Gasoline grumbling thread

[IM4given]

I thought I would post a thread to discuss the gasoline prices. I live in Florida and the prices here have hit the $4 mark. I never imagined I would ever in my lifetime pay this much for gasoline. I can remember getting all upset when gasoline when beyond $1.00 gallon and every gasoline pump in the nation had to be replaced! (Sort of a Y2K thing for you younger folks!)

I found a map of gasoline prices for the entire country here at this link - it is near the bottome of the page.
http://www.baynews9.com/GasPrices.html#citrus

I have been reading articles about how schools are implementing 4 day school weeks to save gasoline. What are some of the ways you guys are changing the way you do things, if any?

Here is some crazy guy who thinks the gas prices aren't high enough! (maybe he owns an oil well ?)

$8-a-gallon gas

Commentary: Eight reasons higher prices will do us a world of good
By Chris Pummer

Last update: 7:30 p.m. EDT May 28, 2008

SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- For one of the nastiest substances on earth, crude oil has an amazing grip on the globe. We all know the stuff's poison, yet we're as dependent on it as our air and water supplies -- which, of course, is what oil is poisoning.

Shouldn't we be technologically advanced enough here in the 21st Century to quit siphoning off the pus of the Earth? Regardless whether you believe global warming is threatening the planet's future, you must admit crude is pass

[pneu-engine]

I saw where he intimated that the oil supply is finite. Even though his statement is intrinsically true, what is patently false is to think that crude oil is in short supply. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Petrol-Crude is a constantly renewing resource, and is not a fossil fuel..

[Lee-Anne]

Fuel in Australia is just as bad or worse!! There is HUGE public uproar at the moment over this issue!

What have we done? We only use our car when we absolutely have too. Dave now rides his bike and takes the train to work.

Have you read Matthew 24 lately? Don't you think we are in the begining of sorrows? Even so come Lord Jesus! :amen:

[pneu-engine]

I don't know if it is the beginning of sorrows, but the economy is definitely going downhill.

However, consider the bad times of previous eras::::::::

***the great depression of '29

***The Dark Ages

***The reign of terror in Europe

***The Roman occupation of Jerusalem at the time of Christ.

***The persecution and martyrdom of Believers in other countries all down thru the ages.

[tired]

Soon there will be gangs and mob types stealing gas trucks.

[IM4given]

Look on the bright side -Maybe we will return the good old little red school houses where we all WALK or ride our BIKES to school?

States grapple with fuel costs for school buses
Friday, May 30, 2008

By WHITNEY WOODWARD

RALEIGH, N.C. (AP) -- The reality of rising fuel costs students in a Tennessee school district their bus ride to school this week on the last day of the year.

That's a minor inconvenience compared with what might happen this fall in Minnesota, where a district west of Minneapolis plans to eliminate classes every Monday to come up with the extra $65,000 it needs to fill its buses' tanks.

"I know $65,000 may not sound like a lot, but it's more than one teaching position," said Greg Schmidt, the superintendent in the 700-student MACCRAY district.

And in North Carolina, Nash-Rocky Mount Public Schools teachers have scaled back the number of field trips this spring to save fuel, transportation director Binford Sloan said.

The skyrocketing costs at the pump are forcing educators nationwide to trim programs, curb spending and cut down on fuel consumption. Schools are employing unusual cost-savings measures to salvage busted budgets, while lawmakers grapple with how to pay for popular classroom initiatives threatened by the need to pour more money into the fuel tank.

Nash-Rocky Mount schools burned through about $729,000 in fuel in the last fiscal year _ nearly twice as much as in the previous year, Sloan said.

The fleet gets about 7 miles to the gallon, which means the district burns through 7,500 gallons every 3 1/2 school days, Sloan said. Recent buys have cost him close to $29,000.

"We've tried pretty much all that we can to save and improve efficiency," Sloan said.

North Carolina Gov. Mike Easley wants to give teachers a 7 percent raise, but the lawmakers who write the state's budget are also on the hunt for tens of millions to cover school fuel bills. Rising diesel prices prompted Oklahoma's Education Department to ask legislators there to increase the schools operations budget, while Texas lawmakers have said they will re-evaluate their state's school funding system, which has been criticized as ill-equipped to handle sudden spikes in costs such as fuel.

