Jerry

Romans 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?

Exactly! They are not independent (by very definition of the word itself) if they are part of a convention, an association, or anything like that.

I am not sure what Spencer Smith is going to say about the new quarter, though he will be addressing it in this new video:

Exactly. And I will not be afraid to state my opinion, my beliefs, my understanding of the Word of God just because you don't like it when I do. I am of the same opinion and beliefs of the majority of the members of these boards, as well as of the Admins and Mods - so I don't need to walk on eggshells when declaring where I stand any more than any other regular member on these boards does.

I am just as entitled to my opinion as you are to yours, BrotherTony. Quit being offended when I state mine. I don't get bent out of shape because you have a different opinion or that you express it. I don't have to "justify" my opinions any more than you do. If I was stating something doctrinally, then I should be able to back it up from the Bible. But no one on these boards is expected to back up every thought or opinion of theirs - you certainly do not. Why expect something different from others?

A friend of mine posted a picture of a US 2022 quarter. Previously, the man on the quarter faced towards the words "In God we trust." On the 2022 quarter, he is facing away from the phrase. Someone behind the new design does not want to honour God.

I'm sorry, I am not sure what text you are stating is the best. The one you prefer? Ie. the KJV? If it is the best, then isn't what differs from it inferior - inasmuch as it does so? I don't want an approximation of the Word of God. God promised to preserve His Word, including the exact words of His inspired books of the Bible (and of course, the whole Book); therefore, I am sticking with what I am convinced is that inspired, inerrant, preserved Word, and the faithful English translation from it.

Let's make this simple then. The KJV is God's preserved, inerrant Word in English. Regardless of how much others may or may not change their own Critical Text manuscripts (and I truly do not have the resources or the time to study this issue out right now), the fact that they depart from the preserved Hebrew Masoretic Text and the Greek Textus Receptus (which have had God's hand on them throughout history) is good enough for me to warn others against this corrupted stream of manuscripts and whatever is translated from it, inasmuch as it differs from those preserved texts I have mentioned above. Even if a particular English translation was 100% exactly the same (as much as possible as a translation can be) as THEIR underlying Critical Texts, I would still warn against the changes that their CT texts have made to the Word of God. God didn't inspire two streams of competing manuscripts (or changed manuscripts) - so as much as they do differ, one or both are wrong. However, studying out the history of the texts and of the English (and some other language) translations from these underlying texts, I know where and why I stand on the King James Bible and its underlying manuscripts. There is more to the issue than personal preferences on either side. There are doctrinal changes because certain people - editors, translators, compilers, and scribes - chose to change or corrupt things along the way. Yes, granted some of the changes may even have been unintentional (ie. a copyist error), though most are not, and these changes are significant and do affect the doctrine of the text that they are in. You are welcome to your preferences - but I would rather have convictions based on the evidence behind and for both streams of manuscripts.

Welcome. If you love to fellowship over the Word of God (especially the King James Bible), then you may find yourself fitting in nicely here.

Welcome to these boards, Johann. I will restate what BrotherTony did, yes it is the policy of these boards to quote from the KJV only. It may take you longer to edit something you are copying and pasting, but it will be more beneficial to all involved - especially as you yourself are acknowledging the KJV as superior to the modern versions. There are certainly some worthwhile points that you made above.

