Episcopal Church: Christian?

[John81]

Episcopal Church: Christian?
Posted on Tuesday, January 18, 2011 at 02:28PM

Based on everything I am currently reading and what I experienced firsthand in that Church in the past, my answer to this question is a forceful, “No!” Perhaps the last nail in the coffin of that once-vibrant Christian church came as no surprise to many of us when M. Thomas Shaw, bishop of the Episcopal Diocese of Massachusetts, kicked off the new year of 2011 by performing a lesbian marriage ceremony at St. Paul’s cathedral in Boston. Two “priestesses” of the church, Katherine Hancock Ragsdale (dean and president of Episcopal Divinity School, no less) and Mally Lloyd (canon to the Ordinary at St. Paul’s) were united in homosexual bliss in the presence of 400 guests. The whole debate of homosexuality has deteriorated into an emotional argument on equality with total disregard to God’s created order that marriage should be between one man and one woman.

But how can one be surprised at this defiance of church cannons when the Episcopal leadership has defied God? Once the fear of God and obedience to His Word are trampled underfoot, then any sort of church resolution is not worth the paper it’s written on.

Back in 2004, the Episcopal Church, in an act of slight-of-hand, (more likely a cunning maneuver) agreed to hold a moratorium in the practicing of all the sordid affairs of “ordaining, marrying, and uniting, and blessing” acts of sodomy. But that was merely a surface declaration. In reality, the blessing of same-sex marriage had been widely accepted in the American Episcopal Church before the time of moratorium.

Can anybody in his/her right mind believe that, the Episcopal Church is the Church of Jesus—the Jesus who left the glories of heaven, came to our broken and dark world, died on the cross to redeem us and give us power over sin, and then rose again to assure us of eternal life with Him? The answer has to be a resounding, “no.” The Episcopal Church is not Jesus’ church. The few…very few faithful ones left within this Church need to run for their lives lest they be held accountable for complacency on the Day of Judgment.

http://www.michaelyoussef.com/michaels-blogs/episcopal-church-christian.html

[Guest]

Episcopal Church: Christian?
Posted on Tuesday, January 18, 2011 at 02:28PM

Based on everything I am currently reading and what I experienced firsthand in that Church in the past, my answer to this question is a forceful, “No!” Perhaps the last nail in the coffin of that once-vibrant Christian church came as no surprise to many of us when M. Thomas Shaw, bishop of the Episcopal Diocese of Massachusetts, kicked off the new year of 2011 by performing a lesbian marriage ceremony at St. Paul’s cathedral in Boston. Two “priestesses” of the church, Katherine Hancock Ragsdale (dean and president of Episcopal Divinity School, no less) and Mally Lloyd (canon to the Ordinary at St. Paul’s) were united in homosexual bliss in the presence of 400 guests. The whole debate of homosexuality has deteriorated into an emotional argument on equality with total disregard to God’s created order that marriage should be between one man and one woman.

But how can one be surprised at this defiance of church cannons when the Episcopal leadership has defied God? Once the fear of God and obedience to His Word are trampled underfoot, then any sort of church resolution is not worth the paper it’s written on.

Back in 2004, the Episcopal Church, in an act of slight-of-hand, (more likely a cunning maneuver) agreed to hold a moratorium in the practicing of all the sordid affairs of “ordaining, marrying, and uniting, and blessing” acts of sodomy. But that was merely a surface declaration. In reality, the blessing of same-sex marriage had been widely accepted in the American Episcopal Church before the time of moratorium.

Can anybody in his/her right mind believe that, the Episcopal Church is the Church of Jesus—the Jesus who left the glories of heaven, came to our broken and dark world, died on the cross to redeem us and give us power over sin, and then rose again to assure us of eternal life with Him? The answer has to be a resounding, “no.” The Episcopal Church is not Jesus’ church. The few…very few faithful ones left within this Church need to run for their lives lest they be held accountable for complacency on the Day of Judgment.

http://www.michaelyoussef.com/michaels-blogs/episcopal-church-christian.html

The Episcopal Church welcomes you.

