Samer, can you give me a definition of repentance

[victoryoversin]

I don't really care what all y'all think. I could ask 20 people and get 20 different answers

I want to know what Samer thinks (I emailed him and he never replied, so hopefully he will reply here).

I'm not sizing you up for debate brother. I just want to know. If there is a place on the forum where you have defined it, please point me there.

Would you agree with H.A. Ironside and his definition of repentance in these following quotes?

"Repentance is the very opposite of meritorious experience. It is the confession that one is utterly without merit, and if he is ever saved at all it can only be through the merits of our Lord Jesus Christ, 'who gave himself a ransom for all.' Here is firm footing for the soul who realizes that all self-effort is but sinking sand. Christ alone is the Rock of our salvation."

"When anyone comes promising salvation to those ?who make full surrender' of all that they have to God, and who 'pay the price of full salvation' he is preaching another gospel, for the price was paid on Calvary's cross and the work that saves is finished. It was Christ Jesus who made the full surrender when He yielded His life on Calvary that saves us, not our surrender in any way to Him."

?The Gospel is not a call to repentance, or to amendment of our ways, to make restitution for past sins, or to promise to do better in the future. These things are proper in their place, but they do not constitute the Gospel; for the Gospel is not good advice to be obeyed, it is good news to be believed. Do not make the mistake then of thinking that the Gospel is a call to duty or a call to reformation, a call to better your condition, to behave yourself in a more perfect way than you have been doing in the past ?

Nor is the Gospel a demand that you give up the world, that you give up your sins, that you break off bad habits, and try to cultivate good ones. You may do all these things, and yet never believe the Gospel and consequently never be saved at all.

"Repentance is the recognition of my sinnership ? the owning before God that I am as vile as He has declared me to be in His holy Word."

Grace is God's unmerited favor to those who have merited the very opposite. Repentance is the sinner's recognition of and acknowledgment of his lost estate and, thus, of his need of grace.

Undoubtedly one great reason why some earnest Gospel preachers are almost afraid of, and generally ignore, the terms "repent" and "repentance" in their evangelizing is that they fear lest their hearers misunderstand these terms and think of them as implying something meritorious on the part of the sinner. But nothing could be wider of the mark. There is no saving merit in owning my true condition. There is no healing in acknowledging the nature of my illness. And repentance, as we have seen, is just this very thing.

What the unsaved man needs is not a repairing of his life. He needs a new life altogether, which comes only through a second birth. Reformation is like watch repairing. Repentance is like the recognition of the lack of a watch.

Need I add that repentance then is not to be considered synonymous with joining a church or taking up one's religious duties, as people say. It is not doing anything.

But here it seems almost necessary to say that it is the Greek word metanoia, which is translated "repentance" in our English Bibles, and literally means a change of mind. How luminously clear this makes the whole question before us! To repent is to change one's attitude toward self, toward sin, toward God, toward Christ.

The man who believes God repents; the repentant soul puts his trust in the Lord when the Gospel is revealed to him. Theologians may wrangle over this, but the fact is, no man repents until the Holy Spirit produces repentance in his soul through the truth. No man believes the Gospel and rests in it for his own salvation until he has judged himself as a needy sinner before God. And this is repentance.



Basically, to sum all that up, repentance is simply admitting you are a sinner, after seeing your sinfulness before God's holiness and need for a saviour. Repentance and faith cannot to be seperated. The man who repents, has faith in Christ, and the man who has faith in Christ, repents.

Brother Samer, the reason I ask, is that in many of your tracts, you use the phrase "Repent of your sins", but provide no explanation of what this means. Do you mean "Repent of your sin" Or "Admit you are a sinner"?

Just wanting to know Brother

God bless.

[trc123]

I have most of Ironside's commentaries. I like Ironside.

[pneu-engine]

I don't really care what all y'all think. I could ask 20 people and get 20 different answers

V-O-S,

Even though you are not asking for other's comments, maybe there are those that could benefit from us that will answer to your question.

Now then, here is what I have been taught and do believe to be true:::::::::::::

#1. What H.A. Ironside states as repentance we (in my circle of associations) would label as confession.

Confession:::::::::: Literally, "Saying the same thing" and agreeing with God regarding my sinful nature. I.E. God says if I am outside of Jesus Christ then I am a sinner undone and on my way to an eternity away from Him, Heaven, and awaiting the Great White Throne judgment. If I confess my sins and sinful nature to the LORD then I am agreeing with Him, and "Saying the Same Thing". This act of confession is what gives the Holy Spirit the "go-ahead", the "open-door', the "reception", etc., etc., etc. to enter our heart and grant to us His first gift that allows us to repent.

Repentance:::::::::: An "About-Face-Turn" from sin and its lifestyle to the LORD. We've first recognized our sinful nature and inability to gain God's favor by our confession. Then the Holy Spirit floods our darkened heart with His Heavenly Light and we can come to Him for salvation.

I have seen very many people who come all the way to the point of repentance and then turn away and reject the LORD's gift of salvation because they did not want to turn from their sinful lifestyle. They confessed all right, but they refuse to repent, and then no salvation is granted.

