Are Christians That Drink Wine Not Saved?

[John81]

The song was written in 1899, same year as Lift every voice and sing and only ten years after Leaning on the everlasting arms. Is music as old as that considered CCM?

 

I've not heard any good music coming out of churches in the UK. It all just sounds like Bon Jovi with Christian lyrics on top. Back in the day Church music was so good that pop musicians imitated it. Nowadays, it's totally derivitive of pop music.

 

Here's a version by Mahalia Jackson btw.

 

Anyway 

I know some IFBs rejected Mahalia Jackson in the past, and some still do today, but I've not heard her come up among IFB probably since about the mid-90s.

 

I used some Mahalia Jackson music to help reach black youth during the mid-90s. No doubt things have changed much since then, but at that time many black youth recalled hearing their grandmothers play her music. I've seen young black street toughs suddenly transform before me as I played Mahalia Jackson on cassette in a portable "boom box" (no, not one of those big ones!). Nearly each time I used this approach the young toughs would suddenly change as they heard that music and ask what a white boy knows about that music. That opened the door to share the Gospel whereas before that these street toughs were trying to decide if I might be an undercover cop or a white boy they could intimidate.

[Steve Schwenke]

WOW!

Here we go 'round the mulberry bush, the mulberry bush, the mulberry bush.....

 

This verse came to mind a little while back....seems appropriate...

 

Luke 21:34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

[Alimantado]

Praise God! Great story, John.

 

I don't know too much about Jackson. I first came across her when I heard 'Come Sunday', which is a piece of light music that I like, and there seems to be a Jackson version of just about every Gospel hymn and old standard! 

[Steve Schwenke]

And just in case anyone missed it, it is those EXTREME IFB people who have high standards that are the problem!  If everyone would just settle for a mediocre Christian life that does not demand too much holiness, too much separation, too much temperance, or too much self-denial, well then, we would not be bickering with each other, and we could all gather 'round the campfire and sing a few CCM songs together......

 

YOU EXTREMISTS!!!  Get off your high horse, and condescend a little bit so that I can feel good about my sin!!!

 

Tomorrow's morning sermon:

101 ways to sin and feel good about it!!!

 

[John81]

WOW!

Here we go 'round the mulberry bush, the mulberry bush, the mulberry bush.....

 

This verse came to mind a little while back....seems appropriate...

 

Luke 21:34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

I'm not sure of your intended meaning, but I sure hope and pray that when the Lord returns I'm ready.

 

One thing that's helped me to deal with temptation is to stop and consider "what if Jesus returns while I'm giving in to this temptation?"

 

I don't drink, and thanks be to God I have no taste for alcohol, so there is no temptation for me to drink alcohol, but even so I know I certainly wouldn't want to be drunk when Christ returns.

[Alimantado]

Here we go 'round the mulberry bush, the mulberry bush, the mulberry bush.....

Here's the Mahalia Jackson version. Nah just kidding...

[Steve Schwenke]

I'm not sure of your intended meaning, but I sure hope and pray that when the Lord returns I'm ready.

 

One thing that's helped me to deal with temptation is to stop and consider "what if Jesus returns while I'm giving in to this temptation?"

 

I don't drink, and thanks be to God I have no taste for alcohol, so there is no temptation for me to drink alcohol, but even so I know I certainly wouldn't want to be drunk when Christ returns.

My meaning is that too many in our circles seem to be more consumed with excusing all manner of sin than they are with living a holy, separated life.  They might SAY they are ready for Christ's return, but given that they are pleasure oriented (or at least seemingly so), it gives me cause to wonder!

[John81]

My meaning is that too many in our circles seem to be more consumed with excusing all manner of sin than they are with living a holy, separated life.  They might SAY they are ready for Christ's return, but given that they are pleasure oriented (or at least seemingly so), it gives me cause to wonder!

Okay, I get your meaning now. I know some folks who love to say they are "rapture ready", and then they head off to indulge in questionable or even obviously sinful endeavors.

[Heir of Salvation]

And just in case anyone missed it, it is those EXTREME IFB people who have high standards that are the problem!  If everyone would just settle for a mediocre Christian life that does not demand too much holiness, too much separation, too much temperance, or too much self-denial, well then, we would not be bickering with each other, and we could all gather 'round the campfire and sing a few CCM songs together......

 

YOU EXTREMISTS!!!  Get off your high horse, and condescend a little bit so that I can feel good about my sin!!!