Episcopalians

Bruce Garner, a member of the Episcopal Church's Executive Council, told ENS that he believes the situation in Uganda "has come about because of the insistence of some faith groups on very narrow and literal interpretation of certain portions of Scripture, particularly those dealing with human sexuality, especially same-gender sexual activity."

[John81]

Comment from webmaster of Jesus-is-Savior.com...

The Episcopalian Religion is straight out of the pits of hell. They teach that performing the seven sacraments are absolutely essential to go to heaven. This is the same damnable heresy which Roman Catholicism teaches.


The Episcopal Church believes in a Sacramental Salvation

The Episcopal Church believes, like Roman Catholicism, in a “sacramental” salvation. It is taught that salvation is achieved by performing the 7 sacraments, beginning with baptism as an infant, then confirmation, Eucharist, penance, holy orders, matrimony, and unction. Unlike most other Protestant Churches which believe the elements of the common service (grapejuice or wine, and bread) are merely symbolic, the Episcopal Church believes in the real presence of Christ in these elements. (Mead’s pg. 134, 11 ed.)

Infant Baptism
The Anglican Church practices infant baptism, teaching that infants receive the Holy Spirit and are regenerated through baptism. Baptism is by pouring, sprinkling, or immersion. Baptism, as one of the Sacraments and channels of grace is necessary for salvation in the Episcopal Church. “The 39 Articles allow for teaching baptismal regeneration” Religious Bodies of America (pg. 290)

Eternal Security and Assurance of Salvation

The Episcopal Church, as Roman Catholicism, does not believe in the Eternal Security of the Believer and does not teach that one can have assurance of salvation and know he is going to heaven during this lifetime.

Women Priests - Yes
As of 1993, 17 of the 30 independent Anglican communions around the world had approved ordination of women priests. The Episcopal Church in the United States has been ordaining women priests since 1976, and ordained the first female bishop in 1989.

Speaking in Tongues?

Yes, Since 1976 the Charismatic movement has 'swept thru' the Episcopal Church. Episcopal Sources claim that 1/3 of all Episcopal priests are charismatic and speak in tongues. (Religions of America, Leo Rosten, p591) (New and Revised Edition)

Ecumenism
For the past two decades or more many Anglican leaders, including the archbishops, have been attempting to reconcile the Church of England with the RCC. The Episcopal Church is very active in all ecumenical ventures and is a member of both the National Council of Churches and The World Council of Churches.

Oppose Abortion?

No Episcopalians believe that it is the right of a woman to have an abortion.

Oppose Homosexuality?

No. During 2003 a homosexual priest was ordained as Bishop of the Episcopal Church in America. In 1993 a survey revealed that 75% of Episcopalians believed that it is possible for a sexually active homosexuals to be faithful Christians.

[John81]

Carter Heyward: False Prophet!

By David J. Stewart

"He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both are abomination to the LORD." —Proverb 17:15

She ought to be called "Carter Wayward," because she is way out in left field my friend. This woman is a false prophet, a lesbian, an Episcopalian so-called "priest" who performs same-sex marriages, she promotes feminism, teaches apostasy and is pro-death concerning abortion. Heyward has even publicly called for abortion as a "sacrament"...

"If women were in charge, abortion would be a sacrament, an occasion of deep and serious and sacred meaning." Carter Heyward

That an ordained leader of a church that supposedly represents Jesus to the world could describe child sacrifice as a sacrament or holy rite of the church without facing excommunication is a staggering illustration of the collective deception we are facing as a nation.