[deafnva77]

I don't really care what all y'all think. I could ask 20 people and get 20 different answers

repentance is repentance.. testimonies is different for each person.

[John81]

V-O-S,

Even though you are not asking for other's comments, maybe there are those that could benefit from us that will answer to your question.

Now then, here is what I have been taught and do believe to be true:::::::::::::

#1. What H.A. Ironside states as repentance we (in my circle of associations) would label as confession.

Confession:::::::::: Literally, "Saying the same thing" and agreeing with God regarding my sinful nature. I.E. God says if I am outside of Jesus Christ then I am a sinner undone and on my way to an eternity away from Him, Heaven, and awaiting the Great White Throne judgment. If I confess my sins and sinful nature to the LORD then I am agreeing with Him, and "Saying the Same Thing". This act of confession is what gives the Holy Spirit the "go-ahead", the "open-door', the "reception", etc., etc., etc. to enter our heart and grant to us His first gift that allows us to repent.

Repentance:::::::::: An "About-Face-Turn" from sin and its lifestyle to the LORD. We've first recognized our sinful nature and inability to gain God's favor by our confession. Then the Holy Spirit floods our darkened heart with His Heavenly Light and we can come to Him for salvation.

I have seen very many people who come all the way to the point of repentance and then turn away and reject the LORD's gift of salvation because they did not want to turn from their sinful lifestyle. They confessed all right, but they refuse to repent, and then no salvation is granted.

:goodpost:

[Samer]

What I believe:
The Greek means a change of mind, and the English is from Latin, re + pent, think again. It involves having a change of mind and heart about a holy God, who sent Jesus into the world to die for our sins. it is a change of mind about ourselves as well, and about our former ways that have not pleased God. Job said he abhorred himself and repented in sackcloth and ashes. There is a clear evidence there of contrition and turning to God in humility and faith.

The Gospel does call sinners to repentance. That is why Christ came, to call sinners to repentance.

When I say "repent of sins," I mean "repent of sins." Sinners have lived their whole lives against God, and need to see that fact for what it is, that they have offended a holy God, and must humbly turn to Him in faith for forgiveness. That's turning from ourselves and our sins to trust in God.
Acts 8:22 says to repent of wickedness, seeking forgiveness. Acts 17:30 commands repentance in view of man's idolatry. Acts 26:20 commands repentance, turning to God, and after salvation, works meet for repentance. 2 Corinthians 7:10 tells us sorrow precedes repentance--this is more than mere acknowledgment of sin, for all know we have sinned, but until conviction leads to repentance, acknowledgment does us nothing. There's also plenty of repenting of deeds and works and sins in the book of Revelation.

There's nothing meritorious in in--nothing we can work or do. I've read Ironside's book "Except ye repent," and I thought it was good, but I don't think I had read those quotes by him as you posted. But about those quotes... If you're asking if I believe there is some element of humility and heart submission involved in repentance, then yes I do. Sinners who get saved submit themselves to the Gospel, and to the kindness and love of God our Saviour, casting themselves upon the finished work of Christ, believing in Him, and are saved by faith. It doesn't produce perfection, but it does produce a new creature (2 Cor. 5:17).

[Samer]

Good post, Jim.

[Anon]

One thing my husband points out is in the verse "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved", repentance is included there. You have "Lord" which means you are believing in Jesus as your LORD and Master, which means turning from living for self and sin and making Him the Lord of your life. "Jesus" is acknowleging that He is the Son of God, and "Christ" recognizes his sacrificial death on the cross.

Too many people are being taught that you can be saved without the "Lord" part.

[Guest Guest]

Let me give a biblical example to go with what pneu-engine posted.

"Exodus 9:27 And Pharaoh sent, and called for Moses and Aaron, and said unto them, I have sinned this time: the LORD is righteous, and I and my people are wicked."

Scripture is very clear Pharaoh did not repent, yet he was willing to admit that he was a sinner. He was agreeing with God to a point, he just wasn't willing to surrender to God. He wanted to do as he pleased. Confession is a verbal(and maybe even mental) agreement with God, but repentance is a change of heart. Both are needed for salvation.

"Romans 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

[victoryoversin]

Okay, I understand your viewpoint

So Ironside (those quotes were from Except Ye Repent, What is the Gospel and Another Gospel, three books/tracts he wrote) says

Repentance is the heartfelt admission of guilt and Salvation is the acceptance of Grace.

But you are all saying the same as Ray Comfort and MacArthur,

Confession is the admittance of guilt, Repentance is the turning from it to God, and Salvation is the acceptance of Grace. You add an extra step. I can't help but see that as works. I'm not going to argue the point. This forum is not the board for me.

If one continues in sin after salvation, and yet believes the gospel, and strives to be rid of sin, what is that person's state?

I'll use myself as an example. Now, believe me, I don't take the position I do to justify sin I have committed. But the Lordship position (or whatever your position is, confuses me).

