Textual/version stance

[Guest Guest]

You live in Eaton? Our dogs go to a veterinarian in Grafton. WOW! What a small world. :smile Hubby likes U-VERSE for the sports, and cowboy movies. They do have a large selection of channels to chose from. It is an extention of AT&T. BTW, I wish we didn't have TV in our house. :smile I love the educational stations, cooking channels, and I browse through the Christian TV station. No one preaches like Ruckman...IMO! He doesn't "candycoat" anything...and, that is what brought me to the Lord! My "Life Verse" is Romans 1:16.

candlelight

[Guest Guest]

[quote="candlelight"]You live in Eaton? Our dogs go to a veterinarian in Grafton. WOW! What a small world. :smile Hubby likes U-VERSE for the sports, and cowboy movies. They do have a large selection of channels to chose from. It is an extention of AT&T. BTW, I wish we didn't have TV in our house. :smile I love the educational stations, cooking channels, and I browse through the Christian TV station. No one preaches like Ruckman...IMO! He doesn't "candycoat" anything...and, that is what brought me to the Lord! My "Life Verse" is Romans 1:16.

candlelight[/quote]

Just be prepared... everyone here thinks Ruckman is a heretic. If we're not careful, this topic could even turn into a nasty Ruckman debate. I hope it doesn't... because I think it's interesting enough the way it's going. :lol

[kevinmiller]

[quote="KJB_Princess"][quote="candlelight"]You live in Eaton? Our dogs go to a veterinarian in Grafton. WOW! What a small world. :smile Hubby likes U-VERSE for the sports, and cowboy movies. They do have a large selection of channels to chose from. It is an extention of AT&T. BTW, I wish we didn't have TV in our house. :smile I love the educational stations, cooking channels, and I browse through the Christian TV station. No one preaches like Ruckman...IMO! He doesn't "candycoat" anything...and, that is what brought me to the Lord! My "Life Verse" is Romans 1:16.

candlelight[/quote]

Just be prepared... everyone here thinks Ruckman is a heretic. If we're not careful, this topic could even turn into a nasty Ruckman debate. I hope it doesn't... because I think it's interesting enough the way it's going. :lol[/quote]
I wouldn't call him a heretic, just a little bit nuts. :Bleh

[John81]

[quote="kevinmiller"][quote="KJB_Princess"][quote="candlelight"]You live in Eaton? Our dogs go to a veterinarian in Grafton. WOW! What a small world. :smile Hubby likes U-VERSE for the sports, and cowboy movies. They do have a large selection of channels to chose from. It is an extention of AT&T. BTW, I wish we didn't have TV in our house. :smile I love the educational stations, cooking channels, and I browse through the Christian TV station. No one preaches like Ruckman...IMO! He doesn't "candycoat" anything...and, that is what brought me to the Lord! My "Life Verse" is Romans 1:16.

candlelight[/quote]

Just be prepared... everyone here thinks Ruckman is a heretic. If we're not careful, this topic could even turn into a nasty Ruckman debate. I hope it doesn't... because I think it's interesting enough the way it's going. :lol[/quote]
I wouldn't call him a heretic, just a little bit nuts. :Bleh[/quote]

Yeah, EVERYONE here doesn't think of him as a heretic.

[Jerry]

Just most of the members...

[John81]

Just most of the members...

:ha




Ummmm...sorry :tip: couldn't resist :Green

[Annie]

I have been told' date=' but have not researched this myself, that the term "KJVO" originated with the Ruckman crowd. A lot of good men have linked themselves with this crowd, not realizing that they were supporting ruckman's position. This is where the OKJV or more properly the TRO (TR Only) phrase came from.[/quote']
I'm reading a book now on this very topic (the history of the KJVO movement). It explores where the movement originated: in a book published in 1930 by Seventh Day Adventist Benjamin Wilkinson (Our Authorized Bible Vindicated), which was discovered and made popular in 1955 by James Jasper Ray, who quoted extensively from Wilkinson's book in his own work God Wrote Only One Bible. The views of Wilkinson and Ray were carried on and propagated by David Otis Fuller, who died in the late '80s. As you all probably already know, Fuller wrote God Wrote Only One Bible and Which Bible, half of which is an edited reprint of Wilkinson's book...(interesting side note: Fuller's anxiousness to conceal Wilkinson's religious orientation is revealed by the fact that he deleted Wilkinson's footnote references to the writings of Adventist prophetess Ellen G. White...disingenuous at best, surely!). A lot more could be said about Fuller. Fuller's contemporary Peter S. Ruckman was another man influenced directly by the writings of Wilkinson and Ray, going so far in denouncing conservative scholars Warfield and Robertson that he lumps them together with men like Adolf Hitler. :puzzled: His first book The Bible Babel unmistakably relies heavily on Ray's God Wrote Only One Bible (a book which, remember, quoted heavily the writings of Seventh Day Adventist Wilkinson).