Wrestling Until The Break Of Day Alone with God – salvation’s story, Wrestling until the break of day. This is worth the greatest glory, To cling to Jesus come what may. Wrestling, praying, holding on so tight, Like a prince, I won’t let Him go. Transformed by grace throughout the night – Oh how much He must love me so! Running from fear, and troubling trials, Faltering, afraid, stopped in my tracks; From worry, to peace – yet, all the while, Knowing inside there’s no turning back. Wrestling until the darkness shatters, A part of me won’t give up this fight; But it’s not my hold on God that matters: He is wrestling with my soul tonight. Struggling, pleading, in desperation, Until my strength is taken away, Wondering at my situation – Believing He’s the victor this day. Within my own heart, there is a peace: He will not leave His work undone; Transforming my life piece by piece, Until the rising of the sun. Wrestling in faith, like Jacob of old, Until his life was rearranged – Now touched by God, lo and behold, I find myself forever changed. When trouble comes to darken our trail, Though it seems we can’t find our way, Our Saviour’s love will never fail – Wrestling until the break of day. June 1st/2022 Jerry Bouey Jacob was in distress and worried about his brother, Esau, and his 400 armed men coming his way. Left alone with the Lord, his only option was to cling to God until the day break. This is much like us, wrestling with ourselves and our Saviour, until the day break and the shadows flee away – not letting the Lord go until He blesses us by changing our situations or ourselves. Genesis 32:24-31 And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day. And when he saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob’s thigh was out of joint, as he wrestled with him. And he said, Let me go, for the day breaketh. And he said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me. And he said unto him, What is thy name? And he said, Jacob. And he said, Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel: for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed. And Jacob asked him, and said, Tell me, I pray thee, thy name. And he said, Wherefore is it that thou dost ask after my name? And he blessed him there. And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved. And as he passed over Penuel the sun rose upon him, and he halted upon his thigh. Hebrews 11:21 By faith Jacob, when he was a dying, blessed both the sons of Joseph; and worshipped, leaning upon the top of his staff. Jacob's encounter with the Lord God changed his life forever! Song of Songs 2:17 Until the day break, and the shadows flee away, turn, my beloved, and be thou like a roe or a young hart upon the mountains of Bether. Bether means “division,” ie. what separates us from our Saviour. Jesus will come leaping over the divisions and difficulties in my life. Song of Songs 4:6 Until the day break, and the shadows flee away, I will get me to the mountain of myrrh, and to the hill of frankincense. From the time the Song of Solomon was written until the time of His return again, the Lord Jesus Christ would go to the mountain of myrrh (ie. myrrh meaning death, to face death on Calvary), and the hill of frankincense (ie. incense represents prayer, and He would go as our High Priest to pray to the Father for His brethren). Song of Songs 8:14 Make haste, my beloved, and be thou like to a roe or to a young hart upon the mountains of spices. This song ends with the Shulamite looking forward to her Beloved Bridegroom’s return, much like true believers are awaiting Jesus’ return to take His bride home to be with Him forever. Revelation 22:20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. The last book of the Bible ends on the same note. Even so, come, Lord Jesus! For a devotional study on this theme, please read: Wrestling Until The Day Break

I think perhaps you missed what I was saying. I believe Jesus IS God - my point was that by modern versions changing or removing words, they are changing or diluting Bible doctrines. Yes - but how much change can the world make upon our Bibles before that doctrine is no longer evident in them, or watered down enough that they think it is not essential or necessary for people to believe?

Yes, while the church building/services are open to the lost (and yes, I will make this caveat - to those who are not openly flaunting their sin), no lost person should be welcomed as a member until they actually trust in Christ for salvation and there is evidence of a change (ie. evidence of being born again).

I watched most of this earlier today and will finish it now. He had some good points in what he was saying on this subject.

Actually, those who seek sodomite and lesbian lifestyles (and other associated abominations) are in fact evil. The Bible teaches none of us are good without Christ, but it also teaches that those living these kind of lifestyles are wicked - especially if they turned to these lifestyles because of rejecting the Saviour and His Word as Romans 1 teaches (though not all that live this lifestyle have gotten to that point - those that haven't still have hope according to 1 Corinthians 6;9-11). If someone lost comes into our churches and desires to hear the Word of God and learn about the Saviour, praise the Lord for that as long as they are not bringing their wickedness into the church. However, anyone that is living any kind of sinful lifestyle (including ones involving sexual sins) should not be welcomed as part of the church or allowed to be members. This exact practice (of letting the lost become accepted as "part of the church family") is the reason MANY churches throughout history have fallen by the wayside or compromised their beliefs and practices as the lost eventually outnumbered (or outweighed the beliefs of) the truly saved in each particular church or denomination. In such cases, you are not gaining more of a church family, you are destroying and tearing down a church by allowing tares in among the wheat.

