Repentance - Biblical Viewpoint

[Standing Firm In Christ]

If you don't live right after a profession of faith, you are proving you aren't saved.

[LindaR]

By your own words you are putting the change in lifestyle before Faith in Christ. You have it backwards. FIRST one must believe, then God will do the changing. You try to make the sinner change before he accepts CHRIST. You say he must turn from a sinful lifestyle and THEN believe. But the Bible teaches that you BELIEVE and then God will help you turn from your sinful lifestyle!

In order to get a person saved, you need to get them lost. Unless a person realizes he is lost and in need of a Saviour, he will never get saved, he will see no need for a Saviour. Believing will do NADA unless one realizes and acknowledges he is a sinner....separated from God. Jesus didn't come to save the righteous,

Luke 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Do you prepare the soil before planting seeds in your garden? Might want to read the parable of the sower to find out what happens when the "seed"/Word of God falls on the four different types of soil...the soil representing the heart of the sinner.

Matthew 13:3 And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow;
Matthew 13:4 And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up:
Matthew 13:5 Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth:
Matthew 13:6 And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away.
Matthew 13:7 And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprung up, and choked them:
Matthew 13:8 But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold.


Matthew 13:18 Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.
Matthew 13:19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
Matthew 13:20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
Matthew 13:21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
Matthew 13:22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
Matthew 13:23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

Only the "seed" that fell on the good ground was fruitful...this "soil" was prepared to receive the "seed" and bear fruit. I have nothing backwards. It is God who "prepares" the heart of the sinner to receive and believe His Word through repentance (turning from sin to saving faith in Christ). This turning from sin (NOT becoming sinlessly perfect) always produces a change in lifestyle...the change is not instantaneous, but as we grow in Christ, we become conformed to His image. Are you conformed to this world system, or are you being transformed by the renewing of your mind? Edited November 15, 2011 by LindaR

[KJV1611]

Only the "seed" that fell on the good ground was fruitful...this "soil" was prepared to receive the "seed" and bear fruit. I have nothing backwards. It is God who "prepares" the heart of the sinner to receive and believe His Word through repentance (turning from sin to saving faith in Christ). This turning from sin (NOT becoming sinlessly perfect) always produces a change in lifestyle...the change is not instantaneous, but as we grow in Christ, we become conformed to His image. Are you conformed to this world system, or are you being transformed by the renewing of your mind?

No doubt a person must understand they are a sinner in order to be saved, but no where does it say they must "turn from sin" in order to put their faith in Christ. For example, the publican said, God be merciful to me a sinner. Notice that he did not say, God be merciful to me because I WAS a sinner, but have turned from my sins. He just acknowledged he was a sinner and trusted Christ. No mention of turning from sins. The change in lifestyle happens AFTER believing. Not before. The change of heart happens AFTER believing, not before. The change in direction happens AFTER believing, not before.

You cannot have TRUE change before Accepting Christ. Only a heart that has been made new can have a desire to serve, and it cannot be made new until that person receives Christ.

[KJV1611]

If you don't live right after a profession of faith, you are proving you aren't saved.

How much do you have to "live right" after being saved to prove you are saved?
Is one sin proof you didnt REALLY believe?
What sin would it be?
If it's not one sin, then how many?
Is adultery and murder proof?


I'll agree that if there is no change after salvation, it is less likely that they truly believed, but its very possible they are just a carnal Christian. Just like it is very possible that the so-called Christian who looks to be living such a great life for Christ can be lost and on his way to hell. God looks at the heart, which we are unable to do.

[2Tim215]

I think there's only two Christians going to heaven. The rest of us who have occasionally sinned are gonna BURN!!!

[heartstrings]

There are grave consequences for sin, whether you are saved or lost. A saved person is capable of being tempted AND capable of sinning but will be unable to enjoy it for long. The man in 1 Corinthians was living in sin and was about to be "turned over to Satan for the destruction of the body". If you sin and God never chastens you, He says you are "bastards and not sons". There proving that God chastens His own. There would NOT be such verses in the Bible if falling into sin were not possible for the Christian. "KJV1611" is telling it right and some are not being fair to this person.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

I think there's only two Christians going to heaven. The rest of us who have occasionally sinned are gonna BURN!!!

If you made a profession of faith but held on to your sin, you will prove you were not saved, 2Tim. That's the cold hard facts. Edited November 15, 2011 by Standing Firm In Christ

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Sorry Heartstrings, I disagree with you too. A saved person is not going to hold on to sin. When he sins the Spirit is going to convict him, and there will be a change. Jesus said, "My sheep hear my voice and they follow me." They will not hold on to that sin that the Spirit convicts them of.

KJV1611 is not right. A person who lives in sin is not saved.

[heartstrings]

Sorry Heartstrings, I disagree with you too. A saved person is not going to hold on to sin. When he sins the Spirit is going to convict him, and there will be a change. Jesus said, "My sheep hear my voice and they follow me." They will not hold on to that sin that the Spirit convicts them of.

KJV1611 is not right. A person who lives in sin is not saved.

Well, my friend, King David "held onto sin" just long enough for him to lust after a woman, commit adultery with that woman, to try to cover it up, then he conspired and murdered her husband, then went on until a man of God pointed is bony finger in his face and said "thou art the man". And being a child of God, King David himself was saved but his family suffered because of his sin. And don't go telling me David wasn't saved because I know David had believed on the Son of God and called him "my Lord". Edited November 15, 2011 by heartstrings

[Standing Firm In Christ]

And God sent the prophet Nathan to convict him, did He not? And when God sent Nathan, did David dismiss Nathan and tell hem to "Butt out?" NO, David repented of his sin of adultery.

