organizational structure, theological perspectives, community, and recognition. Thus, they can be considered a denomination in their own right, albeit one that emphasizes independence and flexibility in religious practice and belief.

[Jerry]

Right. I have attended several non-denominational groups as a much younger believer in the early to mid 90’s - ones such as Bible Chapels and Christian Centres when I was living in Kelowna. When I moved to Saskatchewan for a couple of years, I checked out those groups there, and they had the same beliefs, practices, etc. That makes them a denomination, despite what they may claim.

[SureWord]

Agree.

The "non-denominational" I attended was basically Baptist in faith and practice. Maybe not IFB Baptist since there was CCM. The difference is they didn't have a Statement of Faith outside of "Jesus Saves".

Some would think they weren't even a church since they weren't Baptists.

[BrotherTony]

10 hours ago, Pastor Matt said:

Agree or disagree with the following:

"Nondenominational" refers to religious organizations or congregations that do not align themselves with any particular established denomination or sect within a religion. However, despite not affiliating with a specific denomination, nondenominational groups can still be considered a denomination themselves, albeit with some nuances.

Here's why:

1. Distinct Identity: Nondenominational churches or religious groups often have their own distinct identity, beliefs, practices, and organizational structures. While they may not adhere to the specific doctrines of a particular denomination, they still form a cohesive group with shared beliefs and practices.

2. Organizational Structure: Although they may not have hierarchical structures like denominations, nondenominational groups often have their own leadership, clergy, and organizational frameworks. They may have local congregations, national headquarters, and sometimes even international networks.

3. Theological Perspectives: While nondenominational groups may claim to be nonsectarian and open to a variety of theological perspectives, they typically have a set of core beliefs or doctrines that distinguish them from other groups. These beliefs may not align precisely with any one denomination but still serve to define the group's identity.

4. Community and Fellowship: Like denominations, nondenominational groups provide a sense of community and fellowship for their members. They often gather for worship, religious education, social activities, and community service, creating a cohesive religious community.

5. Recognition and Affiliation: While nondenominational groups may eschew formal denominational labels, they often seek recognition from legal and regulatory bodies, such as tax-exempt status from government authorities. They may also affiliate with broader networks of nondenominatil churches or organizations for support and cooperation.

In summary, while nondenominational groups may not fit neatly into traditional denominational categories, they still exhibit many characteristics of denominations, including distinct identity, organizational structure, theological perspectives, community, and recognition. Thus, they can be considered a denomination in their own right, albeit one that emphasizes independence and flexibility in religious practice and belief.

It's not a popular opinion here, but, I would have to say that the IFB is a denomination no matter how they would like to dispute this. 

[Pastor Matt]

6 hours ago, BrotherTony said:

It's not a popular opinion here, but, I would have to say that the IFB is a denomination no matter how they would like to dispute this. 

Of course. I've never heard anybody over my neck in the woods say that IFB is not a denomination, after all, the word Baptist is in it. 

[BrotherTony]

27 minutes ago, Pastor Matt said:

Of course. I've never heard anybody over my neck in the woods say that IFB is not a denomination, after all, the word Baptist is in it. 

In some circles here they state they're so Independent (big 'I') that they don't associate, congregate, or affiliate with anyone. To them 'Baptist' is a description only, NEVER a denomination. Even some from the old BBF and split off organizations like the one that had the first Bible college that I went to made statements like that though they ALL associated to start and maintain the college and allow the students to have to pay only for housing, meals, books, etc, and have free college.  It all flew in the face of their statements. But they couldn't or wouldn't admit that.

[Jerry]

There are some people that do say that. It is not the typical denomination in the sense that IFB's do not have a headquarters dictating to them what to believe, what to preach, what to do. Though we are a denomination in the sense that we are Baptists and are likeminded to many other IFB churches (though not 100% - each studies the Bible on their own and is led by their own leadership, so some conclusions and basic understanding of issues/doctrine may differ).

[TheGloryLand]

A worldly example, going to your favorite steakhouse for a meal or going to your favorite buffet restaurant for your meal. You will get more for your money in your favorite buffet restaurant. I prefer a good old fashioned Steakhouse.