-----------------------------------------

Rev. Dr. Carter Heyward
Collection: Heyward, Carter

The Rev. Dr. Carter Heyward is an Episcopal priest, professor, theologian, activist, and writer. A pioneer in the areas of feminist liberation theology and the theology of sexuality. Heyward was born August 22, 1945, and raised in North Carolina. She received an undergraduate degree from Randolph-Macon Women’s College in Lynchburg, Virginia in 1967. She attended Union Theological Seminary in New York one year, but moved back to Charlotte in 1968 to work in her home parish, St. Martin’s Church, for the next year and a half as a lay assistant. In 1971, Heyward returned to New York and earned a Master of Arts in the Comparative Study of Religion from Columbia University (1971) and a Master of Divinity at Union Theological Seminary (1973). Before earning a Ph.D. in Systematic Theology from Union (1980), Heyward, was ordained a priest on July 29, 1974, along with ten other women. The ceremony violated church canon and was not officially sanctioned by the church until 1976.

In January 1975, Heyward and fellow priest Suzanne Hiatt were hired at Episcopal Divinity School in Cambridge, Massachusetts. As a professor, Heyward’s primary teaching concentrated on 19th century Anglican theology, feminist liberation theology and theology of sexuality. She transformed consciousness, proclaimed the possibilities for women to be priests, for lesbians to be theological, and made way for new approaches to connecting the divine to the erotic, justice, activism. Heyward is the author of eleven books.

(Information for this biographical statement taken from the finding aid to the Carter Heyward Papers at the Archives of Women in Theological Scholarship.)

[JerryNumbers]

John, Its amazing at what true Christians will accept as being Christian. Seems almost any building that has church printed on it, and its people call their self Christian, its accepted without question.

That makes me wonder how many like people are accepted into Jesus' true Churches believing such trash.

[John81]

John, Its amazing at what true Christians will accept as being Christian. Seems almost any building that has church printed on it, and its people call their self Christian, its accepted without question.

That makes me wonder how many like people are accepted into Jesus' true Churches believing such trash.

Yes, this is a very dangerous thing. How many hundreds of thousands in America alone are being led astray in these false churches? They are being led to believe they are okay with God yet one day they will hear Jesus tell them He never knew them.

Far too many today are caught up in the worldly liberalism which declares that all churches and denominations are fine and lead to God. Many even believe the further lie that all religions lead to God.

Scripture is so very clear that there is only ONE way to God and that's through beinig born again in Christ. Further, if one is truly born again in Christ, Scripture makes it clear they will show their love for Christ by obeying His Word.

Unfortunately, most who are caught up in these false churches are far more concerned about and loyal to their church than they are to Jesus. They harden their hearts to the truth for the sake of staying in a false church. How sad to see folks reject Christ, while professing to be Christians, so they can be a part of a false church.

[John81]

Jefferts Schori plunges Episcopal Church into Apostasy

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

By Terry - Posted on 21 July 2009

If I were asked to describe the central message of Christianity, no matter what words I used, I would speak of the death and resurrection of Jesus. If then asked to explain how this related to me, I would go on to detail personal faith in Christ as the necessary step for salvation. That is, to be right with God, you must come to faith in his Son who died for your sin.

These few statements, among others, are considered by the Christian Church to be orthodox. Whatever else we believe or practice, we all agree on these. That is why we must now conclude the Episcopal Church in America is an apostate religion.

Defining heresy

The big talking point from the recent General Convention of the Episcopal Church in the U.S. was the lifting of the moratorium on homosexual candidates for ministry, but slipping under the radar was an even bigger problem for it dealt not with a particular sinful practice, but the entire church’s doctrinal position as it relates the gospel.

At her opening address to the convention, Presiding Bishop and Primate, Katharine Jefferts Schori, in the midst of welcoming delegates, turned to what she described as ‘the great Western heresy’.

Now, any number of things spring to mind as possible candidates, but knowing this is the Episcopal Church we are talking about, I imagined it was going to have something to do with greed, poverty or global warming.

Jefferts Schori eventually got on to those items, but they were not the great heresy of the western Church. In her own words;

The overarching connection in all of these crises has to do with the great Western heresy – that we can be saved as individuals, that any of use [sic] alone can be in right relationship with God. It’s caricatured in some quarters by insisting that salvation depends on reciting a specific verbal formula about Jesus. That individualist focus is a form of idolatry, for it puts me and my words in the place that only God can occupy, at the center of existence, as the ground of all being.

