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John 10:31-35


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BaptistLady

I did not read the web site posted but I have actually used those verses to witness to Mormons and JW?s.

You see Jesus makes a clear claim to have written the Old Testament. ?Is it not written in your law (get this) I Said ye are gods?. Who wrote the Old Testament? God! Who took total ownership of what was said? Jesus!

The actual quote comes from Psalm 82:6 and is in part the discourse by God through Asaph to the civil magistrates of the time. Its clear meaning is that the magistrates were made to be like God in that they had the authority to judge righteously within the Jewish community. God wanted them to know that they were issuing judgments among the people because he had given them the authority to do so and for no other reason. The people treated them (the magistrates) like gods but verse 7 is clear don?t let it go to your head for you are mortal and will die just like any other man and fall just like any prince who gets a big head.

Psalms 82:6-7 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

Orvals

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Hi everyone. If this is the wrong forum, please move it.

Anyway, I'm talking to a Mormon and he brought up this verse. He is using it to support the Mormon doctrine that we can become gods. What should I say in response to this? :puzzled:


Hi. I was a Mormon at one time. I was baptized in the temple in Syracuse, NY at age 9. Let me tell you, you can't answer it because it's pure private interpretation on their part.

Just read to them Psalm 82:6,7:


6: I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

7: BUT YE SHALL DIE LIKE MEN, and fall like one of the princes.
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Hi

What Wilchbla said.

The mormons ive witnessed to, (usually missionaries) upon finding out im Baptist, will start talking and trying to quote scripture from the KJV. The verses they used were taught to them out of context and isolated. They are not taught the bible as they say, only small parts of it. I know a few ex mormons who are saved now and have great ministries. They all discovered the truth by studying the KJV and seeing the truth.

The last ones I talked to I had to find the verses for them in the bible. One of them could not find the book of 1 Peter. I challenged them to read John and Romans and come back to me. Of Course they never did. :sad

Keep praying for them and challenging them to read the Bible alone and come to Church. God gives the increase. :smile

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BaptistLady,

My father-in-law joined LDS several years ago and hit me with all this stuff. Here is the verse in question:

Jhn 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

which is a N.T. ref to this verse:

Psa 82:6 I have said, Ye [are] gods; and all of you [are] children of the most High.

The word "gods" here is the Hebrew word, 'elohiym which strongs defines in the plural sense as follows:
1) (plural)
a) rulers, judges
B) divine ones
c) angels
d) gods

So which sense is used in this Psalm, which Jesus refered to in John 10?

Psa 82:1 [[A Psalm of Asaph.]] God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
Psa 82:2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
Psa 82:3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
Psa 82:4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid [them] out of the hand of the wicked.
Psa 82:5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
Psa 82:6 I have said, Ye [are] gods; and all of you [are] children of the most High.

Obviously, contextually (which is something they know nothing about) we are talking about elohims, judges. Furthermore, their own ace theologian Bruce E. McConky said these passages in Psalms and John mean judges and not deity. I will find out the name of the book and the page number (which as I recall is page, 501.)

I'll post more on this later, I have a GREAT ONE for you to share with you Mormon friends.

Bro. Ben

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I have spent many years researching other faiths/religions, of which the LDS (Mormons) is one. Part of the reason it gets complicated to get into a shared Bible study is because the bible they utilize is the IV (or Inspired Version) which was written by Joseph Smith, Jr. (and although similar to the KJV is way, way different in many areas, especially in Genesis with two different creation stories, for one example). The other problem in these discussions is that this is not their main Scripture of Doctrine, rather they utilize three scriptures - mainly the Book of Mormon, the Inspired Version of the bible and then the Doctrine and Covenants. The third is considered to be a like a book of continued revelation of phrophecy that started with JSmith & they keep adding to, and this particular book is where they turn for much of their beliefs as well as the Book of Mormon.

Although the people in this faith are very friendly and kind, it can get increasingly complicated to Bible study with them because these are the only materials they are familiar with. The theology is interesting, that's for sure, but in my findings they seem to focus quite a bit on the Prophet/President of the church and his importance - which iseems to be of the highest regard, from the first Joseph Smith Jr, to the current (within the actual church settings) as they do on their doctrines.

I find the key when discussing scripture with LDS folks is patience (and knowing about or some of their scripture materials helps and/or history), however, once you invite them in they (in my own personal experience) will try to bring others(in mass groups) with them and try and convert you. I'm a strong woman though and I know my scriptures well, so even when then entires ladies league showed up at my door, it was juice - cookies - and bible study(that is not iv), and conversion tactics get left outside or please go home.
But it was overall a very interesting experience learning about their faith and theology first hand.

Blessings,
Sandra

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When a Mormon doesn't like what the Bible says he goes to the Book of Mormon.

When he doesn't like what the Book of Mormon says he goes to the Doctrines and Covenants.

When he doesn't like what the Doctrine and Covenants says he goes to the Pearl of Great Price.

When he doesn't like what the Pearl of Great Price says he goes to the Journal of Discourses.

When they don't like what the Journal of Discourses says he goes to the President of the LDS Church.

When he doesn't like what the LDS President says he goes to the "Twelve Apostles" in Salt Lake City.

You see, the way to always get around the truth is to have conflicting authorities. I can actually show a Mormon a verse in the Book of Mormon that teaches a man must be born again yet he'll just fall back on another authority within his own church to refute it. The best way to get around the truth is to have multiple conflicting authorities.

Oh, and even the Book of Mormon has gone through many changes itself to rid it of controversial passages like attaining eternal life by practicing polygamy.

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