Demons Or Devils?

[Jerry]

Not trying to rehash another debate here, but in another thread we were discussing devils - and I know in light of modern versions, many call fallen angels demons. The KJV uses devils, evil spirits, and possibly other terms (it has been soooo long since I studied this out). Is the Greek word for demon used anywhere in the Textus Receptus? The underlying word for Devil/Devil is diabolos (slanderer, accuser - which is what the fallen angels are to us, especially their leader, the Devil - Satan means adversary).

I want to be Biblical in my language and I have found that here and there I also refer to demons in regards to Bible passages - but I want to clarify if that is unbliblical (in light of the KJV and the Textus Receptus - I do not care how other manuscripts or Bible versions use this term). As I type this, I remember years ago reading some critiques of modern versions that their use of the term demons is bad because a demon is basically a demi-God (half man, half demon or god).

Webster's 1828 Dictionary has this definition:

DEMON, n. A spirit, or immaterial being, holding a middle place between men and the celestial deities of the Pagans. The ancients believed that there were good and evil demons, which had influence over the minds of men, and that these beings carried on an intercourse between men and gods, conveying the addresses of men to the gods, and divine benefits to men. Hence demons became the objects of worship. It was supposed also that human spirits, after their departure from the body, became demons, and that the souls of virtuous men, if highly purified, were exalted from demons into gods. The demons of the New Testament were supposed to be spiritual beings which vexed and tormented men. And in general , the word, in modern use, signifies an evil spirit or genius, which influences the conduct or directs the fortunes of mankind.

Based on this and his definition for devils, it is obvious he believes the word demons should be used in the NT and not devils (but that is his opinion, and not relevant here).

[Jerry]

Maybe I shouldn't start a thread until I do more research as I often seem to find answers I am searching and typing things out (though sometimes at first I can't seem to find the right words or terms for a search, hence the start of a thread).

There are five passages that use the underlying Greek word daimon (g1142): Matthew 8:31; Mark 5:12l Luke 8:29; Revelation 16:14 and 18:2 - all translated as "devils" and once as "the devil."

Another related word is g1139 (daimonizomai), translated 13 times as "possessed with devils" (or the devil), "vexed with a devil", or some form of these, and John 10:21 has "hath a devil."

It is interesting to note that even though the underlying word in 18 cases is a form of the word daimon/daimonizomai), nowhere in the King James Bible is it translated as demon or demon possessed, implying perhaps 400 years ago these words had a different meaning in English than the NT Greek uses.

[BrotherTony]

Jerry, I see nothing wrong with you starting a study on this subject. You are correct, it IS a very interesting subject and one that Christians need to be aware of. I think we can all afford to learn together here.   Continue on, Brother! 

[SureWord]

It's a nice study as long as you believe what the Bible says.

If it's a debate of what the dead Greek says, a language nobody in here can understand or read (modern Greeks can't even read Koine Greek) then it's a waste of time.

If Jesus meant "false accuser" when he called Judas a "devil" then I'm sure the translators would of translated it that way. 

Jerry, if I'm harsh sometimes in my language remember "Iron sharpeneth Iron". I know you can take it.

[Jerry]

Sureword, why are you bringing in an argument from another thread that was locked (P.S. you never answered my questions in that thread either, just stated I am wrong)? That is not the purpose of this thread - and it truly was created to clarify KJV Biblical usage of that word today (ie. in our speaking about Bible passages today - Is it unbiblical to speak of Jesus and the apostles casting out demons, or should we be saying casting out devils).

I am learning Koine Greek - mostly vocabulary at this point - though I do want to learn all about the verb tenses, etc. Therefore it is not an impossibly language for people to learn today.

I have never corrected the King James Bible, never intend to (and those who have known me on these boards for approximately 22 years or so - cannot remember exactly when the first Online Baptist site started with Matt and Ben - can certainly testify to that), and I have never gone to the underlying Hebrew or Greek (or any tools based on them) to correct the English of my King James Bible.

It is one thing to differ with another person on these boards over a word definition and that word's usage throughout the Bible (which is your issue here - though you have not shown me where I was wrong and how your definition/usage of that word fits that passage and answers my questions**), and quite another thing to correct the English of my Bible - which I have never done.

**And no, do not debate that here (that is not the purpose of this thread). I am just stating the issue is not resolved - you just disagree with my understanding of that verse, and you have not convinced me otherwise.