 

Tomorrow's morning sermon:

101 ways to sin and feel good about it!!!

 

 

This is merely spewing a self-indulgent load of junk..........."too much holiness" my bum sir......you are espousing "too much love of my own self-important righteousness"....That isn't Christ sir, you've missed the message it appears.

 

Good for you.....you are far more "law-abiding" than the rest of us.........we don't care for that.....we throw our miserable selves upon the perfect throne of God's holiness and simply beg for mercy as sinners.

 

I am quite enamored with your capacity to stand publically and proclaim your own worthiness.....

 

People like me beat our breasts in self-loathing and BEG for mercy..................but, you've apparently got the whole "righteousness" thing figured out for yourself already.

 

You remain righteous by your own standard........... I'll stake my fate upon begging for mercy.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

Though you may beat your breast in self-loathing and beg for mercy, you will not see that mercy from the Lord Jesus Christ.

Do you honestly believe that the Lord would save someone who identifies Him as a sinner as you do?

Psalms 66:18 If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:

Sorry, but until you repent of your wickedness of identifying the Lord as one who partook of and condones the drinking of alcohol, He doesn't hear you no matter how much you beg.

[Steve Schwenke]

This is merely spewing a self-indulgent load of junk..........."too much holiness" my bum sir......you are espousing "too much love of my own self-important righteousness"....That isn't Christ sir, you've missed the message it appears.

 

Good for you.....you are far more "law-abiding" than the rest of us.........we don't care for that.....we throw our miserable selves upon the perfect throne of God's holiness and simply beg for mercy as sinners.

 

I am quite enamored with your capacity to stand publically and proclaim your own worthiness.....

 

People like me beat our breasts in self-loathing and BEG for mercy..................but, you've apparently got the whole "righteousness" thing figured out for yourself already.

 

You remain righteous by your own standard........... I'll stake my fate upon begging for mercy.

It's called humor...try it some time...it works better than alcohol!

 

1Ti 5:24 Some men's sins are open beforehand, going before to judgment; and some men they follow after.
1Ti 5:25 Likewise also the good works of some are manifest beforehand; and they that are otherwise cannot be hid.

 

Alcohol is an open sin.  The worst of it is DEFENDING it as if it were NOT a sin...

So when you cast yourself upon God's throne, do you have a can of beer in your hand? Or a glass of wine?  With your CCM music in your headphones?  See, that doesn't work.  When you "beg for mercy" there should also be an attitude of repentance!  If you are not willing to repent of your sin, your pleas for mercy are of no avail!

 

I am not being self-righteous.  I am confident in my stand on this issue, but I am not fool enough to say "I am better than you because I don't drink alcohol."  Sin is sin, and my job as a preacher is to rebuke those who engage in sin.  My job is to preach against sin - ALL SIN - including pride, gluttony, intemperance, laziness, dishonesty, drunkenness, licentiousness, fornication, adultery, and "THE THOUGHT OF FOOLISHNESS" (Prov. 24:9)....

 

The hardest thing for a preacher to do is to preach against HIS OWN SINS...but if he is an honest man, he will, and hit the altar during the preparation of the sermon, before preaching it, and after preaching it....and then work on that area of his life.

 

It is my desire that all that I minister would be as close to Christ as they can.  They cannot be close to Christ is they are constantly feeding their selfish, fleshly desires....

 

2 Corinthians 7:1 Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

[Heir of Salvation]

Though you may beat your breast in self-loathing and beg for mercy, you will not see that mercy from the Lord Jesus Christ.

Do you honestly believe that the Lord would save someone who identifies Him as a sinner as you do?

Psalms 66:18 If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me:

Sorry, but until you repent of your wickedness of identifying the Lord as one who partook of and condones the drinking of alcohol, He doesn't hear you no matter how much you beg.

You are consigning to hell those who disagree with you...do you even READ your posts??? Or do you honestly assume that anyone who disagrees with you MUST be a hell-bound sinner.  This board doesn't even CARE!!! LOL what a joke....Baptist debates can (with impugnity) result in the accusation and questioning of another's salvation merely for disagreement....

 

Who runs this board anyway??? This is O.K. with you guys???? Maybe that's why there are myriads of other Baptists in the world and I.F.B's are the "bridesmaids"...what-a-joke. 

