Adrian Rogers - Sermon - Don't Be A Disgrace To Grace

[John81]

I get your point Dave, I didn't take your post as any sort of jab or mean mine to seem as such either. Just discussing, but as we know our writing can be taken in different ways by different folks.

 

From your time here I know you understand salvation and wouldn't agree with the idea of simply telling someone to repeat a simplistic prayer, declare them to be heaven bound, and leave them.

 

As for the confession from the verse above, I've heard that related to prayer and also as mean confessing Christ publically, in the sense of how Christ said those who confess Him before men, He will confess before His Father (and those who deny Him before men, He will deny before His Father).

 

In various passages we read of those who were hearing Peter preaching and the Holy Ghost came upon them. That means they were saved. As with Cornelius, we read of him and his family being baptized right after such an occurrence.

 

I think we agree that if one is saved, their words and actions will indicate such.

 

Those (such as Charles Stanley and others) who preach that one can get saved and continue to live like the devil are not preaching from solid biblical ground.

 

So many folks I know point back to saying a "sinners prayer" or to them being baptized as their assurance of heaven. Try talking to them about Jesus, the Bible, church, the fruit of their lives, and they nearly always get defensive, declare no one can know their heart, and often point out how much better they are than certain other people. It's really sad.

[Covenanter]

This discussion is now going the way I hoped it would. Thanks folk.

Casting my memory back 60 years ......
I was baptised as a baby and taught I was a Christian, confirmed in 1951 at 12. I went to the same school as Isaac Watts. Divinity lessons were Scriptural and included discussions. When Billy Graham came to London, the novel idea of conversion by going forward was discussed. I did not need to respond - I was already a Christian.

When BG returned I was then attending a Bible class. There were lots of campaign meetings led by BG imitators. I never went forward, but said the salvation prayer, just to make sure. I went to Wembley Stadium in a coach party to hear him. I was moved more by the Gospel singing in the coach than the preaching. But I knew I was already a Christian. BUT, no conviction of sin. No repentance.

At 18 I was praying, meditating on the Law and how well I was keeping the commandments when the Lord reminded me of the great commandments. I was convicted and saved, and baptised as a believer at a Gospel church in my first term at university.


I said the salvation prayer sincerely many times, and was sure I was saved, but until I came to repentance, I was deceiving myself.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

But, you see, Adrian Rogers was teaching repentance and a meaningful prayer of faith.  Yet you deny that message by him. 

[Covenanter]

His way of salvation is on line: www.lfg.org discover Jesus.
I'm sure sinners have been saved that way, but I'm equally sure many are not saved who have used the prayer - including me.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

lfg.org?  Dead page.

[HappyChristian]

http://www.lwf.org/site/PageServer?pagename=discover_jesus

[Standing Firm In Christ]

I am sure you meant lwf.org.  Here is what Adrian Rogers said concerning how to get saved...
 

Q: How do you give your life to Jesus?

A: Do you have the assurance that if you were to die right now, you would go straight to heaven? If not, please let me tell you how you can be saved:

Admit Your Sin: First, you must understand that you are a sinner. The Bible says, "All have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God" (Romans 3:23).

Abandon Self-Effort: You cannot save yourself by your efforts. The Bible is very clear that it's "not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us" (Titus 3:5). Again, "By grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God; not of works, lest any man should boast" (Ephesians 2:8-9).

Acknowledge Christ's Payment: You must believe that Jesus Christ, the Son of God, died for your sins. The Bible says, "God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us" (Romans 5:8). That means He died in your place. Your sin debt has been paid by the blood of Jesus Christ, which "cleanseth us from all sin" (1 John 1:7).

Accept Him as Savior: You must put your faith in Jesus Christ, and Him alone for your salvation. The blood of Christ does you no good until you receive Him by faith. The Bible says, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved" (Acts 16:31).

Have you ever taken this all-important step of faith? If not, I urge you to do it right now. Why? Because Jesus is the only way to heaven! Speaking of Jesus, Peter said in Acts 4:12, "Neither is there salvation in any other; for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved." Jesus Himself said, "I am the way, the truth and the life; no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me" (John 14:6). It couldn't be any clearer than that.

Are you willing to offer the following prayer to God today? "Oh God, I'm a sinner. I'm lost, and I need to be saved. I know I can't save myself, so right now, once and for all, I trust You to save me. Come into my heart, forgive my sin, and make me your child. I give You my life. I will live for You as You give me strength."

If you will make this your heartfelt prayer, God will hear and save you! Jesus has promised that He will not turn away anyone who comes to Him in faith (John 6:37). He will make you a child of God, if you will turn to Him (John 1:12). Will you trust Him today?

Absolutely nothing wrong with that answer, Covenanter.  Adrian is showing them that they need to acknowledge the fact that they are sinners, that they cannot inherite eternal life without faith in Christ   And that they have to pray a prayer... making it their "heartfelt" prayer.  In other words, they have got to be sincere and mean what they are praying.  If they are and do, then they are assured of Salvation.

[Covenanter]

lfg.org?  Dead page.

sorry www.lwf.org Love Worth Finding.
Auto-correct fouled it

[Covenanter]

The website gives a much more detailed way of salvation than the sermon, but it is still a formula - I used every Gospel service without being saved. It doesn't consider Jesus' parable of the Sower.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

actually, if one considers the meaning of the seed sown in the parable, it does consider the parable. 

