What is wrong with Christian Contemporary Music and Rock?

[bambohs]

[quote="Jerry"]

I am condemning the genres of rock and country - regardless of whether it is "Christian" or not. My rejection is not based on personal tastes - I loved rock music in all its forms - it is based on firm conviction and the leading of the Holy Spirit. Now, I have trained myself to like more sacred music (whether old or new).

What I find funny is so many Christians defend [i]rocky [/i]worship and praise music. Perhaps it is simply the music they are getting caught up in (and yes, I have seen maaany examples of that).[/quote]

I don't care for "rocky" Christian music either. But I think most of us will have a different definition of where that line starts. Personally, I'd rather err on the side of recognizing that God can work in many ways that we may not be familiar or comfortable with, rather than declaring to the world that GOD CANNOT DO THAT.

Gary

[Guest Guest]

[quote="bambohs"]Jerry - I can understand and appreciate your convictions. God bless you for that.

I wouldn't jump in here only to stir things up - that is against MY convictions. I just get worried when I feel that folks are condemning efforts of fine Christian people, who have shared a message that has been heard millions of times. I am NOT saying you should like it - we all have our own tastes - but can you find it in your heart to let other people like it?

PS - for those who like Southern Gospel, here is Ivan Parker singing his version of the song. More of you may like it, because he has a traditionally "better" voice, and because it didn't sell 4 million copies or get a bunch of awards.

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfvevl81Pks[/url]

Gary[/quote]

Hi bambohs! You mentioned that Ivan Parker sings his version of the song in Southern Gospel? For some reason, my computer won't pull up the you tube link? Would you mind starting a thread...with some Southern Gospel music?

I am not "trying" to derail this thread...but, my oldest brother (he is unsaved) has commented to me that...my sister has given him CCM...and CRM, and he doesn't care for it at all. He says he can't understand the words they are saying. I find this very interesting b/c he "seems" to have an idea about what this music should sound like? Hmmm? I surely didn't...unless, he is closer to the point of salvation than I was? Only the Lord knows? :puzzled:

I find this interesting...b/c he came over for a visit today...and, is lying down for a nap, now. He asked what I was doing...I told him about this discussion, and he put in his :2cents I just thought I would share this. It is interesting. Yours in Christ!

candlelight

[Jerry]

[quote="bambohs"]I don't care for "rocky" Christian music either. But I think most of us will have a different definition of where that line starts. [/quote]

Rock is rock - there should be no debate on the style of the music. To the world rock is rock - but somehow Christians can't see that?! :-S

[bambohs]

[quote="candlelight"]

Hi bambohs! You mentioned that Ivan Parker sings his version of the song in Southern Gospel? For some reason, my computer won't pull up the you tube link? Would you mind starting a thread...with some Southern Gospel music?

I am not "trying" to derail this thread...but, my oldest brother (he is unsaved) has commented to me that...my sister has given him CCM...and CRM, and he doesn't care for it at all. He says he can't understand the words they are saying. I find this very interesting b/c he "seems" to have an idea about what this music should sound like? Hmmm? I surely didn't...unless, he is closer to the point of salvation than I was? Only the Lord knows? :puzzled:

I find this interesting...b/c he came over for a visit today...and, is lying down for a nap, now. He asked what I was doing...I told him about this discussion, and he put in his :2cents I just thought I would share this. It is interesting. Yours in Christ!

candlelight[/quote]
Don't worry about derailing the topic - that happened long ago! Sorry if the link isn't working for you. Another way is to go to youtube.com and search for "Ivan Parker" and that song should be one of the top choices. Southern Gospel is my favorite music and your brother may enjoy that better. The vocals are clearer and - most of the time - there is a strong message. I don't mind starting a thread about SG music, but I am VERY averse to stepping on toes and I know there are some here that don't care for it.

Gary

[Guest Guest]

[quote="Jerry"]I Can Only Imagine - perhaps worldly Christians like it because it is mainstream pop rock... I won't listen to it unless I am forced to. God convicted me against secular Rock when I got saved, and Christian Rock 10 years ago. I have no desire or taste (but rather disgust) for that junk.[/quote]
That's such a good example. I also want to arrive at that point where I no longer can tolerate secular dance or similar music. It's such a waste of time and I want to get rid of all secular genres, still I'm aware of the fact that it's going to be difficult at the beginning. I keep thinking about this band, I don't listen to their music, but I'm everyday on their forum talking about them so I'm involved in a very indirect way.

[Guest Guest]

You think those 4 million cd's have gone to bible believing Christians?

No. God forbid that a non-Christian hear them. Everything that we do in life is to reach the lost, so that Christ might be glorified.

Or have they influenced the lost for good? No...

You would have no way of knowing this. The same question can be asked of any Christian's life. How much have I really affected the lost, in general? I may never know until I reach Heaven. While we're on music, there is a poignant song that talks specifically about this situation. It's called "Faces" by one of my favorite group of singers ever: Greater Vision.

I am not skilled to understand who and what God can use. I do realize that no matter how many I reach - it will never be enough. I won't stoop to judge whether or not someone else is "doing their maximum", when my own flaws are so evident.