In Tennessee, students who attend Putnam County Schools east of Nashville went without bus service Wednesday, saving the district the $2,300 it costs to operate its fleet each day, said district director Kathleen Airhart. Only a fraction of the student body usually takes the bus on the final day, and Airhart said she received no complaints from parents.

"I think everyone realizes what's happening," Airhart said. "Everyone's pocketbook is being affected by this gas cost."

Schmidt said most of the feedback to the plan to cut back to a four-day school week in his district, which covers the towns of Maynard, Clara City and Raymond, has been positive, although he said he realizes it will inconvenience those parents who will have to find child care on Mondays. The change will mean students will attend 23 fewer days of school a year, and the length of the regular school day will be extended by a little more than an hour to compensate.

"I think the parents, most of them are supportive because they understand our situation," Schmidt said.

Not every cost-saving measure has been so draconian. Drivers in the Fairport Central School District outside of Rochester, N.Y., have been instructed to not make special trips back to schools if students forget their coats or lunches on their morning rides, said superintendent Jon Hunter.

"We're certainly more cognizant of what it costs to run a 60-passenger bus back to school to accomplish that," Hunter said. Drivers instead are returning to the bus depot and using a smaller vehicle to ferry the item to the student's school.

This month, the Mississippi High School Activities Association approved a plan to cut the number of varsity games by 10 percent beginning this fall for all sports except football. The districts will save by driving their basketball, softball and baseball teams to three fewer games a season, said Booneville, Miss., schools superintendent Rickey Neaves.

"When you take into account the number of buses you have to go to a game and the mileage, it mounts up pretty quick," Neaves said.

When North Carolina lawmakers drafted the state's current two-year spending plan, they estimated a gallon of diesel would cost $1.69 this school year and $1.83 starting this fall. Those estimates proved to be woefully low, forcing state education officials to scramble for an extra $27 million to get the state's school bus fleet through the end of this school year.

Legislators have already set aside about $46 million for fuel this coming year, and they're planning to add $45 million more. Districts have "got to have that money from the state," said Leanne Winner, a lobbyist with the North Carolina School Boards Association, "or that will essentially cripple their operations for next year."

[tired]

:fireball: :fireball: :mad: :flame: :flaming: This is how I feel when I think of gas prices

[IM4given]

Soon there will be gangs and mob types stealing gas trucks.

Already happening....

Pa. police: Ohio truck rigged to steal fuel

Thursday, May 29, 2008


By The Associated Press
HERMITAGE, Pa. (AP) -- Police have linked the large-scale theft of diesel fuel from a western Pennsylvania convenience store to a specially equipped pickup truck trailer with a trap door and a vacuum hose.

No one has been charged, but the truck and trailer were found on the property of a man who owns a small asphalt and trucking company in Ohio, police said.

"It's a very ingenious way of doing things and I've never seen anything like this," said Hermitage Deputy Police Chief Edward Holiga.

Holiga said his department is investigating whether the truck is linked to at least three thefts since 2005. In the latest, about $4,500 worth of diesel fuel was reported stolen April 28 from the underground tanks of the Tic Toc Food Mart in Hermitage.

Police issued a surveillance photo of the pickup and trailer believed to be involved in the thefts and received a tip that led them to a property in North Bloomfield, Ohio, about 30 miles northwest of Hermitage.

Police spotted the truck and trailer on the property Tuesday and obtained a search warrant that was executed Wednesday.

The trailer contained a straw wall that concealed a wooden partition. The partition hid a siphoning mechanism and an empty 15-foot long propane tank.

Police believe someone inside the trailer would siphon diesel fuel from underground tanks at fuel stations by lowering a hose through the trap door and using the pickup's engine to power a vacuum that drew the fuel into the tank, Holiga said.

Police also found several storage tanks on the Ohio property, including a 5,000-gallon tank containing about 500 gallons of diesel fuel.

Holiga said police in Ohio are investigating at least one theft there, too.