Mr Rogers said the prayer must be sincere and heartfelt.  In the parable, it is clear that the only seed that takes root and flourishes is that which is received in sincerity and is heartfelt.

[Covenanter]

actually, if one considers the meaning of the seed sown in the parable, it does consider the parable. 
Mr Rogers said the prayer must be sincere and heartfelt.  In the parable, it is clear that the only seed that takes root and flourishes is that which is received in sincerity and is heartfelt.

Of course, and no doubt countless sinners have come to salvation under such preaching - because they have come as sinners convinced of their lost state. The Holy Spirit completes his saving work so the born-again Christian begins his new life.

Repeat the prayer without heart sincerity and you are more lost than before - you are given a false assurance.
.

[Standing Firm In Christ]

And Adrian Rogers told the people the importance of sincerity.

[John81]

What does sincerity mean? Ask the average person walking down the street and it's clear many don't know.

 

If a person truly understands what it means to be sincere, then they will prOBably grasp the meaning of believing with a sincere heart. Yet for those rather illiterate millions who do not...well, therein is danger for them.

 

Previous generations were much more literate than we currently see in America today.

 

Overall, I've found Adrian Rogers ministry to be a great blessing so my comments here have nothing to do with him.

 

Millions in America today are very uneducated regardless of what diploma or degree they may have. Just as I've had high school seniors and a college students, when I asked if they knew who Hitler was, guessed that he had been an American president! At least one of them got a little closer when they added, "wasn't Hitler president of America during WWII". In the same way, so many have no real concept of sin, heaven, hell, repentance, what Christians mean by "heart" or "born again", or understand the definition of sincere and many other words we often use.

 

This all makes the presentation of the Gospel to uneducated Americans, who nevertheless think they know a lot, and often even consider themselves to be a Christian, that much more difficult.

 

This is part of the reason we have so many churches filled with lost people, so many more walking around thinking they are going to heaven because they have said a "sinners prayer" or been baptized, and so many others who simply don't care due to their own ignorance.

 

I'm just guessing now, but most here on OB prOBably present the Gospel better than the average "soul winner" and almost certainly better than the average watered down Christian.

 

I know many here on OB are far more biblically literate than the average Christian in America. Yet even here, in our tiny sampling of Christians, there are a few who put forth unbiblical and dangerous doctrines.

 

We have to be so careful when we witness so we know those we are speaking with really understand what we are saying and really grasp the true meaning of the Gospel.

[prophet1]

What does sincerity mean? Ask the average person walking down the street and it's clear many don't know.

If a person truly understands what it means to be sincere, then they will prOBably grasp the meaning of believing with a sincere heart. Yet for those rather illiterate millions who do not...well, therein is danger for them.

Previous generations were much more literate than we currently see in America today.

Overall, I've found Adrian Rogers ministry to be a great blessing so my comments here have nothing to do with him.

Millions in America today are very uneducated regardless of what diploma or degree they may have. Just as I've had high school seniors and a college students, when I asked if they knew who Hitler was, guessed that he had been an American president! At least one of them got a little closer when they added, "wasn't Hitler president of America during WWII". In the same way, so many have no real concept of sin, heaven, hell, repentance, what Christians mean by "heart" or "born again", or understand the definition of sincere and many other words we often use.

This all makes the presentation of the Gospel to uneducated Americans, who nevertheless think they know a lot, and often even consider themselves to be a Christian, that much more difficult.

This is part of the reason we have so many churches filled with lost people, so many more walking around thinking they are going to heaven because they have said a "sinners prayer" or been baptized, and so many others who simply don't care due to their own ignorance.

I'm just guessing now, but most here on OB prOBably present the Gospel better than the average "soul winner" and almost certainly better than the average watered down Christian.

I know many here on OB are far more biblically literate than the average Christian in America. Yet even here, in our tiny sampling of Christians, there are a few who put forth unbiblical and dangerous doctrines.

We have to be so careful when we witness so we know those we are speaking with really understand what we are saying and really grasp the true meaning of the Gospel.

The Spirit enlightens them, as the hear the Word, and believe.

Those who hear, believe.
Those who don't, may later on.
We need to present the Word, and watch the light come on.

It usually helps to ask the person what they believe, first, and then offer to show them where God's Word differs with them.

We are to be a medium, a channel, for God to speak to those who have not the Spirit.

We have the answers, and the Teacher, and they need Him, and so, us.

Jn 16:7-11
7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away:for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;
11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

All of this takes place through those to whom the Spirit is sent...

"I will send him unto you. And when he is come,..."

[GraceSaved]

I was just listening to a sermon last night and the preacher said something to the effect that God uses even the smallest amount of information we tell someone about Christ.  That was comforting to me because when I witness, sometimes I walk away thinking "I should have said this or that."  Then I realize God gave me the exact words that person needed to hear at that time and it's the Holy Spirit that works in their heart, not any fancy teaching or words I could have said.  I'm not sure what "easy believeism" is.  Only heard of it on here.  If a person believes...it is easy.  Sometimes we make it harder than it has to be.