[Guest Guest]

Don't worry about derailing the topic - that happened long ago! Sorry if the link isn't working for you. Another way is to go to youtube.com and search for "Ivan Parker" and that song should be one of the top choices. Southern Gospel is my favorite music and your brother may enjoy that better. The vocals are clearer and - most of the time - there is a strong message. I don't mind starting a thread about SG music, but I am VERY averse to stepping on toes and I know there are some here that don't care for it.

Gary

Thanks, Gary...if I may call you that? I will do a search on Ivan Parker...thank you! The reason that I am asking... is b/c my brother loved Johnny Cash. Actually, my dad loved Cash. They have a video out now on the Gospel music of Johnny Cash. We are a musical family...and, I think...(although, I could be wrong)...that this would appeal to his heart. He says he "always" listens to the "message" in the song. We grew up in a "folk" music family...so, I think that is why he might love Southern Gospel. We don't get SG up north. :smile

I will do a search on Southern Gospel, though, and find some songs for him. He loves the music at my church (he has gone once to church)...they are hymns, and the choir and soloists and duets "spice" up good Godly music with the piano, flute, clarinet, harp, chello, guitar(not electric) :lol And, no drums, bongos or instruments that go :lol We have lots of talent in my church...I am not kidding, and these folks take hymns and bring out the beauty, passion, and glory, of Jesus Christ when they sing and play the music. I have never been in a church with that much talent! It is very Heavenly...and, I am not being biased. Our song-leader (Assistant Pastor) and, choir director...either our AP, or Missionary Pastor's wife...inspire and bring the congregation alive through song...and, it is themed with the message that the pastor preaches that morning or evening. It is very uplifting to say the least...and, I am not that great with music. I love it...but, it is not my talent. Thanks so much...and, many blessings to you...Bambohs.

candlelight

[Guest Guest]

[quote]You would have no way of knowing this. The same question can be asked of any Christian's life. How much have I really affected the lost, in general? [/quote]

If those 4 million cd's where touching the lost for good we would be hearing about it and seeing the postive effect. That is far to large a number to SELL to the lost and pretend it did them any good. The world doesn't mind hearing about Jesus, they don't even mind "believing" in Jesus, as long as this "Jesus" they "believe" in allows them to live as they like requires nothing of them. Actually they rather like that, it gives them a "religion" and makes them feel better about themselves. However it doesn't do them a bit of good. The Lord says to them:

"[color=#0000FF]Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"[/color]

I work with a number of people like that, they listen to secular rock, "christian" rock, secular country, modern "christian" country(by many of the same "artists" in the secular). They cuss and swear, talk filthy in general, and yet when you talk to them about salvation they say "I am "saved", I believe that, isn't Christ wonderful, he has done so much for me, I have a "relationship" with Christ..." etc. :bang: Those people are on their way to hell; they have believed a lie... The sad part is they think they are ok. They will listen when you share the bible but it goes in one ear and out the other... There is almost nothing you can do to help them. That is the "fruit" of "christian" rock in the world. Just another tool of the devil to blind the eyes of the lost and make them two fold more a child of hell...

At least the modern day publicans know they are lost, they know their music is of the devil, they know they are in sin, so there can be hope for them, but the fruit of Christian rock and all that goes with it amounts to giving the world an "inoculation" against Christ; it makes it that much harder for God to save them.

[tired]

:amen: :thumb

[Guest Guest]

[quote="Seth Doty"][quote]You would have no way of knowing this. The same question can be asked of any Christian's life. How much have I really affected the lost, in general? [/quote]

If those 4 million cd's where touching the lost for good we would be hearing about it and seeing the postive effect. That is far to large a number to SELL to the lost and pretend it did them any good. The world doesn't mind hearing about Jesus, they don't even mind "believing" in Jesus, as long as this "Jesus" they "believe" in allows them to live as they like requires nothing of them. Actually they rather like that, it gives them a "religion" and makes them feel better about themselves. However it doesn't do them a bit of good. The Lord says to them:

"[color=#0000FF]Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"[/color]

I work with a number of people like that, they listen to secular rock, "christian" rock, secular country, modern "christian" country(by many of the same "artists" in the secular). They cuss and swear, talk filthy in general, and yet when you talk to them about salvation they say "I am "saved", I believe that, isn't Christ wonderful, he has done so much for me, I have a "relationship" with Christ..." etc. :bang: Those people are on their way to hell; they have believed a lie... The sad part is they think they are ok. They will listen when you share the bible but it goes in one ear and out the other... There is almost nothing you can do to help them. That is the "fruit" of "christian" rock in the world. Just another tool of the devil to blind the eyes of the lost and make them two fold more a child of hell...