Because police are continuing to investigate the thefts, Holiga said he doesn't expect his detectives to file charges until next week.

[IM4given]

:fireball: :fireball: :mad: :flame: :flaming: This is how I feel when I think of gas prices

I remember I felt the same way the day gasoline topped $2!!!!!!!!! That would be a bargain now!

[IM4given]

http://www.gaspriceprotest.com

[IM4given]

Did you know that the new gasoline tanks are made of plastic !?!?!

Tank Tapping: New Trend in Gas Theft

posted by Crystal Gutierrez KDBC 4 News

The pricy cost of gas is leading to new methods of gas theft and it's only taking a thief a screwdriver and a couple of minutes to steal the precious commodity.

Instead of siphoning gas through a small hose, thieves are puncturing holes in gas tanks, and allowing gravity to take care of the rest.

Tracy Heal, owner of Affordable Automotive and Radiator Services, said the thieves are targeting SUVs, Trucks and Suburbans because of these vehicles carry more fuel.

Heal said it's a new theft trend that's already taking place in borderland, since he's already received several calls for appointments to replace gas tanks.

Heal added that newer tanks are made of plastic which cannot be repaired so they need to replaced. Replacing them could cost well into the hundreds.

[IM4given]

Tanks Under Attack: Gas Theft Evolves
Thieves Thirsting for $4-a-Gallon-and-Rising Gas Tap Into Gas Tanks
By JEFF KAROUB
AP Business Writer
DETROIT
May 28, 2008 ?

Dale Fortin is getting a new kind of customer at his Detroit auto repair shop, customers who have not just been in a fender-bender or had a windshield smashed by a rock.

The soaring price of crude oil has turned gas tanks into a cache of valuable booty, and Fortin has replaced several tanks punctured or drilled by thieves thirsting for the nearly $4-a-gallon fuel inside.

"That's the new fad," he said. "I'd never seen it before gas got up this high."

How Are You Dealing With Gas Prices? Tell ABC News

While gas station drive-offs and siphoning are far more common methods of stealing gas, reports of tank and line puncturing are starting to trickle into police departments and repair shops across the country.

Some veteran mechanics and law enforcement officers say it's an unwelcome return of a crime they first saw during the Middle East oil embargo of the early 1970s.

Gasoline prices surged just before the long Memorial Day holiday weekend and crept a hair higher overnight Monday to a new record national average $3.937 for a gallon of regular, according to a survey of stations by AAA and the Oil Price Information Service.

Given their height, Fortin said pickup trucks and sport utility vehicles are more vulnerable to the thieves who puncture the tanks and use a container to catch the fuel.

Plastic tanks are typically the target, he said, since there is less chance of a catastrophic spark, and they are easier to drill into.

A design change may also be contributing to the preference for a drill rather than a syphoning hose. The tanks in many vehicles now have check balls, which prevent spills in a rollover accident. They also make siphoning more difficult.

In recent weeks, police in Denver arrested two suspects in connection with about a dozen cases of damaging tanks and stealing gas.

Denver Police Det. John White sees this "new way of siphoning gas" as a bigger problem.

"What made this particular method so dangerous and concerning for us was the way in which they were doing it ? using cordless drills to puncture holes in these tanks," he said of the rash of cases his department has investigated this spring. "The heat, friction generated could have easily sparked a fire. It just made for a dangerous situation for the suspects and the community."

Tank puncturing has yet to reach the radar screens of law enforcement organizations such as the National Sheriffs' Association, or the Automotive Service Association, a group that represents independent garage operators.

Still, at least one insurance company has taken notice: AAA Mid-Atlantic issued a press release earlier this month that cited a case in April in Bethesda, Md., involving a thief who broke the fuel line underneath a car and sapped five gallons of gas. Montgomery County police said a bus in the same parking lot had 30 gallons of diesel stolen.

"These are crimes of opportunity," said AAA spokeswoman Catherine Rossi. "Right now, some people think that stealing gas is a way to get rich quick. It becomes a question of whether you're leaving yourself open to the possibility that someone can get to your car without being seen."

