Saddleback Church kicked out of the Southern Baptist Convention

[TheGloryLand]

20 hours ago, Dr. Robert S. Morley said:

I have never cared about any church position ahead of a biblical one.

You could have been a mega church preacher, if you wanted too. You are a professional theologian. 

Edited April 24, 2023 by TheGloryLand

[TheGloryLand]

I meant, to have all of this knowledge, and education, and never becoming a pastor.

[Dr. Robert S. Morley]

18 hours ago, TheGloryLand said:

What made this Independent Baptist forum, interest to you, you being none denomination. Thank you, for answering my direct questions. This will help me and others. You’re probably not kJ only, but that don’t bother me. I don’t know if to much training have affected you. Dr.

about the Dr.

Funnily enough, when I became a Christian, I soon became part of a KJV only house church, and grew to love the translation. I still do, though I believe it has its problems. My son, who is now an adult, is devoted to his KJV an aunt gave him as a baby.

I can't quite remember what I searched for on the internet that led me to the forum. I am simply a Bible believing Christian with a teaching ministry who enjoys sharing his faith with others.

As Paul taught, "Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do" (1 Thess. 5:11).

[TheGloryLand]

18 minutes ago, Dr. Robert S. Morley said:

about the Dr.

Funnily enough, when I became a Christian, I soon became part of a KJV only house church, and grew to love the translation. I still do, though I believe it has its problems. My son, who is now an adult, is devoted to his KJV an aunt gave him as a baby.

I can't quite remember what I searched for on the internet that led me to the forum. I am simply a Bible believing Christian with a teaching ministry who enjoys sharing his faith with others.

As Paul taught, "Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do" (1 Thess. 5:11).

I also found you on LinkedIn and seen your profile, school and job histories. I’m not following you, but you know today anybody, can call them self, a Dr. or Preacher, on line. I’m just a retired family man, that came to Christ in 1987. After I heard the gospel. I have no Christian college background. Your approach to this website, did look kind of weird to me.

[Dr. Robert S. Morley]

4 hours ago, TheGloryLand said:

I meant, to have all of this knowledge, and education, and never becoming a pastor.

I was called into missionary service early on and developed my pastoral care and teaching ministry in that environment. I received a deeper love for the Bible and all its truths after attending a three month (full-time) intensive inductive Bible study training course, which I was privileged continue with as a staff member, teaching on it, and eventually leading it. In terms of my faith, except for coming to Christ,  and living by faith, it is the best thing that happened to me and one that I'm most thankful for.

I may still pastor one day, but the ministry I'm involved in gives me freedom to share God's word with anyone. 

[Dr. Robert S. Morley]

54 minutes ago, TheGloryLand said:

I also found you on LinkedIn and seen your profile, school and job histories. I’m not following you, but you know today anybody, can call them self, a Dr. or Preacher, on line. I’m just a retired family man, that came to Christ in 1987. After I heard the gospel. I have no Christian college background. Your approach to this website, did look kind of weird to me.

Wow! No way! 1987 is when I came to Christ at the age of 20.

I don't blame you for investigating. Maybe you'll have noticed that, outside of the training I received as a missionary, I began my theological Studies quite recently. The doctorate was for my book, Dismantling Dispensationalism, a work I had already completed before my masters degree.

I did "formal" studies, in part, to open doors to some who would more readily listen if they saw credentials. And, while I was blessed to have done these studies, I certainly don't think it's a requirement as there are many ways to "[s]tudy to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth" (2 Tim. 2:15). That said, I highly recommend the inductive Bible study method. 

Edited April 24, 2023 by Dr. Robert S. Morley
Added italics

[Dr. Robert S. Morley]

6 hours ago, TheGloryLand said:

You could have been a mega church preacher, if you wanted too. You are a professional theologian. 

[TheGloryLand]

On 4/22/2023 at 12:00 PM, Dr. Robert S. Morley said:

Saddleback and others have taken a biblical stand. Having considered all the texts, they have concluded that none forbid a female as a pastor in all its functions, including teaching. Patriarchy that began in Genesis 3 has pervaded the church, twisting the interpretation of texts, and greatly diminishing its potential.