The complete address can be read here.

Salvation of the individual anathema

The only thing we can be thankful for is that Jefferts Schori has made the position of the Episcopal Church clear. Its doctrinal position is that no one can be right with God as an individual and personal salvation is simply not on offer.

The consequences of taking this position are spiritually catastrophic. You simply cannot be a Christian and not believe in a personal relationship with Jesus resulting in personal salvation. This is a different gospel.

This is all quite simply the natural consequence of the ‘social welfare’ gospel pushed to its logical conclusion. The Episcopal Church is basically a spiritual version of what America has become. Both have abandoned God’s rule, rubbed out his law and established their own standard in its place.

One thing comes into clear focus as you listen to Jefferts Schori speak; Episcopal Christianity is all about relationships here on earth and looking after creation (at least they still believe in creation!)

Tolerance without obedience

Interaction between members of the body has become the primary operating principle. It is far more important than, say, obedience to God. Obedience to God is OK up to a point, but it has the recurring problem of offending people and we can’t have that.

So when someone walks into Church and says, ‘I am gay. Can I be a Bishop please?’, we don’t ask God for a ruling, we make a collective decision based on what makes everyone feel happy. After all, God wants us to be happy and so we do that at all cost.

And when we discover lots of people are not happy about these decisions, we tell them to get over it. Woe betide anybody who pulls out the Bible and starts quoting it. What good is the Bible in a situation like this? The Bible is simply the record of religious history and because we are the modern thinkers, we may safely disregard the thoughts of previous generations when they conflict with ours.

With an operating principle like this, the Episcopal Church manages to keep in step with the world. It picks up the climate change debate and gears the Church towards the solution. ‘We are here to look after creation' it will cry. It listens to the sexual debate and offers ‘blessing’ to everyone no matter how debauched their behaviour. 'We are here to love one another' will be the refrain. And so it goes on.

But it cannot listen to correction. When it hears Christians denouncing unorthodox doctrine they are simply marginalised as fundamentalists who refuse to keep up to date. When it reads Jesus saying, ‘Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me’ (John 14:21), the application is taken only in reference to treatment of other human beings, not in relation to God himself whose primary concern is the sin problem.

In fact, one wonders if the Episcopal Church really believes in personal sin at all. Why would you need to if there is no personal faith and no personal salvation? It is becoming difficult to define exactly what the Episcopal Church stands for.

The awful reality of God’s judgement

It’s a great tragedy when someone you love is on a path of self-destruction. It is devastating when you try to offer help but they refuse to take your advice and continue with their life of destruction. The solution seems obvious, but the person steadfastly refuses to change.

I have a friend whose mother once had surgery for a smoking related illness. She had smoked herself almost to death despite the pleadings of her family to quit the habit. She had the surgery and lit up a smoke the day she left the hospital. In the end the family could only shrug their shoulders in the knowledge they had tried, but ultimately could do nothing to prevent the inevitable. It was a sad funeral.

I feel we are at this point with the Episcopal Church. No one can say the issues have not been clearly set out nor the debates cut short. It is obvious what this Church stands for and we have no option now than to allow it to walk the path it is determined to walk. It is obvious, however, just how broad this path is.

If I understand the thrust of Romans 1 properly, I think God is in the business of allowing people to feel the full weight of their own sin at times, especially when they steadfastly refuse to repent.

Entire article: http://www.christianfaith.com.au/resources/jefferts-schori-plunges-episcopal-church-into-apostasy

[no name joe]

I have a couple of points to respond to this:

1. There are many Christians in the Episcopal church. I know many of them. I have talked with them about their faith. I know that they are deeply committed to Christ. I also know there are many Christian priests in the Episcopal church. Again, I have talked to them and know them. Having said that, there are those in the church including some priests and some bishops that have begun to preach heresy. There is an internal divide and struggle within the church. Homosexuality is only a symptom of a deeper problem. There are many who have denied the deity of Christ, etc.