The cost of replacing a metal tank on passenger vehicles is between $300 and $400, and the plastic tank common on newer vehicles would be at least $500.

Bruce Burnham said thieves have hit the Budget Truck Rental business he owns in Shreveport, La., about a half-dozen times in the past three years. The thefts started shortly after Hurricane Katrina when prices spiked, then stopped for a while, then restarted about a year ago.

In some cases the gas lines have been cut; in others, gas has been pumped out. He figures he's lost at least a few thousand dollars in stolen fuel, repair costs and loss of rental fees.

Burnham said he has taken "extra measures to protect the vehicles," but declined to elaborate.

Gas and diesel aren't the only fuels being plundered. Restaurants from Berkeley, Calif., to Sedgwick, Kan., are reporting thefts of old cooking oil worth thousands of dollars. Cooking oil rustlers refine it into barrels of biofuel in backyard stills. Biodiesel can also be blended with petroleum diesel, and blends of the alternative fuel are now sold at 1,400 gas stations across the country.

Still, the theft of regular unleaded gasoline ? the kind that leaves everyday drivers high and dry ? is on the minds of more law enforcement agencies as prices rise.

Troy Police Lt. Gerry Scherlinck said his suburban Detroit department this month received a report of a stored motor home whose tank was siphoned and drained of 50 gallons of gas. They also had several incidents last year in industrial parks where the gas tanks of vehicles were punctured.

"Gas is liquid gold these days, and has been for the last year-and-a-half," Scherlinck said. "I would anticipate seeing more of these kinds of incidents as the price continues to go up."

[IM4given]

Here is something else to watch out for.....

Crooks Stealing License Plates To Get Free Gas

Last Update: 5/29 12:03 pm

A gas station in San Francisco, Calif. displays prices in excess of $4.00 per gallon. (AP) SALT LAKE CITY - Criminals don't like today's high gasoline prices any more than the average citizen, and authorities say they are coming up with more clever ways to steal their fuel.

One of the ways crooks are making off with free gas, is by stealing license plates from other vehicles. Authorities say the stolen plates are then put onto the thief's own vehicle during the course of a "pump and run" -- a method where drivers fill their tank with fuel and drive off without paying.

But with someone else's license plates on their vehicle, the thieves are largely getting away with it. Witnesses or store clerks typically write down the license plate numbers of "pump and run" offenders and report them to authorities.

Officials recommend that drivers periodically check their vehicles to make certain the license plate is not missing. Those who discover their license plate missing are encouraged to contact authorities immediately.

[IM4given]

[May 30, 2008]

Rising fuel thefts coming with high gas prices

As if paying $4.50 for a gallon of gas isn't frustrating enough, now you have to worry about thieves stealing it right from your tank.

Already, clever videos on how to steal gas, detailing siphoning techniques and showing viewers how to post fake pump numbers at gas stations to fuel up on someone else's dime are proliferating on the video-sharing Web site YouTube.

L.A.-area automotive stores are reporting an increase in sales of lockable gas caps, with customers complaining about their tanks being siphoned dry.

And police are warning that it could only be a matter of time before Los Angeles motorists are the target of a surge in gas thefts that have begun to ripple across the country.

"Thefts will occur if gas prices continue to go up," said Detective Lou Koven, a supervisor in the LAPD's Commercial Crimes Unit and a 16-year veteran in the burglary and auto-theft detail.

While the LAPD hasn't seen a serious spike in gas thefts yet, officials said there have been scattered cases of siphoning, and residents are urged to be cautious.

"Put on a lock-in gas cap and park the cars in the garage," Koven said.

During the 1970s, when tightening oil supplies forced rationing at the pump, a rash of gas thefts swept the city. While the same level of theft hasn't returned, there are plenty of signs it's happening.

"It's crazy, people are getting very desperate. It's a bad situation," said Hugo Cardenas, a manager at Big O Auto Parts in Arleta.

Cardenas used to sell one or two gas caps with locks a month, but now he is selling two or three a week. And with every purchase, there is nearly always a story that follows.

"They tell us they parked it on the street and at first they had a full tank and then they have a quarter tank."

