Discussion Topic - Does God Love Everybody?

[anime4christ]

I give up, you jerk everything our of contest to mean what you want it to mean, not going to the Bible to see what God tells you to believe.

If it is so, I wouldn't mind it if you could show me. I just honestly believe that all good that is possible through people is only a result of God's grace. That's what the Bibles seems to teach as I see it. However, if you could prove me wrong, I'd be happy to accept that I was wrong. In either case, I don't think it's that big of a deal though.

[heartstrings]

I give up, you jerk everything our of contest to mean what you want it to mean, not going to the Bible to see what God tells you to believe.

Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

Isaiah 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Luke 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: 10Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. 11The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. 12I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

2 Timothy 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disOBedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, 4Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; 5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

I'm going to have to disagree and agree with both of you.
Many people have a form of godliness; some are liberal givers, some treat their neighbor right, some are faithful to their wives, never steal or cheat or whatever. But in reality, they are full of PRIDE. Even professed athiests want others to think they are good guys but actually, all of our hearts are "desperately wicked" and, without God or His Law, there would be much more wickedness. The constrainer is the Holy Spirit and the Law. If there is ANY form of Godliness in a person, it was instilled in that person by God himself. We don't produce it on our own. God saved us only by His grace......However.......it was by grace through faith. God shows a man how vile he is, against how wonderful God is, and He shows the consequences of not choosing Jesus....Hell. Felix was faced with such a choice and Felix trembled in fear....but he still chose death instead of life.

[anime4christ]

Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

Isaiah 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Luke 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: 10Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. 11The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. 12I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

2 Timothy 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disOBedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, 4Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; 5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

I'm going to have to disagree and agree with both of you.
Many people have a form of godliness; some are liberal givers, some treat their neighbor right, some are faithful to their wives, never steal or cheat or whatever. But in reality, they are full of PRIDE. Even professed athiests want others to think they are good guys but actually, all of our hearts are "desperately wicked" and, without God or His Law, there would be much more wickedness. The constrainer is the Holy Spirit and the Law. If there is ANY form of Godliness in a person, it was instilled in that person by God himself. We don't produce it on our own. God saved us only by His grace......However.......it was by grace through faith. God shows a man how vile he is, against how wonderful God is, and He shows the consequences of not choosing Jesus....Hell. Felix was faced with such a choice and Felix trembled in fear....but he still chose death instead of life.

I actually agree with that 100%.

[John81]

Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

Isaiah 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Luke 18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: 10Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. 11The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. 12I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

2 Timothy 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disOBedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 3Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, 4Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; 5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

I'm going to have to disagree and agree with both of you.
Many people have a form of godliness; some are liberal givers, some treat their neighbor right, some are faithful to their wives, never steal or cheat or whatever. But in reality, they are full of PRIDE. Even professed athiests want others to think they are good guys but actually, all of our hearts are "desperately wicked" and, without God or His Law, there would be much more wickedness. The constrainer is the Holy Spirit and the Law. If there is ANY form of Godliness in a person, it was instilled in that person by God himself. We don't produce it on our own. God saved us only by His grace......However.......it was by grace through faith. God shows a man how vile he is, against how wonderful God is, and He shows the consequences of not choosing Jesus....Hell. Felix was faced with such a choice and Felix trembled in fear....but he still chose death instead of life.

[ThomasCooper]

The answer to the original question is: ABSOLUTELY NOT!

Psalm 5:5, John 3:18

Some time ago, the esteemed Pastor JJ Hunter wrote the following rebuke letter to a "love theologist" he was debating. I think it covers all in good detail:

Is your God not omnipotent? Can He not love AND hate?

Lemme ask you this:

Do you sit in your room at night and TORTURE those you love for ENDLESS hours? Well, this is what you are telling me the Lord does. Gimme a break! Of course he HATES sinners!

You say:
Saying that God hates sinners contradicts John 3:16 and Romans 5:8

Why do "coupon christians" always pull John 3:16 out of their hat as evidence the Lord loves EVERYONE? Have you ever actually read it (and in context???):

John
16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17: For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

18: He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Here, we CLEARLY have the Lord stating that *ALL* those who do not believe in Jesus Christ are CONDEMNED! Sucks to be born out East, doesn't it!? Now, how does this exemplify His love for EVERYONE? Hmmmm?

