Which One?

[Guest Guest]

In retrospect, you are correct - I was unclear. I seriously doubt, however, that anybody here actually thinks he did the translation himself. My fault for not being clearer in my statements.

So are you saying, then, that the translators of the KJV (all of them) were saved individuals? The translators were hired scholars, and met at Westminster, Cambridge, and Oxford. They were paid by King James to do the work. Certainly his background would also come into scrutiny as their paymaster and commissioner of the translating.

I suppose that is what I was trying to say. I have since had some coffee, and am at least semi-awake.

[Jerry]

Yes, from all that I have read on the KJV translators, they had clear testimonies of salvation - they did not believe in evolution or the doctrines of the RC church, they did not dabble in the occult, they were not modernists who denied the inspiration of the Bible or the fundamentals of the faith - all things (and more) which Westcott and Hort and many modern version translators do.

[Guest Guest]

Yes' date=' from all that I have read on the KJV translators, they had clear testimonies of salvation - they did not believe in evolution or the doctrines of the RC church, they did not dabble in the occult, they were not modernists who denied the inspiration of the Bible or the fundamentals of the faith - all things (and more) which Westcott and Hort and many modern version translators do.[/quote']

And the background of King James? :smile Honestly, I just think that his background only proves that God uses broken vessels, even though that vessel may have had other plans.

I just humor myself by asking questions about him and watching people's reaction. I got no problems with the KJV, Jerry, and I'll again affirm that I believe the KJV is the most accurate translation for English-speaking people today.

[282Mikado]

I just humor myself by asking questions about him and watching people's reaction. I got no problems with the KJV' date=' Jerry, and I'll again affirm that I believe the KJV is the [b']most accurate translation for English-speaking people today.

This phrase always peeks my interest. So what parts are inaccurate?

[Guest Guest]

This phrase always peeks my interest. So what parts are inaccurate?

Man, that wasn't even a "veiled" baiting question. :lol:

[282Mikado]

Man, that wasn't even a "veiled" baiting question.

Aaaaannnnddddd??

[bzmomo7]

KJB only. Actually own an NIV from pre-IFB days. It really didn't take much to convince me which Bible was best--a quick comparison of the two, and a study on manuscripts was quite revealing!

[Jerry]

And the background of King James? :smile Honestly, I just think that his background only proves that God uses broken vessels, even though that vessel may have had other plans.

God uses broken - as in humble - vessels, but He uses clean vessels (ie. saved, separated).

2 Timothy 2:19-21 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

[Guest Guest]

God uses broken - as in humble - vessels' date=' but He uses clean vessels (ie. saved, separated).[/quote']

Wait, I'm confused. Are you saying, then, that God did not use James?

[Jerry]

Hm, are you trying to imply he was not a clean vessel or something? I am sure I don't agree with all of his doctrines, but from what I have read he was saved, and he certainly stood against sexual immorality and the occult.

God can overrule the works of evil or lost men, but He states that He uses (and works through) clean and saved vessels.

[Guest Guest]

God can overrule the works of evil or lost men, but He states that He uses (and works through) clean and saved vessels.

I don't know about that Jerry, there are a lot of lost, wicked people in scripture God says he used.

Concerning Cyrus the Lord says:

"Isaiah 45:4-5 For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me. I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:"

And again:

"Jeremiah 51:11 Make bright the arrows; gather the shields: the LORD hath raised up the spirit of the kings of the Medes: for his device is against Babylon, to destroy it; because it is the vengeance of the LORD, the vengeance of his temple."


Of Pharaoh he says:

"Exodus 9:16 And in very deed for this cause have I raised thee up, for to shew in thee my power; and that my name may be declared throughout all the earth."

Of the Babylonians:

1 Chronicles 6:15 And Jehozadak went into captivity, when the LORD carried away Judah and Jerusalem by the hand of Nebuchadnezzar.

"Jeremiah 25:9 Behold, I will send and take all the families of the north, saith the LORD, and Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon, my servant, and will bring them against this land, and against the inhabitants thereof, and against all these nations round about, and will utterly destroy them, and make them an astonishment, and an hissing, and perpetual desolations."

"Jeremiah 43:10 And say unto them, Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Behold, I will send and take Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon, my servant, and will set his throne upon these stones that I have hid; and he shall spread his royal pavilion over them."

And of the Assyrians he says:

"Isaiah 10:5 O Assyrian, the rod of mine anger, and the staff in their hand is mine indignation."

I don't think we can make the distinction that:

"God can overrule the works of evil or lost men, but He uses (and works through) clean and saved vessels".

God can and does use whoever he chooses...

[Jerry]

Does God use the lost to lead others to salvation? No.

[Guest Guest]

Does God use the lost to lead others to salvation? No.

I know of at least one case of a professing Christian who latter fell away, denied and denounced Christ, and yet had lead people to the Lord when he was "professing". Is that common? no, but it can and does happen. The people he lead to the Lord were saved by the Lord through the knowledge of scriptures he showed them. The truth had nothing to do with the state of his soul. Was he lost? Beyond reasonable doubt, yet he was still used. The Godliness or ungodliness of King James has little to do with the KJV in my opinion. It is a good and accurate translation and stands as such regardless of his personal state.

If the truth was affected by the messenger I doubt Paul would have said this:

"Philippians 1:18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice."

[John81]

I've know a couple of people who led folks to the Lord only to fall so far away from the Lord later that it's highly improbable they were saved. One became a very anti-Christian Muslim. :sad

[Jerry]

If it doesn't matter, why would God put passages in the Bible telling us to be separated from evil so He can use us? Doesn't make any sense - except to say He turned the situation around and saved someone despite the bad vessels, not because of them.