Many of his customers who have been victimized own SUVs or other large vehicles with gas tanks up to 25 gallons. At $4 a gallon, a 25-gallon tank is equivalent to $100.

Law enforcement and the American Automobile Association stress: If you can't park your car in a secure garage, make sure it is as visible to others as possible.

Los Angeles police have reported cases in which siphoners were caught in the act and forced to run away after being confronted by passers-by.

And more thieves might be trying their luck as prices go up.

With homemade videos such as "How to steal gas," "Stealing gas -- The Basics" and "How to siphon gas from a newer vehicle" spreading on the Internet, small-time crooks can easily get their hands on how-to guides to stealing gas from the pump or the tank.

Tens of thousands of viewers have seen the videos, which show online celebrity con artists trying to outdo each other with the best stealing techniques.

But Koven warned thieves not to post videos of themselves stealing gas because -- like the tagger "Bucket" who recorded his daring feats spray-painting his name across the Hollywood Freeway -- they are likely to get busted.

Outside Los Angeles, thieves are taking it more seriously.

In recent weeks, one auto repairman in Wisconsin reported more than $400 worth of gas stolen from cars in his lot. In New Mexico, police reported $2million worth of fuel, mostly diesel, ripped off from 30 service stations.

From Detroit to Denver, crooks also have given a whole new meaning to drilling for oil -- literally drilling holes in $300 gas tanks to drain the fuel.

Detective Robert Phan of the Los Angeles Police Department's Mission Division said he's received one report in the past two months of crooks trying to drain the tank of a 2000 Dodge Charger in Sylmar.

The culprits popped the gas cap and slipped the hose into the tank before someone saw them. They ran away.

Oil industry groups are warning petroleum distributors and shop owners in California to be more vigilant and are encouraging them to invest in video systems to deter thieves.

"The higher the price of the fuel, the more attractive it becomes as something to steal, but I don't know what the tipping point is or when it becomes more widespread," said Jay McKeeman, vice president of governmental relations for the California Independent Oil Marketers Association.

"We have advised our members to increase security at their stations and their bulk plants," he said. But, he added, "It is not something our members are raising alarms over."

And some who have experienced the trend have come away lucky.

Mike Plummer, an employee at Automotive Instincts in Northridge, said gas thieves targeted his wife's 2003 Sonoma pickup truck one night while it was parked in the alley outside the couple's Mission Hills home.

They discovered what had happened when they found the truck's gas cap on the ground.

"They tried, but there wasn't enough gas to get anything," Plummer said. "She was running on fumes."

[IM4given]

High gas prices hit consumers worldwide
By ANGELA CHARLTON ? 19 hours ago

PARIS (AP) ? Feeling woozy about the fortune you've just pumped into your gas tank? Drivers around the world share the sensation.

Consumers, gas retailers and governments are wrestling with a new energy order, where rising oil prices play a larger role than ever in the daily lives of increasingly mobile people. But as the cost of crude mounts, the effect on the price at the pump varies startlingly ? from Venezuela, where gas is cheaper than water, to Turkey, where a full tank can cost more than a domestic plane ticket.

Taxes and subsidies are the main reasons for the differences, along with lesser factors such as limited oil refining capacity and hard-to-reach geography that push up prices.

"I don't know why it is but... it hurts," says Marie Penucci, a violinist filling up her Volkswagen at an Esso station on the bypass that rings Paris.

As she pumped gas worth $9.66 a gallon she looked wistfully at a commuter climbing onto one of the city's cheap rent-a-bikes, an option not open to her since she travels long distances to perform.

High taxes in Europe and Japan have long accustomed consumers to staggering pump prices, which now are testing new pain thresholds ? and it could have been even worse, if a strong euro hadn't cushioned some of the blow. As a result, plenty of European adults never even bother to learn to drive, preferring cheap mass transit to cumbersome cars.

Subsidies in emerging economies such as China and India, meanwhile, shield consumers but hurt governments, which must find a way to afford rising market prices for oil.

Increasingly, they can't. Indonesians are staging protests against shrinking gasoline subsidies in a nation where nearly half the population of 235 million lives on less than $2 a day. And there are now 887 million vehicles in the world, up from 553 million vehicles just 15 years ago, and on track to nearly double to a billion by 2012, according to London-based consultancy Global Insight.