Is your god so weak that he can not SAVE more than a tiny portion of His Creation (Mt.22:14)???? You state, "God does not send us to hell, WE do" --- HA! We can believe that, sure... AS LONG AS WE IGNORE THE ENTIRE BIBLE! I know MY GOD is not some weakling that is powerless to Save the majority his own creation from ETERNAL TORMENT and TORTURE! Nay, MY GOD chooses to send them there, and takes delight from it! He LAUGHS at those who conspire against him (Ps.2:2-4)! He takes DELIGHT in their suffering.


In fact, if you make God angry enough, he will kill you and your family with his own sword. (Ex.22:24)

In Christ's Love,
JJ Hunter

[heartstrings]

The answer to the original question is: ABSOLUTELY NOT!

Psalm 5:5, John 3:18

Some time ago, the esteemed Pastor JJ Hunter wrote the following rebuke letter to a "love theologist" he was debating. I think it covers all in good detail:

Romans 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
6For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. 7For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. 8But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.


This is the message of the Gospel, sir. God is Love: but God hates your wicked sin, you are His enemy, and He will put you in Hell if you reject His Son. But that is NOT His will. He wants you to be saved.


2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

[ThomasCooper]

How exactly do those verse say that Jesus loves all? I see that it says that He loves all true Christians, a.k.a. His Elect.

[heartstrings]

How exactly do those verse say that Jesus loves all? I see that it says that He loves all true Christians, a.k.a. His Elect.

Romans 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
6For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. 7For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. 8But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
"comendeth His love toward us...while were yet sinners"

Amazing! You read right over the verse and still don't get it! Edited July 30, 2010 by heartstrings

[ThomasCooper]

8But God commendeth his love toward us

This verse talks about the Elect who are saved. The Lord indeed Loves His Elect, His children. Not so for the children of the devil--they will go to hell!

[heartstrings]

This verse talks about the Elect who are saved. The Lord indeed Loves His Elect, His children. Not so for the children of the devil--they will go to hell!

"....while we were yet sinners"

Was this man elect then?
Mark 10:21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me. 22And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions. Edited July 31, 2010 by heartstrings

[Invicta]

"....while we were yet sinners"

Was this man elect then?
Mark 10:21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me. 22And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.

There you go shouting again. We can all read, I believe.

Do we know that that man did not come to Jesus later? Some think that it was Paul. Anyway Jesus chose Paul over all those about him.

[Invicta]

Luke 19:1 ¶ And Jesus entered and passed through Jericho.
2 And, behold, there was a man named Zacchaeus, which was the chief among the publicans, and he was rich.
3 And he sought to see Jesus who he was; and could not for the press, because he was little of stature.
4 And he ran before, and climbed up into a sycomore tree to see him: for he was to pass that way.
5 And when Jesus came to the place, he looked up, and saw him, and said unto him, Zacchaeus, make haste, and come down; for to day I must abide at thy house.
6 And he made haste, and came down, and received him joyfully.
7 And when they saw it, they all murmured, saying, That he was gone to be guest with a man that is a sinner.
8 And Zacchaeus stood, and said unto the Lord; Behold, Lord, the half of my goods I give to the poor; and if I have taken any thing from any man by false accusation, I restore him fourfold.
9 And Jesus said unto him, This day is salvation come to this house, forsomuch as he also is a son of Abraham.
10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

[DennisD]

There you go shouting again. We can all read, I believe.

Do we know that that man did not come to Jesus later? Some think that it was Paul. Anyway Jesus chose Paul over all those about him.

As has been presented to you in the past. Not all people believe changing the font and/or bolding something is shouting. Some believe it is just emphasizing a particular part of a post. Edited August 8, 2010 by DennisDurty

[John81]

As has been presented to you in the past. Not all people believe changing the font and/or bolding something is shouting. Some believe it is just emphasizing a particular part of a post.

True, but overuse of this can be bothersome for some folks. There are other ways to emphasize as well and sometimes it's good to mix them up...we can bold words, we can enlarge words, we can bold and enlarge words, we can type a particular word in all caps, we can place a symbol (*) around what we want to emphasize, we can use a presenting sentence to indicate what we are about to type is key, etc.

For the most part, on OB anyway, most of us are capable of getting the point without emphasis, but there are times a bit of emphasis can be helpful.

When emphasis is overused it becomes far less effective and even annoying for some.

[heartstrings]

There you go shouting again. We can all read, I believe.

Do we know that that man did not come to Jesus later? Some think that it was Paul. Anyway Jesus chose Paul over all those about him.

Actually, if you agreed with the content of the post, I doubt the "shouting" would be a prOBlem for you. You disagree with the content.