 

Call your presumptive brother in Christ a heathen.........and OnlineBaptist apparently doesn't care?..........are I.F.B's so VERY addicted to consigning their brothers to hell?  I shouldn't think they were.  But this is out of control, seriously....this is a joke. 

 

I wish you well, I don't think I'll participate anymore. 

 

But, before I go...I think I owe Steve something of an apology...I was unnecessarily harsh and caustic with you, and that was unwarranted.  I don't agree with you per se....but, I wasn't completely reasonable nor fair with your post...my apologies.  I should not have spoken to you as I did. I.M.O.

 

As for the rest of O.B.....consign people to hell as you wish...it's a joke to post on a board which permits that practice carte-blanche. 

Be well.

[JerryNumbers]

Sorry, Jerry...........you can't hide like that.  I think I know your heart PRECISELY given your posts. I'm not buying.  I think that I know your mind inside and out........I used to share it... a decade ago.

 

I MIGHT very well be wrong, but, I think I got you pegged, more or less. Men can indeed "read" a mind, if they are intimately familiar with it's thinking processes, and I used to post and speak just as you do.......exception being that my grammar was never quite so atrocious (and I thank my tee-totalling I.F.B. private school upbringing for that)..my parents spent THOUSANDS for my I.F.B. schooling, and no grammar school in three counties matches the quality of what I got there...

 

But you can't merely appeal to my own ignorance Jerry........I don't buy it.  I don't happen to think that I am quite as ignorant as you would like to convince me that I am.  I'm not.  And I thank my (admittedly tee-totaling, I.F.B.) education for it!

 

With this shout-out to quality I.F.B. KJVO Tee-totaling education....I bid you farewell for the time being..........My I.F.B. tee-totaling teachers did me an amazing turn...  God bless them, and God bless you.

 

Your now back to where you started, taking the same kind of stand, when you 1st came to this board. And I'm going to give you the same verse once again.

 

Ro 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

 

Enjoy your alcohol & playing god thinking your a mind reader, its going to be only shame when you face the Savior.

 

And I never said you were ignorant, that I was playing off your ignorance, your the one that brought that in, yet its not a shame to be ignorant, there's many things that I'm ignorant of & I will quickly admit it. Yet the one thing I'm not ignorant of, its Christians & alcohol.

[JerryNumbers]

My meaning is that too many in our circles seem to be more consumed with excusing all manner of sin than they are with living a holy, separated life.  They might SAY they are ready for Christ's return, but given that they are pleasure oriented (or at least seemingly so), it gives me cause to wonder!

 

Yes, as I said earlier, they either repent or ................................................................

 

Seems they would go to the ends of this earth to defend their sins of pleasure.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

You are consigning to hell those who disagree with you...do you even READ your posts??? Or do you honestly assume that anyone who disagrees with you MUST be a hell-bound sinner.  This board doesn't even CARE!!! LOL what a joke....Baptist debates can (with impugnity) result in the accusation and questioning of another's salvation merely for disagreement....

 

Who runs this board anyway??? This is O.K. with you guys???? Maybe that's why there are myriads of other Baptists in the world and I.F.B's are the "bridesmaids"...what-a-joke. 

 

Call your presumptive brother in Christ a heathen.........and OnlineBaptist apparently doesn't care?..........are I.F.B's so VERY addicted to consigning their brothers to hell?  I shouldn't think they were.  But this is out of control, seriously....this is a joke. 

 

I wish you well, I don't think I'll participate anymore. 

 

But, before I go...I think I owe Steve something of an apology...I was unnecessarily harsh and caustic with you, and that was unwarranted.  I don't agree with you per se....but, I wasn't completely reasonable nor fair with your post...my apologies.  I should not have spoken to you as I did. I.M.O.

 

As for the rest of O.B.....consign people to hell as you wish...it's a joke to post on a board which permits that practice carte-blanche. 

Be well.

Truth be known, we are not consigning anyone to hell.  Those who choose to lie about the Saviour, putting alcohol in His hands and saying that He condones the drinking of alcohol are consigning themselves to hell. 

Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

You can continue to hold onto and follow a sinful Jesus, I will continue to follow and hold onto the one that could not have even considered alcoholic beverage to be beneficial to His children... or to Himself.

It's a joke to name the name of Christ and not endeavor to pattern oneself after Christ.  it's a joke to call oneself a Christian and advocate sin. 

1 Corinthians 10:21 Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils.