Dispensations

[Ukulelemike]

Seems to me, if one doesn't knoW WHO Jesus is, we really can't have faith that He can do anything for us. Otherwise, we ask like Pharoah, "Who is the LORD, that I should OBey his voice...?"  Who is Jesus, that He can do anything for me?

 

Well, He is the Messiah, the promised one of God, revealed in Genesis 3 as the one who would bruise the serpent's, Satan's, head, which He did on Calvary. Etc, etc, prophecies, David, Solomon, etc..." 

 

What seems to be being espoused here by some is the basics of easy-believeism, "Just believe in Jesus and that He died for your sins, and you can go to heaven! Yay!"  ALL the information in the Bible about Jesus, from Moses and the prophets, the gospels and the epistles are 'able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith in Christ Jesus" (2Tim 3;15)  What scriptures do we think Paul was talking about to TImothy, that he knew from childhood? Certainly not the NEW Testament. Timothy was only half Hebrew, half Greek, raised by a Greek father and trained in both, but it wsas the OT that Paul lauded to him as being able to make him saved by faith in Christ Jesus. Not by the law or works or any such thing.

[John81]

NN, you have put forth what the Word clearly says, using the Word to do so. Some have chosen to reject what the Word clearly says. At such a point the Word does tell us to shake the dust off our feet and move on.

[AVBibleBeliever]

Yet one must believe He is the Christ in order to be saved. Scripture is clear on that point.

Outside of the Gospel writings show me a verse where Paul says you must believe "he is the Christ" or you wont be saved?

 

You can call on his name to be saved but that calliing is not without understanding of his substitutionary death on the cross

[John81]

Were He not the Christ, there would have been no substitutionary death on the cross.

[AVBibleBeliever]

Some of you are gong far beyond foolishness.

 

The gospel of Grace is the finished work of the Cross.  The preaching of this Cross is what is done and it may include knowledge of Who Jesus is.

 

However the point you are all missing is without the knowledge of the cross and that he died for your sins there is no salvation in this age in just believing he is the Christ, the Messiah or the Son of God as it was during his earthly ministry before the Cross.  and his death burial and resurrection up until Acts 8 was proof he was the Christ, Messiah and the Son of God.  Look in acts 8 the Ethiopian eunuch was a covert to Judaism who confessed he believed Jesus was the son of God.  Not that his sins were forgiven by his cross for him personally.  that came later when it was revealed to Paul.

 

You all are missing the point and adding things that are not in my words and have come to wrong conclusions.  For intelligent people I find this quite perplexing

 

Do you do this when studying God's word?

 

For some of you I find that it may be true.

 

.

[John81]

NN has posted all that is necessary on the matter.

[2bLikeJesus]

Outside of the Gospel writings show me a verse where Paul says you must believe "he is the Christ" or you wont be saved?

 

You can call on his name to be saved but that calliing is not without understanding of his substitutionary death on the cross.

 

Really AVBB?  Are you really that blinded by your own cutting and slicing of the word of God?   

 

Romans 3:26 (KJV) 
²⁶  To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

 

1 Timothy 1:16 (KJV)
¹⁶  Howbeit for this cause I OBtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting. 

 

How much more than just the Gospels should I cut out...I know...We could cut out everything except the book and Esther, then there would be no God at all because God is not mentioned once in that book!

 

I need to take NN's advice and just shake off the dust and walk away.  This thread is closed to me now.

[Ukulelemike]

I think we all need to reign in the use of the term 'fool' and all variations of it, because biblically, one who is a fool is one who rejectes the Lord and does not believe God exists, and I think we can all agree we don't fall into that category.

 

We also may disagree in these things, but let us attempt some more respectful attitudes in our disagreements. I am enjoying this thread, but if we can't respect one another even in our disagreements, I'll shut it down.

 

Thank you for your support.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

I think we all need to reign in the use of the term 'fool' and all variations of it, because biblically, one who is a fool is one who rejectes the Lord and does not believe God exists, and I think we can all agree we don't fall into that category.

 

We also may disagree in these things, but let us attempt some more respectful attitudes in our disagreements. I am enjoying this thread, but if we can't respect one another even in our disagreements, I'll shut it down.

 

Thank you for your support.

Actually, there are also fools who do believe in God. 

Remember the story of Nicodemus, who came to Jesus by night?  John 3 tells us....

John 3:2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.

The Pharisees believed in God.  Yet Jesus referred to them as "fools" more than once.

Matthew 23:17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?

Matthew 23:19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?

Luke 11:40 Ye fools, did not he that made that which is without make that which is within also?

Luke 24:25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:

[Ukulelemike]

Actually, there are also fools who do believe in God. 

Remember the story of Nicodemus, who came to Jesus by night?  John 3 tells us....

John 3:2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.

The Pharisees believed in God.  Yet Jesus referred to them as "fools" more than once.

Matthew 23:17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?

Matthew 23:19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?

Luke 11:40 Ye fools, did not he that made that which is without make that which is within also?

Luke 24:25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:

Perhaps you're amking an assumption about what the Pharisees believed? At least most of them. After all, if they believed Jesus had been sent by God, they were clearly rejecteing God when they rejected Him, even if they just believed He was a prophet. As well, they saw all of Jesus' miracles and still rejected Him. I think they believed in Moses and the law, and to them God was just an idea.

 

But that's just me. I think most of them had said in their hearts "there is no God".

[Standing Firm In Christ]

I don't know, Bro.  "We know" in verse 2 sounds pretty definite to me.

 

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Luke 5:21 And the scribes and the Pharisees began to reason, saying, Who is this which speaketh blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?


This one also seems to indicate that they had a belief in God's existence.
 

[ThePilgrim]

perhaps, possible. But who's to say we won't still, i dunno, drive cars? Does Jesus' return necessarily mean all technology will be done away with, and we will be a world of Amish, riding horse-drawn buggies?  Or maybe it just means that EVERYTHING will be holy and set apart for the Lord?

I sincerely hope so.  If we have the Lord, why do wee need all this so-called "modern" junk.  The Lord made all we need perfect .  . . . all else was conceived in the fallen mind of man after he was thrown out of the garden.  

Fir instance: Gen 4:20-22

 

20 And Adah bare Jabal: he was the father of such as dwell in tents, and of such as have cattle.

 

21 And his brother's name was Jubal: he was the father of all such as handle the harp and organ.

 

22 And Zillah, she also bare Tubal-cain, an instructer of every artificer in brass and iron: 

KJV

 

Just a thought from a luddite mind.

[John81]

One has to also wonder that if we are made like Jesus, with resurrected form such as His, will we be able to pass through OBjects as He seemed and instantly go from one place to another? Perhaps any form of transportation will be more a matter of fun or entertainment, such as eating seems to be in the NH/NE.

[Ukulelemike]

One has to also wonder that if we are made like Jesus, with resurrected form such as His, will we be able to pass through OBjects as He seemed and instantly go from one place to another? Perhaps any form of transportation will be more a matter of fun or entertainment, such as eating seems to be in the NH/NE.

Because its ALWAYS fun to drive a muscle car, even if we don't need to!