Napsterdad

Noone on this forum can possibly answer this question. Why don't you ask the pastors you actually witness "not asking visitors or members if they will like to accept Jesus Christ for Salvation". Right or wrong, they are the ONLY ones that can give an answer to this. Perhaps you can then help them in some way. I certainly can't. I don't even know them or their church.

Nowhere in the Bible can we see, or even infer that Satan had any kind of physical contact with Eve, much less sexual contact. Genesis 3:1-6 ¶ Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? 2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: 3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. 4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: 5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. 6 ¶ And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. All that can be seen here is conversation, sight, and the actual eating of the fruit. Nothing else. If this is forced into verse six by Eve eating of the fruit, well, Adam did the same; does that mean he and Satan had relations too? Preposterous. I have read that there are those that would try to force this narrative into verse 13 (beguiled). Again, preposterous. Genesis 3:13 And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat. The definition for "nasha" the Hebrew for beguile is: to lead astray, i.e. to delude, or deceive. Nothing else. Even the more common "other versions" of the Bible don't take it any further: “deceived” (ESV, NIV, HCSB, NLT) or “tricked” (NRSV, NET). The other verse I have found used to promote this nonsense is Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. "Thy seed and her seed". Thy is singular. Satan's seed. But if written accurately in support of this fictitious child, shouldn't that read "Your" seed, plural, as in both Satan's and Eve's? And what is the name of this child? Where is he found in the scriptures? It can't have been Cain because Genesis 4:1 tells us: And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD. Adam knew Eve and Cain was conceived. Huh! Do the scriptures EVER say Satan knew Eve? Anywhere? NO. This is nothing more than another person/group twisting the scriptures way out of context to fit their perverted views. Absolute nonsense.

Bats! (HAHAHAHAHAHA! that's funny...sigh...like the Wuhan Flu really came from bats...giggle,giggle,snort!)

Fauci

Tackle

Prison

Sandwich

Where?

But don't feel bad..., Tony didn't win either.

Welcome aboard, Donut. Good to have you here.

Just imagine how much it would be if it WASN'T called the Affordable Care Act! So, what is your annual deductible after paying that "affordable" monthly fee?

Your father sounds like a very wise man.

My wife and I stopped "celebrating" Valentine's Day many years ago. We realized that when you openly express your love for each other every day of the year, you don't need a special day set aside to openly express your love for each other. Besides, giving flowers or some other special gift on random days of the year seems a far more sincere and meaningful expression of your love for someone rather than on a day when it is "mandated".

SSSSHHHHHHH! you'll wake everyone! ?