2. Twenty years ago, the Episcopal church was in a fairly strong position docrinaly. Over the past two decades is when much of the problem has come in..

3. For those who have grown to love the Christian tradition of worship in the Episcopal church, and for many congregations of evangelical Epsicopals, this presented a great problem. They could not stand to see their church depart from the Gospel. SHould they work within the church to reform it, or should they just leave? This is similar to the problem faced by the Puritans and Sepratists of the Church of England in the pre-Revolutionary time. The Puritians saw much good in the church, and wanted to purify the bad things that have crept in. The Separatists wanted to break away entirely. There is no wrong or right answer really.

4. Many of the theologically conservate Episcopal church congregations have faced much hardship as the theological divide grew. Many were ejected from buildings build by their own money. Others walked away, but didn't know where to go, because they still considdered themselves Episcopal.

5. Enter the Anglican Mission in America. Asian and African Anglican Bishops have seen the spiritual decline and danger of many of the Episcopal bishops and leaders. A bishop from Rwanda stated, "The West let my country commit physical genocide and stood by and did nothing to intervene, I cannot stand by and permit the West to commit spiritual genocide." So he planted an Anglican Mission in America. The first congregation were people in a church who took a stand against the Episcopal church and wanted to start a new evangelical Episcopal congregation. Their bishop would not allow it. The pastor of the chruch risked his credentials and ordination for minisry to lead the chruch. By a miracle of God, he was transfered under the authority of the African bishop, and Africa sent him as a missionary to the US. He will keep them under his authority until the Episcopal biships repent of their heresy. He is working to reform the church. He has accepted many other congregations under his authority as they ahve decided to leave their buildings, etc. There is a great movement to reform the church, but it is and will be a battle. This is the church that I currently attend.

6. Why don't they just separate? Well, the Episcopal church is responsible for the spiritual health of millions of Americans. If we walked away, are we not abandoning our responsibility? Many people want to see the Christian tradition preserved and passed down from generation to generation. So they are fighting for it. There is a great divide right now, and a great struggle.

7. This issue is not about whether to ordain homosexuals, as the news media reports. That is merely a symptom of the core problem.

So, for those, like myself, in the Anglican tradition of Christian faith have to decide whether to fight or whether to sit by, leave the Anglican tradition and go to another tradition such as Baptist, Presbyterian, Methodists, etc. If we give up and walk away from the fight, many of us feel as though we are abandoning our responsibility. THe African Bishop, whom I have met, feels a great responsibility over the congregations under his leadership. So much so that he has sacrificed an extraordinary amount of funding that he used to receive from the Episcopal church that was used to fund orphanages, to feed starving people, etc. He and his area have suffered for the sake of the gospel. Why did he do this? Why did he take these rebel Episcopal churches under his leadership? Because he perceived a great spiritual danger in the Western Church. He felt like the leaders had retreated from the gospel message, and that they needed to repent and return to the gospel message. So he took a risk, and has suffered. However, as a result, there are now 50 congregations in the US under his responsiblity, and these churches are thriving and growing. God is using this work in a mighty way to draw people to himself.

It is easy to cast stones from the outside and categorically say a group is not "Christian." However, what you do not see is the great struggle and fight, and the persecution for the sake of the Gospel message going on within the Epsicopal church of many committed Christians struggling against some of the leaders in order to save their arm of the Christian tradition and for it ti return to the life giving roots of the gospel.

[trc123]

I have a couple of points to respond to this:

1. There are many Christians in the Episcopal church. I know many of them. I have talked with them about their faith. I know that they are deeply committed to Christ. I also know there are many Christian priests in the Episcopal church. Again, I have talked to them and know them. Having said that, there are those in the church including some priests and some bishops that have begun to preach heresy. There is an internal divide and struggle within the church. Homosexuality is only a symptom of a deeper problem. There are many who have denied the deity of Christ, etc.

2. Twenty years ago, the Episcopal church was in a fairly strong position docrinaly. Over the past two decades is when much of the problem has come in..