In summary, the generations of the KJVO movement are these: 1) Wilkinson (1930s); 2) Ray (1950s); 3) Fuller and Ruckman (1970s to present). Other notable followers include Jack Chick, D.A. Waite, E.L. Bynum, Jack Hyles, David Cloud, and Gail Riplinger. The KJVO position, despite what some would like to believe, is not the position of historic fundamentalism.

I have found this book quite interesting. I'm learning a lot. I'm sure some of you have heard negative things about it, which is understandable. But if anyone is interested, the title is One Bible Only? edited by Roy E. Beacham and Kevin T. Bauder. It was published by Kregel Publications in 2001.

[John81]

I know Evangelist Sumner has pointed out over the years that KJVO is a modern concept that was unknown to traditional, or historic, Fundamentalists.

It's also been pointed out that Dr. John R. Rice made note of the rise of KJVO folks during the 1960s and I believe he placed them in the group of those he called "nuts".

[Annie]

I know Evangelist Sumner has pointed out over the years that KJVO is a modern concept that was unknown to traditional' date=' or historic, Fundamentalists. [/quote']

From what I've studied over the years, this evangelist is absolutely correct.



"Nuts"...That's a great theological term that pretty much nails it, IMO. But I thought John R. Rice was KJVO (perhaps not as "nuts" as some, though).

[Bakershalfdozen]

No, he was not. He used the RSV at times, I believe.

This thread got me thinking...time for a new thread. :Green

[Guest Guest]

People sure are changing their minds a lot in the poll. Number 2 has had eight votes three different times now, then it goes down to seven. lol

[Annie]

[quote] I believe that the King James Version is the only true Bible in the world, that it - itself - was given by verbal inspiration of God in 1611, and that all nations should learn 1611 English in order to have the one, pure Bible.[/quote]

:sad

[Guest Guest]

I have noticed that many IFB's believe everything that they read. Hmmm? It seems to me that Satan is really confusing many on the truth. :roll I am sticking with the KJV 1611 AV, only! Men seem to be in LOVE with their minds. :loco

candlelight

Ephesians 4:14...That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight (tricks) of men, and cunning craftiness (cleverness) whereby they lie in wait to deceive; KJV 1611 AV.

[Jerry]

The roots of KJVonlyism go back far before Ruckman or Wilkinson. Cloud is not a follower of either. In his research he shows that there were many that were KJVonly before it became a popular movement.

It makes perfect sense that there would seem to be a rise in KJVonlyism in the 60's - as that is when the RSV came out. The RSV was the first modern version to be publicly acceptable, and the start of Bible companies putting out their new versions every couple of years. KJVonly did not start in the 60's - it was made prominent then.

[Annie]

The roots of KJVonlyism go back far before Ruckman or Wilkinson. Cloud is not a follower of either. In his research he shows that there were many that were KJVonly before it became a popular movement.

Yes, I'm sure there were a relative few. Many? I wonder. Who were they, according to Cloud? I'm not surprised that Cloud (and others, perhaps) does not claim to be a follower of either. But he was undoubtedly influenced by them. I'd be interested to read what Cloud says about this. Do you have documentation?

It is no new thing for people to believe in only one faithful translation of the Bible. People did this with other translations long, long before the KJV was ever published. The KJVO movement I'm speaking of is the modern one (that started in the twentieth century with Wilkinson's ideas). The arguments of the modern KJVO movement are obviously traceable back to Wilkinson and Ray.

It makes perfect sense that there would seem to be a rise in KJVonlyism in the 60's - as that is when the RSV came out. The RSV was the first modern version to be publicly acceptable, and the start of Bible companies putting out their new versions every couple of years. KJVonly did not start in the 60's - it was made prominent then.

You're right; it started in the '30's with Wilkinson, who disliked the English Revised Version. Ray's book in 1955 popularized Wilkinson's view, and by the '60s, the modern KJVO movement was going full force.