I apologize for the length of this post, but I believe it is all necessary to the point I am making. My wife, oldest son (32) and I were having a discussion last week that dovetails very nicely into this topic, but first a little background: My son is currently going through a divorce (not of his choosing) from a woman he still adores. Unfortunately, she has put herself on a path of self-destruction and is suspected by various therapists to suffer from Borderline Personality Disorder. Neither of them is saved, but my son was raised in a fundamental KJV Christian home and holds to most, if not all, of those moral standards. I describe him as the best unsaved Christian you could ever meet, and most of his acquaintances are surprised when they find he is not a Christian. His wife said, when she first got to know him, that he talked and acted different from anyone she had ever met before. Regretfully he never truly accepted the Lord as savior and his college “science” studies (Summa Cum Laude in Chemistry) did nothing but drive him further away from belief in a creator (of any description). Still, he is very respectful and always open to discussing Christianity (or any religion) so long as the discussion stays respectful and non-argumentative (i.e., rational and philosophical). He sees value in religion (especially Christianity) as a means whereby mankind has been able to avert the “survival of the fittest” anarchy that should inherently come from what evolutionary theory offers but is unwilling to cede that any religion is necessary to meet that end. He believes (tenuously I think) that man, on his own, was able to determine that “survival of the fittest” is best achieved by communal support and agreement and naturally works to that end. Our son continues to see his marriage counselor (alone) to help him understand his part in all this (minimal) and his best path forward. He is most interested in how he can better himself and his contribution to society, meet people with similar standards and goals, and ultimately to find someone that he can share his life with. To this last point he has looked into almost every “reputable” dating app out there and has been utterly disappointed with the quality of potential partners, seeing most as shallow and self-serving with none of the moral fiber he (now more than ever) sees as mandatory element in any relationship. He has made the comment (more than once) that he feels the only place he could likely find the woman best suited for him is in a solid Christian Church, but he can’t bring himself to do that because he knows that would be a sham: he would be lying to himself and any potential partner; exactly what he is trying to avoid. Like me, my son is an introvert and going out to meet new people and explore new social venues is very difficult for him. His therapist is a 7th Day Adventist who is very active in his church (“Bible” Study leader), and he invited my son to come out and see if he couldn’t connect with someone at his church. He said that his church isn’t the “preachy” kind but is actually more like a social club of people who are seeking ways to better themselves and find that the moral structure found in the Bible is a potential means to that end. My son took him up on his offer and has gone to his studies (not the service) for the past two weeks. The conversations have been (so far) along the lines of the age-old argument about why good people suffer and bad people seem to be blessed. My son’s participation has been minimal (introvert) but this has gotten him to thinking and discussing these issues with us afterwards. I can say, through hopeful tears, that God is working in my son through all of this. I see his wall of defiance beginning to crumble and he is beginning to feel the pain of the pricks against which he has been kicking for so many years. Please pray for him, and us as we try to use this opportunity to lead him to Christ. With this background in mind, we were led into our Laodicean conversation last weekend. My son was talking about good and evil, and his ultimate point was that everyone makes a choice to either take the path of good or to take the path of evil. At this point I said that is not necessarily true, especially in the day and age we currently find ourselves. Many today aren’t choosing good or evil, they are simply choosing not to pick a side and just let life take its course. Absolutely indifferent to the consequences it is all about what is in it for me. How can I best profit myself? How can I have the best time? How can I have the most “friends”? The best image? This is exactly what sent my son’s wife off. She isn’t an evil person, quite the contrary, but she didn’t like the rules she felt a respectable marriage was imposing on her. She developed FOMO (Fear of missing out). She didn’t like the structure or the responsibility brought about with a secure marriage and so she chose to leave. There is no animus on her part; she actually told my son that they could remain friends and even go back to dating from time to time, which my son can’t do. I honestly do not believe that she sees her actions as good or evil (even though the consequences are tearing my son’s heart to shreds). Now she goes about living life to the fullest and sharing all her adventures on her Facebook page just as if she had never been married. She doesn’t see the consequences outside of her own limited self-view. I believe this life perspective is rapidly taking hold in America. While this attitude is not new, I believe that it picked up momentum post WWII, accelerated with the Boomers, and blossomed with the Millennials (which I like to call ME-llenials because it’s all about me). If you think about it, this is a natural development based on America’s drift away from God and the Bible and toward Darwinism. If there is no God than all that matters is me. What is in it for me? There is no thought of good or evil, just what is in it for me. This is Laodicea. Revelation 3:14-17 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; 15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. 16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. 17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: Neither cold nor hot. Neither good nor evil. Lukewarm. All about me. I am not a bad person, I don’t want to hurt anyone, I just want what is best for me, “what I deserve”. Unfortunately, we are seeing this creep into many churches. A growing number of churches are opening themselves up to the music and pageantry that will bring these people in. They feel they have to accommodate that need of self-gratification that is now so prevalent in our society in order to bring people in to fill the pews. Like the 7th Day Adventist Church my son has been going to, they are becoming Laodicean.

We're having a Crock 'Potluck' dinner at church tonight. Every family is to bring a favorite crock pot recipe (in the crock pot) along with a dessert. We're bringing "Lazy Golabki". That is the traditional polish cabbage roll recipe all chopped up and mixed in a crock pot. Delicious. My daughter just finished baking a couple dozen of Pumpkin Chocolate Chip Cookies. I don't know what everyone else is bringing, but I see my waistline expanding. ?