3. For those who have grown to love the Christian tradition of worship in the Episcopal church, and for many congregations of evangelical Epsicopals, this presented a great problem. They could not stand to see their church depart from the Gospel. SHould they work within the church to reform it, or should they just leave? This is similar to the problem faced by the Puritans and Sepratists of the Church of England in the pre-Revolutionary time. The Puritians saw much good in the church, and wanted to purify the bad things that have crept in. The Separatists wanted to break away entirely. There is no wrong or right answer really.

4. Many of the theologically conservate Episcopal church congregations have faced much hardship as the theological divide grew. Many were ejected from buildings build by their own money. Others walked away, but didn't know where to go, because they still considdered themselves Episcopal.

5. Enter the Anglican Mission in America. Asian and African Anglican Bishops have seen the spiritual decline and danger of many of the Episcopal bishops and leaders. A bishop from Rwanda stated, "The West let my country commit physical genocide and stood by and did nothing to intervene, I cannot stand by and permit the West to commit spiritual genocide." So he planted an Anglican Mission in America. The first congregation were people in a church who took a stand against the Episcopal church and wanted to start a new evangelical Episcopal congregation. Their bishop would not allow it. The pastor of the chruch risked his credentials and ordination for minisry to lead the chruch. By a miracle of God, he was transfered under the authority of the African bishop, and Africa sent him as a missionary to the US. He will keep them under his authority until the Episcopal biships repent of their heresy. He is working to reform the church. He has accepted many other congregations under his authority as they ahve decided to leave their buildings, etc. There is a great movement to reform the church, but it is and will be a battle. This is the church that I currently attend.

6. Why don't they just separate? Well, the Episcopal church is responsible for the spiritual health of millions of Americans. If we walked away, are we not abandoning our responsibility? Many people want to see the Christian tradition preserved and passed down from generation to generation. So they are fighting for it. There is a great divide right now, and a great struggle.

7. This issue is not about whether to ordain homosexuals, as the news media reports. That is merely a symptom of the core problem.

So, for those, like myself, in the Anglican tradition of Christian faith have to decide whether to fight or whether to sit by, leave the Anglican tradition and go to another tradition such as Baptist, Presbyterian, Methodists, etc. If we give up and walk away from the fight, many of us feel as though we are abandoning our responsibility. THe African Bishop, whom I have met, feels a great responsibility over the congregations under his leadership. So much so that he has sacrificed an extraordinary amount of funding that he used to receive from the Episcopal church that was used to fund orphanages, to feed starving people, etc. He and his area have suffered for the sake of the gospel. Why did he do this? Why did he take these rebel Episcopal churches under his leadership? Because he perceived a great spiritual danger in the Western Church. He felt like the leaders had retreated from the gospel message, and that they needed to repent and return to the gospel message. So he took a risk, and has suffered. However, as a result, there are now 50 congregations in the US under his responsiblity, and these churches are thriving and growing. God is using this work in a mighty way to draw people to himself.

It is easy to cast stones from the outside and categorically say a group is not "Christian." However, what you do not see is the great struggle and fight, and the persecution for the sake of the Gospel message going on within the Epsicopal church of many committed Christians struggling against some of the leaders in order to save their arm of the Christian tradition and for it ti return to the life giving roots of the gospel.

I do see and understand your dilemma and heartache concerning this matter. Whether to stay in order to preach the Gospel to see others saved or to walk away is not a decision to be taken lightly. It is a serious matter. I would encourage you to pray and seek the counsel of God through his Word. Also, if staying is diminishing your own walk with the Lord, then it may be time to leave. If you are one of those rare people that can stay, fight, not be weakened or not have your testimony diminished, then staying and fighting may be in order. I personally couldn't stay in the RCC after I got saved as it "vexed my righteous soul" each and every time I participated in their services and traditions (as most of them are not based upon Scripture and are outright born of heresy and compromise).

