Order of salvation

[agoodtheory]

salvation has no order; by it's very definition, IT'S THE CASTING OFF OF ORDER.

salvation can literally be summed up in one small statement; i cannot. i cannot do enough, i cannot have enough faith, i cannot believe enough, etc..

there is no 'order of salvation'. God is, therefore I AM SAVED. the Bible says over and over again 'Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved'; it doesn't say 'say this prayer' or 'think this thought'. no, it says believe in Jesus Christ and you're saved.

'the old man' and 'the new man' in the Bible refers to EXACTLY this. we don't understand salvation (it can't be understood because it's of God, not men; compared to everything we know on earth, it has no logical comparison) so we prescribe a definition to it and try to order it into a nice, neat little list of 'to do's' and 'do nots', when that's the very kind of thinking we're SAVED FROM! THE OLD MAN tries to 'understand' God by applying what he ALREADY KNOWS to Him, whereas THE NEW MAN admits that he cannot understand God.

if more christians really understood what faith actually IS, they would realize that the only reason they have doubts about their salvation is because they're looking at themselves instead of the Savior. faith is NOT something you 'have', rather, you ARE faith.

[orvals]

To: agoodtheory,

You said ?Salvation has no order. By its very definition it is the casting off of order.?

The first verse I thought of was let all things be done decently and in order of course Paul was speaking to the Corinthian believers concerning the exercising of their particular gifts. None-the-less we know that God does things in order beginning with creation and ending with his reign and rule on the throne of David during the Millennium. God planned for salvation from the beginning and when he set forth his plan he also set forth the orderly steps within that process.

When you say that ?God is and therefore I am saved? you are speaking universalism which I would tell you is foolishness and false theology.

Look at Israel they not only believed they were God?s people they knew that God existed and had interceded for them many times in the Old Testament. And yet believing in God and knowing that God existed and had worked miracles on their behalf did not save them.

You may believe that salvation has no order but that does not line up with what we know of God. Let us consider for a few minutes the word ?preached? which is used once in Psalms but used 58 times in the New Testament and virtually every time it is used it is in reference to the Word of God being presented to unbelievers in order for the Holy Spirit to convict the sinner of his sin.

Let us look at Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. The whosever spoken of in this verse are identified in verses 14-17 as those who heard, those who heard were those who had been preached to, and those who were preached to were those who were convicted of their sin, and those who were convicted of their sin realized their sin separated themselves from God, and those who realized they were separated realized there was no hope beyond God?s direct interference in their respective lives.

Man does not come to Christ based on the fact that God merely exists have you forgotten the drawing by the Holy Spirit? John 6:44 and 12:32

Conviction and godly sorrow are still prerequisites of salvation and are therefore part of the order in our salvation experience.

Let us go back to the Old Testament temple experience and look at the Israelite who brings a sacrificial lamb to the priest.

First they must acknowledge before they even get the lamb that there is sin and that their sin has no remedy apart from the sacrificial offering.

They then bring that sacrifice for their sin to the priest who upon ritual cleansing of himself offers the lamb as a substitute for the sinner who brought it.

The sinner literally lays his hands on the head of the lamb and watches as that lamb dies (literally) for the sins of that Israelite. That blood that was shed at that moment in time is shed for that Israelites sin. His salvation was not based on who God is but on following the prescribed order established by God for the covering of personal and national sin until Jesus Christ.

There was an order in the wilderness and there is an order now as always if one does not believe he will not do but if one believes he will follow a specific order that leads one to salvation.

Romans 10:14-17 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things! But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.


Orvals

[BaptistLady02]

There are no steps to salvation. See the following link:

http://www.gotquestions.org/steps-to-salvation.html

[orvals]

Sorry Baptistlady we will have to agree to disagree.

orvals

[ptwild]

The concept of there being certain "steps" invovled in salvation is interesting. I think the Bible and the early church leaders were pretty clear that it is our faith (or belief a la John 3:16) which procurs our salvation. So I guess there is one step. You step from a position of disbelief (a "lost" position) to a position of belief/faith (a salvation position). Baptism has nothing to do with it.

[heartstrings]

God took all the 'steps'.
He came to earth, born of a virgin. Lived among men. Healed the sick, raised the dead, made the blind to see. He gave himself on the cross of Calvary for the sins of the whole world, then He rose from the dead. He provided and preserved His holy Word for you and I and He left His Holy Spirit here on this earth, indwelling believers for over two thousand years. It was His Holy Spirit who convicted my heart through the preaching of the Word of God.
All I 'did' was believed His claim...that I was wicked, lost, undone, and condemend.
And I believed that He loved me personally, and gave Himself for me.
All I did was believe on Jesus, with all my heart.

I don't think I took any steps.
On Mother's Day, 1986, on Sunday morning, on the left side of the church, about 3 rows back, I remember they sang "Love lifted Me". Having heard the gospel many times before, I was already under conviction of my lowdown ungodly self when the preacher began, full of the Holy Ghost, and preached from the 23rd Psalm. I was confronted with the Love of a Holy God. Jesus was calling for me personally. When the altar call came, I remember hesitating for a second, then I shook my head thinking, "no". I don't know WHO I was saying "no" to, the devil or myself, but about 2 seconds later, I made for the end of the pew. And before I could get out of the pew, I was already HOLLERING..."JESUS!". I beleive He came into my heart and saved me about the split second before I hollered. Hollering didn't save me, coming down to the altar didn't either. It happened in my heart when I admitted what a wretch I was and how wonderful He was and trusted Him in my heart.

You must humble yourself before Him, as a little child, and trust in Jesus.
You must agree with God, that HE is right and you are wrong, and humble your heart, trust His mercy and grace. It can all happen in one split second, in your heart. And when it truly does, believe me when I say, there WILL be a change, you WILL love God, He will come into your heart and there will be a peace and a joy that floods your soul, that you cannot contain and this wicked world cannot understand.