Studying Job

[irishman]

I hope it is ok to post this here, didn't know where to put it exactly!
I know that this is really of little practical consequence, but it is interesting to me, and maybe to someone else.



Studies in JOB

JOB seems to have lived after the flood instead of before, as many have thought. This questions the theory that the Book of JOB pre-dates Genesis. We form a conclusion based on the following evidence:

“Almighty” (JOB 5:17); this is the first reference in JOB, but used throughout the Book. The first mention in the Bible is in Gen. 17:1. This name was claimed by God Himself, and referred, of course, to Himself.
Then there is the mention of a “lesser flood” in JOB 14:11~22:16~28:4. Though these may not refer to “the flood” of Noah’s day, there was not any knowledge of rain, or floods before God caused it to rain upon the earth during Noah’s time. “Rain” is also mentioned in JOB, in JOB 5:10~20:23~28:6~29:23, etc. Many believe that the pre-flood vegetation was watered from dew, and that it had not yet rained on the earth before the flood (based on Gen. 2:5).
Further evidence may put JOB even farther into the Book of Genesis: in Gen. 46:13 we see that Issachar, a son of JacOB, had a son named JOB (Gen. 46:13). I believe that this is the JOB that the Book of JOB is about. He would have been the grandson of JacOB (Israel). The land of “Uz” where JOB was from (JOB. 1:1) is not clearly defined in the Bible, but some think it was “Ur” of the Chaldees, where Abraham originated from, but there seems to be some mentions of it in Jeremiah, and Lamentations (Jer. 25:20 and Lam 4:21) We know that in JOB 1:17 these “Chaldeans” took away JOB’s camels and slew his servants, so, Chaldeans must have dwelt in the area where he lived. If this was the land of UR where Abraham was from, it is located in or very near Babylon of the Bible. The Chaldeans were most likely, Babylonish people, which was in northern Arabia. I believe that JOB may have lived in this area.
Sabeans, a people north of the red Sea, were also mentioned in the early chapters of JOB as taking away his oxen (JOB 1:15). This would again, locate JOB in the vicinity of Babylon, or Arabia, where Sabeans dwelt beside the Chaldeans, and JOB’s “friends” seemed to be people of these same countries.
The first one mentioned, Eliphaz the Temanite. Tema was located in the area a little south of Babylon, and was a prominent city of Arabia. In Genesis 36:11 Eliphaz is mentioned as having a son named “Teman” as well as other sons. Is this coincidence? No, I think not. Eliphaz was a son of Esau, JacOB’s brother (Gen. 36:14), and bore Amelek, who became the progenitor of the Amelikites. Now, Amelikites were people of the south (Num. 13:29) and they shared the land with other Canaanites. The Amellekites were destroyed in 1 Samuel 15:8-33, and then david destroyed the remnant of them in 1 Chron. 4:43, and they were never mentioned again in the Bible.
“Teman” the son of Eliphaz seems to have built a city which bore his name (some have dropped the “n” and named the city “Tema” after him). As mentioned previously, tema was a major city and abounded with philosophical types, and this may speak for Eliphaz’s wisdom in counseling JOB.
We know that JOB lived “in the east” (JOB 1:3); this would be east of Jerusalem which was considered the center of the world, and it became the focal point for all directions in the Bible. Sheba was south of Jerusalem, and would also be in northern Arabia. A mention of the “troops of Tema” and the “companies of Sheba” can be found in JOB 6:19. Sheba, we know, is toward the south from Jerusalem, and is likely located near Tema, in north or north-central Arabia. Incidentally, the “Queen of Sheba” who was infatuated with the wisdom and wealth of Solomon, was called “The queen of the south” (Mt. 12:42)

JOB was in his “old age” when all these troubles came upon him (JOB. 30:1,2); his friends were younger than him, and yet sought to give him counsel. JOB’s ten sons and daughters, who seemed to have left home by then (Chapters 1,2), seem to have been adults also. JOB was wrinkled (JOB 16:8) and very thin, which also emphasizes old age, and “dim if eye” (JOB 17:7); this would no doubt, put him nearer to the end of the time of the Book of Genesis than the beginning, or pre-dating genesis, as many claim. (This is “IF” he was the son of Issachar, the son of JacOB.)
Uz, the land where JOB lived, was apparently founded by a son of Esau, or a descendant of Esau’s bearing the same name (Gen. 36:28). Notice the strong connections to Esau and the Edomites in the land. Eliphaz was prOBably a descendant of Esau, as well as Teman, and the land they occupied was called “Uz”. Lamentations connects Uz with Esau or Edomites calling the people the “Daughter of Edom” (see Lam 4:21). Uz then was prOBably a province of Edom and is the place where JOB lived, as we have already mentioned. That would make him an Edomite by citizenship.

[PreacherE]

JOB seems to have lived after the flood instead of before, as many have thought. This questions the theory that the Book of JOB pre-dates Genesis.

I've never heard that JOB lived before the flood. Everyone whom I've ever heard preach has always put JOB living after the flood prOBably somewhere around the time of Abraham. The book is generally believed to have been written before Genesis. The Pentateuch (Genesis-Deuteronomy) was not written until the time of Moses and many believe that the book of JOB was written by either JOB himself or one of his friends.

Further evidence may put JOB even farther into the Book of Genesis: in Gen. 46:13 we see that Issachar, a son of JacOB, had a son named JOB (Gen. 46:13). I believe that this is the JOB that the Book of JOB is about. He would have been the grandson of JacOB (Israel).

