Jump to content
Online Baptist Community

Calvinism


Recommended Posts

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
On 11/23/2020 at 8:33 AM, Baptistsenior said:

I do not agree with Calvanism, but I love Spurgeon because he saturates his sermons with Gods Word.  Too many preachers use a verse or two and alot of opinion in their sermons 

I'm using his devotional, Morning by Morning - Spurgeon for the first time. He has opened up scripture in ways I had not imagined and given great thought applicable in Christian daily life. A lot of scripture in his commentary of the verse and a lot of Pilgrim's Progress - Bunyan referenced. I've heard more than one IFB pastor refer to him as The Prince of Preachers. If or when it comes to the 3 pt. & 5 pt. places in this devotional I'll think of Jesus great commission to me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
On 12/19/2020 at 2:17 PM, Danny Carlton said:

It's not until a child reaches the age of accountability that they make a sinful choice, and at that point become a sinner, in need of salvation. Sin is something we do. A sin nature is something we inherit, but doesn't become sin until we make that first choice to sin, understanding that it's wrong. Our sin nature itself does not condemn us, our choice to sin does.

On 12/20/2020 at 8:11 AM, Pastor Scott Markle said:

Psalm 58:3 -- "The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies."

Romans 5:18 -- "Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon ALL men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life."

On 3/19/2021 at 10:08 PM, Danny Carlton said:

You are using the natural ambiguity of language to "force" the Bible to say things it clearly does not say. God told Adam and Eve that on the day they ate the fruit they would die. On that day the process of death began. Often the initiation, the process and the conclusion are referred to by the same noun or verb. Since we understand what is sin, yet do not have the capacity to resist it the curse of sin inhabits us all from birth, but does not actually become sin until we make the choice to sin. The Bible was intended to be read with common sense, not blind devotion to vague concepts that defy logic. God is the God of logic, not the God of confusion.

Interesting defense, but let us consider the facts -- You are presenting human "logic" and human "common sense" as the basis for doctrine without presenting any Scriptural support at all; whereas I simply provided direct quotations from God's OWN Word.  (Note: I did NOT "force" God's Word to say anything; in my original posting above, I simply quoted what it said and emphasized certain relevant phrases.)  Which one is more sure as a foundation for true doctrine?  As for me, that is an easy choice.  Indeed, as for me I will simply accept the very precise wording that God the Holy Spirit inspired in the Holy Scriptures (which really is NOT ambiguous at all):

1.  Sinners (the wicked) ARE estranged from the very time of the womb.
2.  Sinners (the wicked) actively go astray AS SOON AS they be born, specifically speaking lies.
3.  The sinful offense of the one man Adam caused the judgment of God to come upon ALL to their condemnation.  (Note: It is NOT their own sin that brings this judgment to condemnation, but was Adam's first act of sin.)

By the way, concerning Adam and Eve God said -- "For in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."  Yet we recognize according to the Scriptures that they did NOT physically die on that very day.  In fact, they lived out a whole life-span before they physically died.  For this reason, you have presented that the PROCESS of death began on that very day, but NOT the actual moment of death itself.  Indeed, if we consider only the realm of PHYSICAL death, then I would be compelled to agree.  However, there is another realm wherein death occurred - the SPIRITUAL realm.  In fact, in the very day that they sinned, yea in the very moment that they sinned, they IMMEDIATELY died spiritually.  Even so, when we are discussing the matter of sin nature and of condemnation by sin, the context is definitely that of the spiritual realm.  Spiritual death began in the human race with Adam's sin, and is passed down through Adam's sin unto ALL of mankind.  All come into this world already "dead in trespasses and sins."  All require a divine Savior to provide them with spiritual life.  Indeed, God the Son, Jesus the Christ, is that Savior, the only Way, the only Truth, and the only LIFE.  NO ONE whatsoever at all can come unto God as Father, but by God the Son, Jesus the Christ.

Edited by Pastor Scott Markle
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members
On 11/21/2020 at 9:46 AM, Baptistsenior said:

Why do preachers that condemn Calvanism quote Spurgeon so often?  

Shrugs - I guess because he is right some times ,  and wrong some times ?    Each specific person or time may be different reason ?    Yet if anyone quotes him,   I would not beleive it until testing it first,  the motive and the idea,  and only accept it if it is from God,  in line with God's Word,  not contradicting God's Word nor Purpose in any way.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...
On 3/20/2021 at 9:48 AM, Pastor Scott Markle said:

 

So you're argument and defense of your viewpoint is that logic is unscriptural and should be avoided by Christians?

On 3/20/2021 at 12:59 AM, Jim_Alaska said:

1 Corinthians 15:22 (KJV) For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

Doesn't address what I wrote.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
On 3/20/2021 at 10:48 AM, Pastor Scott Markle said:

Interesting defense, but let us consider the facts -- You are presenting human "logic" and human "common sense" as the basis for doctrine without presenting any Scriptural support at all; whereas I simply provided direct quotations from God's OWN Word.  (Note: I did NOT "force" God's Word to say anything; in my original posting above, I simply quoted what it said and emphasized certain relevant phrases.)  Which one is more sure as a foundation for true doctrine?  As for me, that is an easy choice.  Indeed, as for me I will simply accept the very precise wording that God the Holy Spirit inspired in the Holy Scriptures (which really is NOT ambiguous at all):

1.  Sinners (the wicked) ARE estranged from the very time of the womb.
2.  Sinners (the wicked) actively go astray AS SOON AS they be born, specifically speaking lies.
3.  The sinful offense of the one man Adam caused the judgment of God to come upon ALL to their condemnation.  (Note: It is NOT their own sin that brings this judgment to condemnation, but was Adam's first act of sin.)