In Europe, taxes are often the focus, since the high tax burden means crude itself is a smaller part of the burden.

"The pain of a rise in prices is much less in Europe, because we may be paying a lot more here, but the rise in a percentage sense is a lot smaller," said Julius Walker, oil analyst at the Paris-based International Energy Agency.

The United States, with its relatively low taxes, is considered to have retail prices closer to what energy data charts call the "real cost" of gasoline ? which is closely linked to the price of oil.

So as oil prices have soared, average U.S. prices have gone up 144 percent in the past five years ? from $1.67 in May 2003 to $4.02 a gallon this month, according to the U.S. Energy Information Administration. Over the same period, gas prices in France went up 117 percent to $9.66 a gallon.

Proposals by U.S. presidential candidates John McCain and Hillary Clinton to suspend federal gas taxes this summer would lower the price tag ? but have little effect on the underlying oil price. French President Nicholas Sarkozy has urged the EU to cut value-added tax on fuel.

French fishermen and farmers, who need fuel for their trawlers and tractors, say their livelihoods are threatened by soaring prices and have blocked oil terminals around France and shipping traffic on the English Channel to demand government help. Italian, Portuguese and Spanish fisherman joined them and went on strike Friday. British and Bulgarian truckers are staging fuel protests, too.

Russia is proof that big oil-producing nations are not in any better shape when it comes to gasoline prices. Gas in the world's No. 2 oil producer runs about $3.68 a gallon ? nearly that in the United States, where the average wage is about six times higher.

Much of the Russian cost comes from taxes, which run between 60 and 70 percent. Limited refining capacity and the costs of transporting gasoline across the country's vast expanse also push up prices.

Turkey faces similar problems ? and even higher prices ? $11.29 a gallon, which for a full tank in a midsize car can reach nearly $200, enough for a domestic plane ticket.

In China, government-mandated low retail gasoline prices have helped farmers and China's urban poor but also have hurt conservation. In the first four months of 2008, gasoline consumption was up 5.5 percent from the same period last year.

Venezuela, too, is a gas-guzzler's wonderland. A gallon costs just 12 cents and consumers are snapping up SUVs even as Americans are shunning them. Thanks to long-held government subsidies and plenty of oil, Venezuelans see cheap fuel as a birthright.

Some policymakers in less oil-flush nations look to Brazil's use of ethanol as a potential solution. Ethanol from sugarcane is widely available in the world's No. 1 sugar producer and its 190 million people. Eight out of every 10 new cars sold are flex-fuel models that run on pure ethanol, gas or any combination of the two. The price for ethanol in Sao Paulo is currently running about half the price of gas, which runs $5.67 per gallon.

In Japan, gas station owners say some customers aren't filling up their tanks all the way.

"It's been tough. I had to switch to regular gasoline from premium class," said Hiroyuki Kashiwabara, a company employee in his 50s whose monthly spending on gasoline has increased by nearly 10,000 yen ($96) over the last couple of months. "My salary doesn't change and I can't cut back on my spending on food or anything else."

Americans, too, are beginning to trim their hearty gas appetites.

"We're beginning to see a slowdown in the U.S. in gasoline demand in particular. That's not so visible in other parts of the world," the IEA's Walker said.

Jean-Marc Jancovici, a French engineer and co-author of a philosophical treatise called "Fill It Up, Please!" despairs rising thirst in the developing world for shrinking oil resources.

"The real question is ... how to save peace and democracy in this context," he asks.

His answer? To rich-country consumers, at least, he says: Pick up your bike and "stop being petroleum slaves."

Associated Press writers David Nowak in Moscow; Robin McDowell in Jakarta, Indonesia; Ian James in Caracas, Venezuela; Alan Clendenning in Brasilia, Brazil; Joe McDonald in Beijing; Mari Yamaguchi and Shino Yuasa in Tokyo; Ashok Sharma in New Delhi; and Franziska Scheven and A.J. Goldmann in Berlin contributed to this report.
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