An Independent Baptist church is autonomous. Not all Baptist churches are that way. If they are part of a convention, for example, they are not. That being said, if someone else dictated that they follow a certain guideline or did certain things, then those ones would not be autonomous either. The simple act of having a headquarters dictating beliefs or practices would make those churches a denomination. One of the Baptist Distinctives is the autonomy of the local church. Of course, there are many Baptist churches that do not follow this distinctive. We can fellowship and even work together to some extent with other likeminded independent Baptist churches, but are not linked together in the sense where one tells the other what to do or believe.

Is it a US holiday or special occasion specifically in the US? We have Remembrance Day in November, but that is the only day I am personally aware of when Veterans are honoured publically where I live in Canada. I have never been in any church (Baptist or otherwise) that had a special service to honour the veterans. I do not think it is a liberal thing up here, just not something that affects or impacts the people I know as much.** (I am not knocking a special service or day like this. I have just never observed anything other than Remembrance Day, which is November 11th.) Though I have noticed as time goes on that less and less people up around where I live buy poppies, donate, honour their relatives that fought in certain wars, or even stand up and give that veteran a seat, etc. (though many of the youth in the next generation and last generation don't even do that for seniors in general anymore). **As far as I go personally, war has not effected me or my family. I never grew up with any relatives talking about any war experiences, never had a parent take us to something celebrating veterans. I know what the Bible says about defending our country and our homes, but have never been involved in the military/army/navy in any way - except for a couple of months of being a cadet in the 70's. All I remember from then was them teaching us how to march and to clean our white cadet hats with white toothpaste.

I do love how Webster sought to make many of his definitions refer back to the Bible (and give the definition of that word as used in the Bible). Many old readers used presented Bible doctrine in their lessons and/or referred directly to Bible characters and events, so that was pretty cool. Nowadays, people don't want the Bible at all in schools. How much different would the upcoming generations be if they used the same kind of readers again?

I don't remember what thread we were discussing this in, but this is worth noting. Revelation 4:5 And out of the throne proceeded lightnings and thunderings and voices: and there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God. Revelation 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth. Same symbolism. The seven spirits in chapter four represent the Holy Spirit. In chapter five, it is mentioned that the Spirit of God is sent forth into all the earth - representing His omnipresence. The seven eyes represent perfect/complete knowledge (omniscience), the seven horns represent perfect/complete strength (omnipotence), and the seven Spirit represent His perfect/complete presence in all the earth. This last fact is interesting in light of the fact that many believe the Holy Spirit will not be here (ie. be removed) during the Tribulation period. Revelation 5:6 states He is sent forth into all the earth DURING this time period. His ministries will no doubt be different (in comparison to how He worked during the church age), but He will definitely be here doing His work of conviction, enlightenment, regeneration.

Hosea 2 describes the Valley of Trouble, which makes an excellent message on "the Backslider's valley" - what God does to bring His wandering children back to Him (which implies some do go astray - no backsliding would mean no chastisement for His children, but various places in the NT and OT teach otherwise).