By the way, concerning Adam and Eve God said -- "For in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."  Yet we recognize according to the Scriptures that they did NOT physically die on that very day.  In fact, they lived out a whole life-span before they physically died.  For this reason, you have presented that the PROCESS of death began on that very day, but NOT the actual moment of death itself.  Indeed, if we consider only the realm of PHYSICAL death, then I would be compelled to agree.  However, there is another realm wherein death occurred - the SPIRITUAL realm.  In fact, in the very day that they sinned, yea in the very moment that they sinned, they IMMEDIATED died spiritually.  Even so, when we are discussing the matter of sin nature and of condemnation by sin, the context is definitely that of the spiritual realm.  Spiritual death began in the human race with Adam's sin, and is passed down through Adam's sin unto ALL of mankind.  All come into this world already "dead in trespasses and sins."  All require a divine Savior to provide them with spiritual life.  Indeed, God the Son, Jesus the Christ, is that Savior, the only Way, the only Truth, and the only LIFE.  NO ONE whatsoever at all can come unto God as Father, but by God the Son, Jesus the Christ.

2 hours ago, Danny Carlton said:

So you're argument and defense of your viewpoint is that logic is unscriptural and should be avoided by Christians?

Wrong.  Take note of that which I have emboldened in my quotation above.  I never indicated that human "logic" is unscriptural or that it should be avoided by Christians.  What I indicated is that human "logic" should not be the BASIS for doctrine, especially when NO Scriptural support whatsoever is presented.  What I further indicated is that my own argument and defense is an appeal to direct quotations of God's OWN Word.  Indeed, I indicated that for me "the very precise wording that God the Holy Spirit inspired in the Holy Scriptures" will always be my foundational basis for true doctrine.

In fact, my entire quotation above follows a "logical" train of thought, but ONLY as it is built upon the FOUNDATION of "the very precise wording that God the Holy Spirit inspired in the Holy Scriptures."  Thus I am NOT opposed to human "logic" within the realm of Bible study, but only when it is maintained in its rightful place - ALWAYS in submission to the absolute authority of the Lord our God and His Holy Word.  On the other hand, when human "logic" is employed as an authority over God's Word or in contradiction to God's Word, I WILL oppose it firmly (and sometimes even fiercely).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
  • Members
On 11/21/2020 at 9:46 AM, Baptistsenior said:

Why do preachers that condemn Calvanism quote Spurgeon so often?  

Because, they can "take the meat and leave the bone!" Just because brethren don't agree on certain points of doctrine like Calvinism and Armenianism doesn't mean that they can't learn from each other. It's a silly thing to fight over a doctrine that neither side can prove 100%, though they can both provide Scriptures to support their positions. It's a fun thing for debate night, but, it's a sad thing when it interferes with relationships between people/friends, and divides us, keeping us from our ultimate mission, preaching the word and making disciples as the Lord commanded us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

  • Recent Achievements

  • Tell a friend

    Love Online Baptist Community? Tell a friend!
  • Members

  • Recent Status Updates

    • Eagle One

      Havent been on for years, but have been studying with Jews for Jesus weekly Bible Study which has been wonderful.  Not sure any of your views on that group, but if you are from a Jewish background a great place to be grounded in the word and to learn.
      · 0 replies
    • Barbara Ann

      I am a researcher and writer at Watch Unto Prayer which I started 25 years ago. On this website there are many well-documented articles and audio programs by myself and other researchers whose ministry is to expose the endtime apostasy of the Church. Now more than ever Christians need information in order to identify and avoid the various deceptions that are in nearly all the churches.
      My husband and I attended the IFB Bible Baptist Church of James Knox a couple of years ago. We left the church after we were informed by the assistant pastor that we were not allowed to express views to other members that do not agree with the views of the pastor and leaders of the church. We were not introducing heresy but expressing our views concerning the State of Israel. We had never been in a church which forbade private conversations on issues where there are diverse opinions. This we recognized as cultlike control of church members. To inform Christians, my husband, who is also a researcher and writer, started a website on the subject: Zionism Exposed: A Watchman Ministry.
      · 0 replies
    • Free Spirit

      Jesus said:"I am the truth, the way, and the life. No man can come to The Father, but by Me."
      · 0 replies
    • Richg  »  BrotherTony

      Brother Tony, I read your reply on Anderson, I know you all think I'm argumentative but, when you don't agree.....the first thought I had is, I wish you would introduce me to the guy that hasn't sinned, maybe David, that had a man killed so he could commit adultery, yet, he was & is a man after Gods own heart, or maybe Paul the guy that persecuted and had Christians killed, or maybe Richg or Kent H, or even you ! I used to listen to personalities also when I was younger but today and for some time, my only concern is, does it line up with scripture & to me its hilarious that you think "I'm in a fix" LOL, I interpreted what we've discussed perfectly, not because I'm smart, but because with an open mind to things of God, its an easy read.
      · 1 reply
    • Richg  »  Jerry

      I thought you wanted me to stop talking to you !
      · 0 replies
  • Topics

×
×
  • Create New...