Very similar to what the Catholics do: "Mary is my mother. She is your mother, too. Before Jesus died on the cross, He saw Mary and one of His disciples before Him. He said to Mary, “Woman, behold your son.” To His his disciple He said, “Behold, your mother.” (from John 19: 26 and 27) He assigned this disciple (John) to watch over and protect Mary. The Catholic Church also looks at this event as Jesus giving Mary to all believers as our Mother. She is also the Mother of the Church". (Taken from How Does Mary Help us as our Spiritual Mother? - Blessed Catholic Mom "Do what He tells you.") Sorry. I'm not going there. Too much of a stretch. You refer to Proverbs 1:8 My son, hear the instruction of thy father, and forsake not the law of thy mother: And why only allow for the scriptures to be our spiritual mother? What about the father? Aren't the scriptures also referred to as "instructions"? Based on your logic wouldn't Proverbs 1:8 along with 2 Timothy 3:16 allow the scriptures to be our spiritual father as well? 2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: John 1 makes it clear. Jesus Christ is the word. I am comfortable with that. I do not need to allegorize it into a mother or father. John 1:1-3; 14 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. Jesus is the Word. God said it, I believe it, that settles it. I don't need to (nor should I) transpose that onto anyone else.

You sure know how to streeeeeeeeeetch those scriptures to make a point that is not there.

Sounds like you have a better understanding of American History than many Americans. The biggest concerns were America turning into any type of theocracy, and the government being able to dictate to the church.

Agreed. The US Government (both parties) is stu...stu...stu...stu...stuck on stu...stu...stu...stu...stupid.

Congratulations!!!

Thanks! and welcome to the forum.

I in no way implied that these different religions worship together, but as real estate is very dear, especially in many deployed military environments, places to worship are not choices, but directives. Because of this multiple religions must use the same venue to worship at different times not together. Countries where Christianity is severely controlled or forbidden are even further restrictive. Perhaps you should go to these places and discuss with those in power how they must allow for the cleansing of Christian places of worship. As I read your posts on this issue I cannot help but think of Luke 11:37-54. For instance: Luke 11:39 And the Lord said unto him, Now do ye Pharisees make clean the outside of the cup and the platter; but your inward part is full of ravening and wickedness. What is on the outside is of little importance, it is what is in the heart that matters. If those you worship with are so easily distracted by the decor of a sanctuary, I suggest you work on their heart condition. Don't start pointing at others who don't let the external trappings of a facility distract from their internal worship; again, similar to the Pharisees. Luke 11:53 And as he said these things unto them, the scribes and the Pharisees began to urge him vehemently, and to provoke him to speak of many things: 54 Laying wait for him, and seeking to catch something out of his mouth, that they might accuse him. Pastor Matt made an interesting point. Should all Christian sanctuaries remove the cross as well? Again, if the trappings of a place of meeting are such a significant issue the problem is not with the inanimate objects, but with the heart of the "Christian".

While in Saudi Arabia for an extended period for work the local church met in alternating homes of members on varying weeks to reduce the possibility of patterns in the gatherings. These meetings took place on Fridays as that is Islam's day of worship (Sunday is a workday there). Following your lead, I would have to assume we were worshipping the goddess, Frigga, wife of Odin, goddess of married love. Who knew? All this time I thought we were worshipping Christ. ?

I imagine this could be a bit difficult for those “churches” that must gather in schools or some other public venue (due to lack of their own facility) where secular, and even other religious symbols, may be common. While deployed in the military the same facility may be used for the conduct of all religions' services (Christian, Jewish, Islam, Wicca, etc.). You may also be sure that in such military installations the American Flag is most likely present. Are you implying that in each of these places the room should be thoroughly scrubbed to remove any instance of secular or religious symbolism not relevant to biblical Christianity? The fact of the matter is that “where” we worship is of little importance. Nowhere in the bible is church defined as a specific place. The word translated “church” in the Bible is ekklesia, which is derived from the words ek: a primary preposition denoting origin “from, out”, and kaleo: which means to bid or call. So biblically speaking a “church” is a calling out. The church is the people, not the place. For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:13 This is the church. Those that have been called out (ekklesia) from this world and by salvation have been spiritually baptized into the body of Christ. The church is a people that gather together to worship God and Christ. For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them. Matthew 18:20 Now, if in the hearts of any of these people a flag or some other secular or religious item is taking precedence over God then there is a problem; but based on Matthew 18:20 it doesn’t appear that Jesus was too concerned with the surrounding environment so long as two or three were sincerely gathered in His name.