When I got saved (after reading a tract - it was a jack chick tract I think), I was into drinking, drugs and pornography. I knew drugs were wrong straight away, and I wasn't addicted and I quit them. I had no baptist church background, and my only church background was an anglican church. I started going back to the anglican church (it was an evangelical church), because I figured now I believed God and was saved, I should go to church. I kept drinking and looking at pornography. The latter I knew was wrong, but by this stage, I had already been looking at it for years, and was addicted. Everytime I looked at it, was the last time, and I was on my knees praying for forgiveness. This was about 7 years ago.

About 5 years ago, I still wasn't in a good church, had very little Bible knowledge, except for from chick tracts, so I was still a bit confused about things, and I met a girl, and became a fornicator. I knew it was wrong, and I was deeply grieved because I wanted to save myself for marriage. I broke up with her after a few months, and didn't do that again, although the pornography continued. I quit drinking around this time. The girl, who was also a christian, said it was wrong, and I quit for her (we weren't sleeping together at this time). After a while I saw it was wrong biblically.

Today, I am still addicted to pornography. I pray desperately to be rid of it. There are victories. Many victories. I fall less than I used to, but I still fall. I hate it.

Now, what confuses me is this

i) I hate my sins before God. I hate them enough to want to quit them (I don't know if anyone here has ever been addicted to anything, I can't explain the draw)
ii) I believe Jesus Christ died for my sins, was buried and raised again for my justification.
iii) I have accepted Christ as my Saviour (I don't like splitting these two things up, because the Bible says believing ON Christ is enough, acceptance is not some extra step), but I'll make it clear here that I don't just believe some facts about the Bible.
iv) Now, if I am not saved, because of my sin, what on earth must I do to get saved? If I must completely quit it (which I want to) then it's a work based salvation, conditional on my quitting an habitual sin. And then, how do I know when I have quit it? I can purpose in my heart right now never to do it again, but I may fall in a year or two. Does that show I wasn't saved? This is what confuses me Samer...

Now Brethren, please be aware that I am not trying to justify my sin. I cannot stress enough how wicked it is. I cannot stress enough the steps I have taken to be rid of it. I have filters, accountability partners, am doing online daily courses. I pray daily about it, I plead with God to be rid of it. I am married - my wife knows, my pastor knows, my closest friend knows. It's not a secret anymore. I have confessed it to pretty much everyone, God first. But the problem is still in my flesh. It still wants to look at it. Who shall save me from this body of death? I thank the Lord Jesus Christ.

So, did I repent unto salvation when I read that tract? I saw my sin before God. I knew what I was doing was wrong, but I didn't give it up, and still haven't, but I fight it everyday. I believe the gospel. I know I have sinned greatly against God.

[Anon]

Repentance is seeing your sin as God sees is. You got saved, and you turned from your old lifestyle right? You still have your besetting sins, as we still have our flesh, but you turned around and began trying to follow God the best you knew how right? (This is why discipleship is so important, when possible) You say you have had victories...you have borne fruit, correct?

Read this passage and tell me, was Paul saved?

Romans 7:14

[Guest Guest]

I agree with the quotes by Ironside, and I do believe you are saved. You recognize your sin, and though you are a new creature in Christ, the flesh still exists.

As far as the addiction goes, I'm glad you told your wife and it's out in the open. It's important that you find some way to block yourself from viewing pornography. Since you struggle with it, you should definitely get an internet filter if you don't already. Maybe you could even let your wife lock the computer with a password that only she knows, and that way the only times you can get on it are when she's around... just for accountability purposes. Those are just my thoughts though... I don't know what it's like to be addicted to something like that, so I'm just giving you opinions. I'm sure there are men on this board who have struggled with porn in their past, and somehow overcome it... and they can help you with that. I've heard that it's a very common problem even among Christian men. It doesn't mean that you're unsaved if you struggle with it, though.

[Guest Guest]

Read this passage and tell me, was Paul saved?

Romans 7:14

[Anon]

Try reading "Every Man's Battle" as to your porn addiction, its good, you can get it on Amazon or Ebay.

"Every Man's Marriage" would be my second recommendation after you read the first book.

[victoryoversin]

Repentance is seeing your sin as God sees is. You got saved' date=' and you turned from your old lifestyle right? [/quote']

I said I still continued to drink and look at pornography. The first because I thought it was okay to drink (hey, Jesus drank wine blah blah) and the second because I was addicted but wanted to stop. In fact, when I got saved, it was only because I was looking FOR pornography, and came across a tract instead. I don't know if that constitutes turning from my old lifestyle. For a year or two, I was pretty much the same. Going to the pub. I know during that year, I would bring up the gospel a lot, and salvation, around my friends, but it kind of lessens the impact when you have a beer in your hand.



I don't know what fruit is. If you mean lead souls to the Lord, I don't know if I have. I've lead some people in a prayer a few times, but I don't know if they were sincere. I have shared the gospel with friends. If you mean fruit of the spirit, I don't know if I have in the past. I know I feel pretty dead right now.