In the beginning God... - Genesis 1:1 Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. My Name Is I Am I was regretting the past and fearing the future When suddenly my Father was speaking: My Name is I AM. He paused and I waited: He continued. When you live in the past with its regrets and mistakes It is hard for me. I am not there. My name is not I WAS. When you live in the future with its problems and fears It is difficult for me. I am not there. My name is not I WILL BE. When you live in this moment it is not hard. I am here. MY NAME IS I AM. Helen Mellicoat God Is Try to top this! He is the First and Last, the Beginning and the End! He is the keeper of Creation and the Creator of all! He is the Architect of the universe and the Manager of all times. He always was, He always is, and He always will be... Unmoved, Unchanged, Undefeated, and never Undone! He was bruised and brought healing! He was pierced and eased pain! He was persecuted and brought freedom! He was dead and brought life! He is risen and brings power! He reigns and brings Peace! The world can't understand Him, The armies can't defeat Him, The schools can't explain Him, and The leaders can't ignore Him. Herod couldn't kill Him, The Pharisees couldn't confuse Him, and The people couldn't hold Him! Nero couldn't crush Him, Hitler couldn't silence Him, The New Age can't replace Him, and Donahue can't explain Him away! He is light, love, longevity, and Lord. He is Goodness, Kindness, Gentleness, and God. He is Holy, Righteous, mighty, powerful, and pure. His ways are right, His word is eternal, His will is unchanging, and His mind is on me! He is my Redeemer, He is my Savior, He is my Guide, and He is my Peace! He is my Joy, He is my Comfort, He is my Lord, and He rules my life! I serve Him because His bond is love, His burden is light, and His goal for me is abundant life. I follow Him because He is the wisdom of the wise, the power of the powerful, the ancient of days, the ruler of rulers, the leader of leaders, the overseer of the overcomers, and the sovereign Lord of all that was and is and is to come. And if that seems impressive to you, try this for size: His goal is a relationship with ME! He will never leave me, never forsake me, never mislead me, never forget me, never overlook me, and never cancel my appointment in His appointment book! When I fall, He lifts me up! When I fail, He forgives! When I am weak, He is strong! When I am lost, He is the way! When I am afraid, He is my courage! When I stumble, He steadies me! When I am hurt, He heals me! When I am broken, He mends me! When I am blind, He leads me! When I am hungry, He feeds me! When I face trials, He is with me! When I face persecution, He shields me! When I face problems, He comforts me! When I face loss, He provides for me! When I face Death, He carries me Home! He is everything for everybody, everywhere, every time, and every way. He is God, He is faithful. I am His, and He is mine! My Father in heaven can whip the father of this world. So, if you're wondering why I feel so secure, understand this... He said it and that settles it. God is in control, I am on His side, and that means all is well with my soul. Everyday is a blessing, for GOD Is! By Mike Hilson for Vista Magazine

If the pastor hires someone, they should be paid. If they - out of love for the Lord and their pastor - freely offer to meet certain needs, then that is good. BUT if he demands or expects people to do things for him and his family, etc. for free just because he is the pastor, that would be wrong.

I do not have a problem with your specifically, nor was trying to "show off my superior intellect or view of Scripture" You stated something, and I pointed out what the Bible actually does say about it - in context. That's part of what studying the Word of God is all about - not reading a subject until we've heard enough and find an "acceptable position" to stand on, but studying the whole book to arrive at a conclusion that takes all the passages into consideration. My responses were an attempt to be Biblical, not controversial and not just have a religious viewpoint. If I am off on some things I believe or on some of my conclusions, I welcome input from the Bible. I don't get offended because someone else points out some passages or areas I may have overlooked in my conclusion. If my manner of coming across seemed wrong at any time to you, I apologize - though I do not apologize for attempting to stand upon God's Word or strive to be Biblical in my conclusions. If that is not something you can fellowship over, then we can choose not to reply to each others posts in the future. But again, I will restate, it was not my intent to be offensive towards you, just to post further Bible input on this topic. Isaiah 28:9-10 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Anything you do for the Lord, in your walk with Him, would technically be in service to Him. Of course, that would not be what is typically referred to as fulltime service to the Lord (people usually use that term in reference to those involved in "the ministry", like missionaries, pastors, evangelists, perhaps even Christian teachers, preachers). When Jesus spoke about giving a cup of cold water in His name, that was in service to Him. When I help clean the church, collect the offering, share something from the pulpit, that is definitely in service to Him. However, I don't think it has to be limited to things we do for our church family, or in regards to our church property or building, but could include ALL we do in His name as we walk with Him day by day. If we are not serving Him day by day, who are we serving? (No specific answer implied, just stating it to make us think.) Romans 12:1-2 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

Certainly it is not a sin to be worn out or tired and struggling with sleep during a service. I'm sure that happens to all of us at one time or another. Our desire to be at church outweighs our fleshly desire to sleep in or stay at home, but sometimes we lose the battle with sleep, despite our best efforts. However, I will state, if we go to church deliberately with the intent of sleeping or tuning out the sermon in some way, then that is sin. The first position I stated above is an attempt to hear the Word of God and fellowship with other believers, the second position is an attempt to put in a show for some reason with no attempt to honour God or His Word.