KJV has made claim that it is not God's will for us to turn from sin. He is wrong. And if you believe as he does, you are wrong as well.

Edited November 15, 2011 by Standing Firm In Christ

[2Tim215]

KJV has made claim that it is not God's will for us to turn from sin. He is wrong. And if you believe as he does, you are wrong as well.

You are of very strong opinions, yet have as yet to quote scripture to back up your statements. I would like to see you go through all the posts and quote KJV1611 where he stated EXACTLY "that it is not God's will for us to turn from sin". I am sure that you will find that you are either twisting his words or quoting wrong. You are very quick to condemn and state everyone else as wrong. Really glad I am not a member of your church. King David may have repented when confronted by Nathan, but did he send his harem home, or remove all the false god temples from the high places that his many "wives" worshiped? Repentance is a continual turning from sin as in Davids case. Maybe, according to your doctrine, David and I can discuss it when I get to Hell one day. Because surely with all his sin he must be there.

Oh, I forgot. The bible says he was a man after God's own heart, should I ask what you are implying?

[LindaR]

No doubt a person must understand they are a sinner in order to be saved, but no where does it say they must "turn from sin" in order to put their faith in Christ. For example, the publican said, God be merciful to me a sinner. Notice that he did not say, God be merciful to me because I WAS a sinner, but have turned from my sins. He just acknowledged he was a sinner and trusted Christ. No mention of turning from sins. The change in lifestyle happens AFTER believing. Not before. The change of heart happens AFTER believing, not before. The change in direction happens AFTER believing, not before.

You cannot have TRUE change before Accepting Christ. Only a heart that has been made new can have a desire to serve, and it cannot be made new until that person receives Christ.

Jesus used the publican to illustrate the humility of salvation in contrast with the religious pride and hypocrisy of the pharisee. The publican REPENTED.

Albert Barnes' Notes on the Bible (Luke 18:13)

Verse 13. Standing afar off. Afar off from the temple. The place where prayer was offered in the temple was the court of women. The Pharisee advanced to the side of the court nearest to the temple, or near as he could; the publican stood on the other side of the same court if he was a Jew, or in the court of the Gentiles if he was a pagan, as far as possible from the temple, being conscious of his unworthiness to approach the sacred place where God had his holy habitation.

So much as his eyes, &c. Conscious of his guilt. He felt that he was a sinner, and shame and sorrow prevented his looking up. Men who are conscious of guilt always fix their eyes on the ground.

Smote upon his breast. An expression of grief and anguish in view of his sins. It is a sign of grief among almost all nations.

God be merciful, &c. The prayer of the publican was totally different from that of the Pharisee. He made no boast of his own righteousness toward God or man. He felt that he was a sinner, and, feeling it, was willing to acknowledge it. This is the kind of prayer that will be acceptable to God. When we are willing to confess and forsake our sins, we shall find mercy, Proverbs 28:13.

Proverbs 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.

The publican was willing to do this in any place; in the presence of any persons; amid the multitudes of the temple, or alone. He felt most that God was a witness of his actions, and he was willing, therefore, to confess his sins before him. While we should not seek to do this publicly, yet we should be willing at all times "to confess our manifold transgressions, to the end that we may obtain forgiveness of the same by God's infinite goodness and mercy." It is not dishonourable to make acknowledgment when we have done wrong. No man is so much dishonoured as he who is a sinner and is not willing to confess it; as he who has done wrong and yet attempts to conceal the fault, thus adding hypocrisy to his other crimes.

The story of Zacchaeus is similar. Zacchaeus's repentance was a change of mind that resulted in a dramatic change of life. The evidence of his repentance was that he gave half his goods to the poor and restored four-fold that which he had stolen through his tax collecting business. (Luke 19:1-10).

God gives repentance...it is not something man "works up" within himself in order to do right. God does the convicting in the heart of a RESPONSIVE sinner (the good ground).

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

John 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

What is the purpose of "living as you please" (and why teach that this is okie dokie and salvation does not make a difference) when the Lord Jesus Christ clearly states in John 10:10

John 10:10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

[Brother Rick]

Okay, so I'm too lazy to go back and read eleven pages of debate... are people around here actually trying to say that if a person backslides that means he was never saved to begin with? You have to be kidding me!!!


Great point about Daved, HS!

[2Tim215]

Well, my friend, King David "held onto sin" just long enough for him to lust after a woman, commit adultery with that woman, to try to cover it up, then he conspired and murdered her husband, then went on until a man of God pointed is bony finger in his face and said "thou art the man". And being a child of God, King David himself was saved but his family suffered because of his sin. And don't go telling me David wasn't saved because I know David had believed on the Son of God and called him "my Lord".

Good one. I wonder how long "holding on" is according to his opinion? Is it one sin? Two? Where does it stop? How long between David's first glimpse and the death of Uriah? one day? one week? one year? How many nights of lust and planning, of holding sin close in his heart? Did he not know he was sinning? Did he really believe it was his right as king to defile another mans wife and then kill him because she was with his child? I think not. In fact, David had become so cold and calculating in his sin and attempt to cover it up, that Nathan had to tell him in a round about way to make him see it. So how long can a saved person sin before a self righteous "christian" has the right to judge him unsaved?

[2Tim215]

Okay, so I'm too lazy to go back and read eleven pages of debate... are people around here actually trying to say that if a person backslides that means he was never saved to begin with? You have to be kidding me!!!


Great point about Daved, HS!

Yep Rick, That's what they are saying. And if you did not repent of your sins you were never saved. Edited November 15, 2011 by 2Tim215