At least the modern day publicans know they are lost, they know their music is of the devil, they know they are in sin, so there can be hope for them, but the fruit of Christian rock and all that goes with it amounts to giving the world an "inoculation" against Christ; it makes it that much harder for God to save them.[/quote]

[color=#0000FF]Galations 5: 22-26...But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another. KJV.[/color]

I guess these scriptures would apply to the music that Christians listen to, as well? :smile

candlelight

[bambohs]

[quote="Seth Doty"][quote]You would have no way of knowing this. The same question can be asked of any Christian's life. How much have I really affected the lost, in general? [/quote]

If those 4 million cd's where touching the lost for good we would be hearing about it and seeing the postive effect. That is far to large a number to SELL to the lost and pretend it did them any good. The world doesn't mind hearing about Jesus, they don't even mind "believing" in Jesus, as long as this "Jesus" they "believe" in allows them to live as they like requires nothing of them. Actually they rather like that, it gives them a "religion" and makes them feel better about themselves. However it doesn't do them a bit of good. The Lord says to them:

"[color=#0000FF]Luke 6:46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"[/color][/quote]

In my humble opinion, if ONE person would be touched by the message in the song, and give their life to Jesus, I would rejoice with them - and God - that another soul had been saved.

Gary

[Jerry]

Granted, Gary - but that doesn't make the song in itself good. I thank God for everyone that gets saved - regardless of what God used to bring them to Him - but that doesn't put His stamp of approval on everything He used. He may use an atheist's ranting and dead-end lifestyle to show some seeking soul the emptiness of life without Christ, in turn causing the person to search diligently for the truth and for a life with meaning and purpose. Does that make the atheist's ranting and lifestyle worth approving? Not at all.

[Guest Guest]

[quote]In my humble opinion, if ONE person would be touched by the message in the song, and give their life to Jesus, I would rejoice with them - and God - that another soul had been saved.
[/quote]

I can agree with that, if they were indeed truly saved. :Green

It is written:

[color=#0000FF]Philippians 1:18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.[/color]


God is big enough to use even the devils tools against him sometimes. That doesn't mean that they aren't Satan's tools, or that we should condone those tools... It just shows the mighty power of God.

[Behold the Lamb]

This thread increasingly makes me sad. I'm starting to realize that we truly have fallen in love with the stained glass masquerade. In this thread I've seen kids who are giving their all for God condemned because they don't tow the old religious traditional idea of what a Christian should dress like (and yet when I go to those abortion clinics, I never see the kids that dress "like church" there praying with them). In this thread I've seen people who are giving all they have to serve Christ humbly and boldly, devoting their lives to Him, blasphemed because the music they use to minister doesn't fit in religion's boxed up idea of what Christian music should sound like. On the other hand, it fits the Bible's idea--Psalm 150, for example, talks about playing LOUD music to the LORD and dancing.

[quote]God is big enough to use even the devils tools against him sometimes. That doesn't mean that they aren't Satan's tools, or that we should condone those tools... It just shows the mighty power of God.[/quote]

The devil's tools don't exalt the name of Jesus Christ.

We truly have fallen in love with the stained glass masquerade. Father, forgive us for falling in love with the way church is done, instead of falling in love with You, for my generation is dying because of it.

Is there anyone that fails?
Is there anyone that falls?
Am I the only one in church today feelin? so small

Cause when I take a look around
Everybody seems so strong
I know they?ll soon discover
That I don?t belong

So I tuck it all away, like everything?s okay
If I make them all believe it, maybe I?ll believe it too
So with a painted grin, I play the part again
So everyone will see me the way that I see them

Are we happy plastic people
Under shiny plastic steeples
With walls around our weakness
And smiles to hide our pain
But if the invitation?s open
To every heart that has been broken
Maybe then we close the curtain
On our stained glass masquerade

Is there anyone who?s been there
Are there any hands to raise
Am I the only one who?s traded
In the altar for a stage

The performance is convincing
And we know every line by heart
Only when no one is watching
Can we really fall apart

But would it set me free
If I dared to let you see
The truth behind the person
That you imagine me to be

Would your arms be open
Or would you walk away
Would the love of Jesus
Be enough to make you stay

Well if the invitation?s open
To every heart that has been broken
Maybe then we close the curtain
On our stained glass masquerade

Is there anyone that fails
Is there anyone that falls
Am I the only one in church today feelin? so small

-Casting Crowns, "Stained Glass Masquerade"

God help us all. Convict our hearts. Bring your church back to the truth of who You are, and to the truth of what it truly means to be "not of this world," because we've lost it. Jesus, Lord!

[Guest Guest]

[quote] I'm starting to realize that we truly have fallen in love with the stained glass masquerade. In this thread I've seen kids who are giving their all for God condemned because [b]they don't tow the old religious traditional idea of what a Christian should dress like[/b][/quote]

Read: choose to reject the bibles instruction to their own shame.


[quote]We truly have fallen in love with the stained glass masquerade. Father, forgive us for falling in love with the way church is done, instead of falling in love with You, for my generation is dying because of it.[/quote]

No generation dies for any other reason than a choice to reject the Word of God. That is the problem with this generation, and all generations. It is a masquerade to teach that one can love God and show godliness while ignoring the word of God. Yet that is basically what you are saying.

It is written:

[color=#0000FF]"John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments."[/color]

It is written:

[color=#0000FF]"Matthew 7:21-27 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. [b]Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. [/b]"[/color]

It is written:

[color=#0000FF]"Revelation 2:7 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God."[/color]