 

Do you follow Rick Warren, and agree with his teachings and his church. I don’t follow Rick Warren, or any Mega Churches, over one thousand members. They all start well, but down the road, the love of money takes control. Some of these rich preachers, need to repent and remember where they came from. Jesus came as a humble man. Poor, for he gave all his away. Pastors, do not have to be poor, but the more they receive, the more they should also give. Living a normal life.
Hey Jesus, I love your new jet. You deserve it?

[Dr. Robert S. Morley]

57 minutes ago, TheGloryLand said:

Do you follow Rick Warren, and agree with his teachings and his church. I don’t follow Rick Warren, or any Mega Churches, over one thousand members. They all start well, but down the road, the love of money takes control. Some of these rich preachers, need to repent and remember where they came from. Jesus came as a humble man. Poor, for he gave all his away. Pastors, do not have to be poor, but the more they receive, the more they should also give. Living a normal life.
Hey Jesus, I love your new jet. You deserve it?

I agree that money, fame, and status can be a problem for many.

Yes, we enjoy occasionally listening to Rick Warren's messages. I like him a lot. Personally, I haven't found any serious problem yet. That said, I'm sure there are many who have issues, one or two of which I may agree with.

Do you read any of the Proverbs of Solomon? He certainly went off the rails.

"And Solomon did evil in the sight of the LORD, and went not fully after the LORD, as did David his father. Then did Solomon build an high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that is before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon. And likewise did he for all his strange wives, which burnt incense and sacrificed unto their gods" (1 Kings 11:6-8).

We must definitely be wary of any who have strayed, but test even what those who credible say, like the Berean Jews who "received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true" (Acts 17:11).

Btw, I'm not sure Jesus was necessarily poor. You'll recall that, as a child, God provided gold through the wise men. Not sure how much or how long it lasted. It might have supported the family when fleeing to Egypt, or kept for His adulthood. He grew up as the son of a carpenter, becoming one too. During His ministry, there was a time certain women supported Him and His disciples (Luke 8:3). Also, He had a valuable seamless garment that the soldiers at the cross gambled for. It was possibly a gift.

Jesus never lived for money, saying on one occasion, "Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head" (Luke 9:58). God provided in various ways, often miraculously.

I think Jesus lived like Paul, who said of himself, "I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound" (Php. 412).

[Dr. Robert S. Morley]

In case I'm misunderstood, despite Solomon's wayward behavior, I read the Proverbs of Solomon and Ecclesiastes. I believe the entire Bible to be God-breathed and inerrant in its original texts.

Edited April 24, 2023 by Dr. Robert S. Morley

[TheGloryLand]

3 hours ago, Dr. Robert S. Morley said:

I agree that money, fame, and status can be a problem for many.

Yes, we enjoy occasionally listening to Rick Warren's messages. I like him a lot. Personally, I haven't found any serious problem yet. That said, I'm sure there are many who have issues, one or two of which I may agree with.

Do you read any of the Proverbs of Solomon? He certainly went off the rails.

"And Solomon did evil in the sight of the LORD, and went not fully after the LORD, as did David his father. Then did Solomon build an high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that is before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon. And likewise did he for all his strange wives, which burnt incense and sacrificed unto their gods" (1 Kings 11:6-8).

We must definitely be wary of any who have strayed, but test even what those who credible say, like the Berean Jews who "received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true" (Acts 17:11).

Btw, I'm not sure Jesus was necessarily poor. You'll recall that, as a child, God provided gold through the wise men. Not sure how much or how long it lasted. It might have supported the family when fleeing to Egypt, or kept for His adulthood. He grew up as the son of a carpenter, becoming one too. During His ministry, there was a time certain women supported Him and His disciples (Luke 8:3). Also, He had a valuable seamless garment that the soldiers at the cross gambled for. It was possibly a gift.

Jesus never lived for money, saying on one occasion, "Foxes have holes, and birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head" (Luke 9:58). God provided in various ways, often miraculously.

I think Jesus lived like Paul, who said of himself, "I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound" (Php. 412).

Rick Warren Net Worth: Rick Warren is an American author and evangelical Christian pastor who has a net worth of $25 million dollars.
 