I don't see how this could have been the the same person as the Book of JOB is about. In Genesis 46 is the record of JacOB moving to Egypt with all of his house and possessions. As we read in the Word of God there is no indication that any of them ever left the land of Goshen until the time of the Exodus. In Genesis 50:7-8 we see that certain of JacOB's household did leave Egypt to go and bury JacOB in the Land of Canaan but all those who went returned to Egypt in v. 14.


Just food for thought.

In Christ,
PreacherE

[irishman]

I've never heard that JOB lived before the flood. Everyone whom I've ever heard preach has always put JOB living after the flood prOBably somewhere around the time of Abraham. The book is generally believed to have been written before Genesis. The Pentateuch (Genesis-Deuteronomy) was not written until the time of Moses and many believe that the book of JOB was written by either JOB himself or one of his friends.



I don't see how this could have been the the same person as the Book of JOB is about. In Genesis 46 is the record of JacOB moving to Egypt with all of his house and possessions. As we read in the Word of God there is no indication that any of them ever left the land of Goshen until the time of the Exodus. In Genesis 50:7-8 we see that certain of JacOB's household did leave Egypt to go and bury JacOB in the Land of Canaan but all those who went returned to Egypt in v. 14.


Just food for thought.

In Christ,
PreacherE

Thank you preacher, for the input, I had never considered that! I'll have to do some more studying, (Oh happy day! I love to study God's Word.) It is definitely food for thought.

[John81]

I've never heard that JOB lived before the flood. Everyone whom I've ever heard preach has always put JOB living after the flood prOBably somewhere around the time of Abraham. The book is generally believed to have been written before Genesis. The Pentateuch (Genesis-Deuteronomy) was not written until the time of Moses and many believe that the book of JOB was written by either JOB himself or one of his friends.



I don't see how this could have been the the same person as the Book of JOB is about. In Genesis 46 is the record of JacOB moving to Egypt with all of his house and possessions. As we read in the Word of God there is no indication that any of them ever left the land of Goshen until the time of the Exodus. In Genesis 50:7-8 we see that certain of JacOB's household did leave Egypt to go and bury JacOB in the Land of Canaan but all those who went returned to Egypt in v. 14.


Just food for thought.

In Christ,
PreacherE

PreacherE! This is in accord with what I've heard preached as well as what my studies have shown.

[irishman]

That was a valid point, but I believe that the JOB that is JacOB's son could still be the JOB of the Book of JOB. I did some research and discovered a little more (Hadn't looked in that direction before)

Since the writing of this article (for lack of anything better to call it), the question has come up about JacOB going to Egypt with his entire family (which would include Issachar). Further study reveals that Issachar may have left home with his family sometime after, or just before going to Egypt. Three theories are possible:

1. That Issachar left before JacOB went down into Egypt, which isn’t likely, but still, the Bible could say that JacOB and all his family went to Egypt, meaning all of his household--at this juncture, that would exclude Issachar. Exodus 1:3 refutes this theory.

2. That while in Egypt, Issachar became a slave, or servant, of a man that took him to Iraq (now) or upper Arabia, the land of Ur of the Chaldees, and he dwelt there with his family. JacOBs blessing to Issachar was that he would serve men (read Gen. 49, especially v. 15, where he was destined to be a “servant unto tribute”.) To me, this is the most feasible of the three, the third being,

3. After the Exodus, Issachar may have went his own way and crossed the Arabian desert in an effort to get as far from Egypt as possible. This is the least practical and believable as far as I am concerned. Even though Issachar came out of Egypt, JOB his son, seems to be left out of the registry. The tribe, or ancestors of Issachar are mentioned many times throughout the O.T., but again, there is seemingly nothing about JOB dividing the land with the other sons.

Of course, when the Bible is not clear on a matter it may be better to leave it alone. This entire article is composed as speculation, with a small bit of circumstantial evidence.

One must consider Numbers 26:23-25, where the sons of Issachar are mentioned again having left Egypt, and JOB left is out! It very well could be that he had ventured out on his own, especially since he had a family of his own even before going into Goshen (Egypt). This would, in my opinion, strengthen theory number 2, that Issachar had already left the area, perhaps to serve a dignitary, or someone that moved to Babylon and Uz. We still do not know where the land of Uz was, but as we have seen, JOB’s “friends” were of cities in the area of northern Arabia and Babylon (Iraq). It is only fair to mention that some like to replace Ur with Uz, and claim they are different spellings of the same place. That too is mere speculation.
In Joshua 19:17-23, we have the lot that was given to Issachar “and his sons”. This area is around Jordan in the upper region of Israel, but we do not know if Issachar was present at that time. Their borders reached to Jordan, and there were sixteen cities allotted to them, but they are not easily traceable.

Edited September 4, 2010 by irishman

[PreacherE]

One must consider Numbers 26:23-25, where the sons of Issachar are mentioned again having left Egypt, and JOB left is out!

JOB is not left out in Numbers 26:23-25. It simply has a different version of his name, Jashub.

[John81]

JOB is not left out in Numbers 26:23-25. It simply has a different version of his name, Jashub.

Perhaps a bit off topic, but it's a good point to remember while being so easy to forget, that several names in Scripture have variations in their spelling.

Continue...

[irishman]

True. many names were written differently, but I still believe that the evidence very strongly points to Issachar son as the JOB of the Bible.

I have corrected the last post of mine, because I found some verses where Issachar is mentioned as coming out of Egypt and OBtaining his portion of the land, but still no mention of the man named "JOB", at least not rendered that way.