God Bless you as you pray and determine God's will for you in this area. Edited February 8, 2011 by trc123

[no name joe]

I do see and understand your dilemma and heartache concerning this matter. Whether to stay in order to preach the Gospel to see others saved or to walk away is not a decision to be taken lightly. It is a serious matter. I would encourage you to pray and seek the counsel of God through his Word. Also, if staying is diminishing your own walk with the Lord, then it may be time to leave. If you are one of those rare people that can stay, fight, not be weakened or not have your testimony diminished, then staying and fighting may be in order. I personally couldn't stay in the RCC after I got saved as it "vexed my righteous soul" each and every time I participated in their services and traditions (as most of them are not based upon Scripture and are outright born of heresy and compromise).

God Bless you as you pray and determine God's will for you in this area.

Oh, God has absolutly called me to be a part of this chruch. It is growing, thriving, and has really encouraged me beyond belief to grow spiritually. Our local congregation, and network of church is amazingly strong spiritually. The Holy Spirit is really moving, growing churches, and sending people out into the mission field.

I wrote what I did to explain the dillema of many people. If I were in a congregation under the authority of a bishop who supported false doctrine, that would be a much more difficult decision. My local congregation used to be in that position, and they walked away and started this church under the authority of the African bishop.

[John81]

Actually, if one truly loves Christ they will obey His Word and His Word is clear that in such situations as there is with the Episcopal church, the answer is separation.

According to Scripture, putting ones loyalty to a church institution above obeying the Word of God, is denying God as Supreme and placing that church above Christ.

I have yet to see a single person who has been biblically born again in Christ remain in any of the apostate or false churches.

It should be obvious to all the Episcopal church is no longer a biblical, Christ-honouring or Christ-serving church. Such was evident many years ago, even decades. There is absolutely no biblical authority for anyone claiming to be a follower of Christ to be a part of the Episcopal church.

[John81]

"...in doctrine shewing uncorruptness, gravity, sincerity" Titus 2:7

One cannot be a part of the Episcopal church, or the RCC or several other "churches" and keep Titus 2:7. In the breaking of Titus 2:7, many other commands of Scripture are also broken. There is no biblical justification for anyone calling themselves a follower of Christ to remain in doctrinally corrupt, apostate churches. Scripture is clear that if we commit such rebellion we should examine ourselves to see if we are truly in the faith or not. There is no broad way to salvation, obeying God, or being in right standing with the the Lord. Jesus says the proof of our love for Him is shown by our obedience to Him, by keeping His Word.

[JerryNumbers]

Actually, if one truly loves Christ they will obey His Word and His Word is clear that in such situations as there is with the Episcopal church, the answer is separation.

According to Scripture, putting ones loyalty to a church institution above obeying the Word of God, is denying God as Supreme and placing that church above Christ.

I have yet to see a single person who has been biblically born again in Christ remain in any of the apostate or false churches.

It should be obvious to all the Episcopal church is no longer a biblical, Christ-honouring or Christ-serving church. Such was evident many years ago, even decades. There is absolutely no biblical authority for anyone claiming to be a follower of Christ to be a part of the Episcopal church.

The Episcopal church never held to the truth, and for anyone in that church that is a Christian, the Bible clearly say what they are to do, "Come out from among them."

2Co 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,

I've noticed, few there be that are in such church that will mind God and come out from among them. They can come up with all kinds of excuse, even claiming God want's them there, when that contradicts the Bible.

[Salyan]

Actually, abortion as a sacrament makes perfect (terrible) sense. Hasn't child sacrifice been a part of false religions for millenia?

kindofblue, to explain my comment a bit, I have a problem with the term 'sacrament' when applied to the ordinances of God - even ordinances that I would accept as proper in the Baptistic/Biblical tradition (such as baptism and the Lord's Supper). The term sacrament implies that there is some grace being obtained through the exercise of this action. Didn't the offerers of human sacrifice do it to obtain grace or excuse the wrath of their gods? There is an uncanny significance to Heyward's statement.

Edited February 15, 2011 by salyan

[John81]

Actually, abortion as a sacrament makes perfect (terrible) sense. Hasn't child sacrifice been a part of false religions for millenia?

That's true.