 

I’m sorry, but your buddies are not my buddies. if you like talking and listening to multi millionaires teachers, and preachers, I think you’re not gonna find this here on this forum. Many independent fundamental Baptist preachers, don’t fall into the trap of living the riches here on earth. Most of the pastor here, Posting don’t have Mega memberships . Some are full time ministers preachers, teachers daddies, making a humble living, and serving. The way it is supposed to be. You probably like Joel, Osteen and Joyce Myers, they are multimillionaires too. Someday you may have to make the choice, who will I listen to. Am I, on the right side of the Lords Army.

[BrotherTony]

3 hours ago, TheGloryLand said:

Rick Warren Net Worth: Rick Warren is an American author and evangelical Christian pastor who has a net worth of $25 million dollars.

 

 

I’m sorry, but your buddies are not my buddies. if you like talking and listening to multi millionaires teachers, and preachers, I think you’re not gonna find this here on this forum. Many independent fundamental Baptist preachers, don’t fall into the trap of living the riches here on earth. Most of the pastor here, Posting don’t have Mega memberships . Some are full time ministers preachers, teachers daddies, making a humble living, and serving. The way it is supposed to be. You probably like Joel, Osteen and Joyce Myers, they are multimillionaires too. Someday you may have to make the choice, who will I listen to. Am I, on the right side of the Lords Army.

I'm sorry to tell you this TGL...there is nothing wrong with a preacher/pastor having money. If they're tithing, giving money to the poor and programs in the church, then what they earn and can use to invest and help to increase their own wealth isn't necessarily anti-scriptural. I see you harping on mega-churches all the time, and again, there is nothing wrong with being in a megachurch, nor being a pastor of a megachurch. You act like those who are pastors of megachurches or who have saved and increased their wealth while serving the Lord aren't "humble." This, my friend, isn't necessarily the case. I know that @Jim_Alaska believes we shouldn't listen to anyone but our pastor...that's his opinion, and he's definitely welcome to it. He's not necessarily wrong, and that's his conviction. But, there are others here who believe that yes, they should listen to their pastor's preaching and teaching, but who also glean from other pastors. I don't see anything anti-scriptural or incorrect about this, either. It's a matter of personal preference and one's ability to keep a Godly perspective in their life while gleaning from these people. From your post you make it seem that anyone who is involved with/attends a megachurch is on the wrong side of the "Lord's Army." Sorry...but, that's just plain wrong, and again, YOUR opinion. 

Peace to you.

BT

[Dr. Robert S. Morley]

4 hours ago, TheGloryLand said:

Rick Warren Net Worth: Rick Warren is an American author and evangelical Christian pastor who has a net worth of $25 million dollars.
 

 

I’m sorry, but your buddies are not my buddies. if you like talking and listening to multi millionaires teachers, and preachers, I think you’re not gonna find this here on this forum. Many independent fundamental Baptist preachers, don’t fall into the trap of living the riches here on earth. Most of the pastor here, Posting don’t have Mega memberships . Some are full time ministers preachers, teachers daddies, making a humble living, and serving. The way it is supposed to be. You probably like Joel, Osteen and Joyce Myers, they are multimillionaires too. Someday you may have to make the choice, who will I listen to. Am I, on the right side of the Lords Army.

I don't follow, like, or agree with all mega church preachers. They're not one homogenous group. In the same way, I don't agree with all small church pastors.

Btw, I especially love watching old Billy Graham messages. I had no idea that his net worth was an estimated $25 million at the time of his death. Should I stop viewing his sermons?

I don’t agree with all his views, but he was a very special gift to the church.

[TheGloryLand]

Matt.7

[22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
[23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
[24] Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
[25] And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
[26] And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
 

 

Rock or Sand, it is very hard, not impossible for a very rich man or woman to make it to heaven. Sell all what you have, and give it away, and follow Me. Many will bow their heads and walk away, for they had much. The Blind, following the Blind.
 

We Choose my friends…

[TheGloryLand]

8 hours ago, Dr. Robert S. Morley said:

I don't follow, like, or agree with all mega church preachers. They're not one homogenous group. In the same way, I don't agree with all small church pastors.

Btw, I especially love watching old Billy Graham messages. I had no idea that his net worth was an estimated $25 million at the time of his death. Should I stop viewing his sermons?

I don’t agree with all his views, but he was a very special gift to the church.

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Amazing, and sad my friends. Much of their members are senior citizens, that are just barely making it, with their Social Security income.

Edited April 25, 2023 by TheGloryLand