[BrotherTony]

It seems to many of us who were raised in the IFB circles that this isn''t necessarily so. We find that many of these churches "cooperate" in sending people to the missionfield by sending money to organizations that help in the sending of the funds to the missionaries. There are many mission organizations that are used to get a great many of these missionaries their funds. The only difference here is that the SBC uses their cooperative to do the same thing through just one organization. Yet, they're bashed every step of the way. Yes, they do have a set of guidelines that they have published to have the positions that they hold in plain view for everyone, but, even then, many of the churches don't hold to a percentage of this agreement (Baptist Faith & Message 2000) from 1% to 99%.  They're only a "denomination" in the respect that they meet once a year to pick someone to lead in guiding the organizations that help with supplying study material. I have to say that one thing I hate is that Lifeway Resources provides materials in several different translations of the Scriptures. This leads to confusion. Still, I find that in the IFB circles the many organizations that they use to publish materials to study do the same, though they try to keep it in the KJV as often as possible. These other translations lead to confusion and a lax attitude towards the Word of God, Christ as Lord and Savior, etc.  I have stood in our SBC-affiliated church, that we should limit our giving to the North American Missions Board, because the President of that organization has taken the planting of new churches to a new low, misdirecting funds, and trying to make the SBC churches a "true" denomination in the respect of having a leader who can direct what materials a church uses, what they can preach, and where they can send funds. Kevin Ezell, president of the organization, has lied before the Circuit Courts, the United States Supreme Court, and then back in front of the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals that the SBC is indeed an organization, and that he essentially is the pope.  Many of the churches affiliated with the SBC aren't even aware of all of these things. I brought it to the attention of our pastor and deacons and have been labeled as a troublemaker, a disgruntled IFB person who would like to see our church leave the SBC and become more right-of-center.  I've made my position clear to them many times, and it's gotten to the point that my wife and I are looking for a strong, IFB church to attend and join. 

I know....clear as mud...right @Jerry? LOL Let's just say, you and I agree on more than you would think. 

16 minutes ago, TheGloryLand said:

A worldly example, going to your favorite steakhouse for a meal or going to your favorite buffet restaurant for your meal. You will get more for your money in your favorite buffet restaurant. I prefer a good old fashioned Steakhouse.

Really??? Aren't you attending an SBC church? You seemed to indicate that you were in the past. 

[MikeWatson1]

Many churches calling themselves non denominational I've seen are very very similar to charismatic Anglicans or Methodists. They say they are non denom yet have almost exactly the same statement of faith as a denomination.

Their non denominational idea is not to go back to scripture,  but to do things their own way.

But then also you can get the rare non-denominational church that just goes by the bible and matches very closely or the same as an IFB church.  That's because they have the same stance of letting the bible govern their beliefs.

 

 

[TheGloryLand]

4 hours ago, MikeWatson1 said:

Many churches calling themselves non denominational I've seen are very very similar to charismatic Anglicans or Methodists. They say they are non denom yet have almost exactly the same statement of faith as a denomination.

Their non denominational idea is not to go back to scripture,  but to do things their own way.

But then also you can get the rare non-denominational church that just goes by the bible and matches very closely or the same as an IFB church.  That's because they have the same stance of letting the bible govern their beliefs.

 

 

The nondenominational church can be a very big word. Like saying a liberal church, this can also be very big or extreme. 

 

[TheGloryLand]

Where did you studied, I study at The Nondenominational Christians faiths College?  

[MikeWatson1]

 

 

I was doing informal bible college with an independent missionary Baptist church. The idea was to make it official.. but in the end the pastor running it left to plant another church before it was official.  

Anyway.. I learned key doctrine and which scripture backs it up... like the church being local, eternal security, the Triune God, local church ordinances of tithing and the Lords Supper and the premillineal return of Christ.

Edited March 26 by MikeWatson1
Previous post put in message

[TheGloryLand]

26 minutes ago, MikeWatson1 said:

 

 

I was doing informal bible college with an independent missionary Baptist church. The idea was to make it official.. but in the end the pastor running it left to plant another church before it was official.  

Anyway.. I learned key doctrine and which scripture backs it up... like the church being local, eternal security, the Triune God, local church ordinances of tithing and the Lords Supper and the premillineal return of Christ.

True, I’ll like to add baptisms of the new believers for membership. Some might say it’s not important.

[Jerry]

The Just Jesus And Me Seminary. It’s in Arabia. I think Paul went to that one too.