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Mid Tribulation fleeing of Israel


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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
14 hours ago, robycop3 said:

  So, you simply ignore Zechariah?

No, not at all, I simply point out that you have changed your "point" every time your error has been pointed out and not admitted that you were wrong - you are just moving a bit to try to get out of it.

4 hours ago, Invicta said:

Before 1948 the land was called Palestine.  The British mandate was over the land of Palestine, so Philip Mauro and others were correct in calling it that. I know that Philip was one of the early dispensationalists in New York, but later rejected it as "Dispensational Error."

No one is denying the name itself - the discussion was based around the purpose for the renaming, where Roby said it was because Hadrian wanted to give it to the Palestinians, who at the time of Hadrian were no longer in existence, so his statement was totally impossible.

Your normal link of the name "Palestine" to the people who now claim that name is irrelevant to the discussion and in any case they are not and never were Palestiniains. The majority are in fact of Jordanian heritage, and not Palestinian at all.

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11 hours ago, DaveW said:

No one is denying the name itself - the discussion was based around the purpose for the renaming, where Roby said it was because Hadrian wanted to give it to the Palestinians, who at the time of Hadrian were no longer in existence, so his statement was totally impossible.

Yes I agree with you there.

 

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11 hours ago, DaveW said:

Your normal link of the name "Palestine" to the people who now claim that name is irrelevant to the discussion and in any case they are not and never were Palestiniains. The majority are in fact of Jordanian heritage, and not Palestinian at all.

I didn't intend to link the name to the current people.  Before 1948 the Jews in the country were called Palestinians as they were living in a land called Palestine.  

However I think there is something wrong with your reasoning.  According to your reasoning, you are not Australian because you are (prbably) of European origim, or I am not English as thr original inhabitants were Britons, and so on.   .

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Not at all. The overwhelming majority of these people were moved into the are during the various land grabs since the establishment of the modern nation of Israel.

Prior to the return of Jews to that area around the beginning of the 1900's (yes there were a small number of people including Jews in the region prior to that time) there was hardly anyone in the land and pretty much nobody wanted it as it was mostly barren.

It was the returning Israelites that greened the land, and since they made it green the Arabs in the surrounding areas decided it was worth having. 

So by fact of position they are today Israelie because that is where they live, but today the area is not officially called Palestine. And their heritage is largely Jordanian, Lebanese, etc.

They are Israelie. They pay taxes to the Israelie government. They get financial support from the Israelie government. Their fire service is provided by the Israelie government. Their hospitals are provided for by the Israelie government. Their schools are supported by the Israelie government. They vote in Israelie elections.

They are not Palestinian at all. They are Israelie of various Arab backgrounds. And most have been in the land for no more than two generations. The oldest among them would remember coming into the land since 1948.

The problems stem from one simple fact: the Muslim Arabs as a group want Israel to cease to exist.

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22 hours ago, DaveW said:

Not at all. The overwhelming majority of these people were moved into the are during the various land grabs since the establishment of the modern nation of Israel.

Prior to the return of Jews to that area around the beginning of the 1900's (yes there were a small number of people including Jews in the region prior to that time) there was hardly anyone in the land and pretty much nobody wanted it as it was mostly barren.

It was the returning Israelites that greened the land, and since they made it green the Arabs in the surrounding areas decided it was worth having. 

So by fact of position they are today Israelie because that is where they live, but today the area is not officially called Palestine. And their heritage is largely Jordanian, Lebanese, etc.

They are Israelie. They pay taxes to the Israelie government. They get financial support from the Israelie government. Their fire service is provided by the Israelie government. Their hospitals are provided for by the Israelie government. Their schools are supported by the Israelie government. They vote in Israelie elections.

They are not Palestinian at all. They are Israelie of various Arab backgrounds. And most have been in the land for no more than two generations. The oldest among them would remember coming into the land since 1948.

The problems stem from one simple fact: the Muslim Arabs as a group want Israel to cease to exist.

Thank you I agree with that, but that doesn't address the point that before 1948 the land was called Palestine.  After 1917 when Allenby led his horse into Jerusalem the British ruled Palestine and Jordan, then called Trans Jordan. Before  December 1917  the whole area was ruled by the Turks and the Sultan (aka The Sublime Porte) was also Sultan of Egypt.  

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Yes, but as you point out, it was called transjordan, not actually Palestine.

Palestine was regional name, not a national name.  The region was under control of various Arab nations of the area, but none of them were all that interested because the land was barren and wasted -until the Jewish people started returning and bringing the place  back to life. Now they all want it.

And the people there were called Palestinians, but not the people who currently call themselves Palestinians.

If you check the names in the Palestine Orchestra of the early 1900's for inastance, the names are almost exclusively Jewish. (I can't remember the full name right now).

There were Jews and Arabs and even "Christians" in the area all in small numbers compared to today.

The people currently claiming the name were not there.......

The funniest thing about the whole matter is that of the modern people in the land, the ones with the strongest continuous connection are in fact the Bedouin, but they don't want to claim it. They don't want to claim any national association. They want to be left alone to live as they please.

And of course the Bible says that God gave it to the Israelites as an everlasting covenant.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
2 hours ago, DaveW said:

Palestine was regional name, not a national name. 

Correct. Palestine was just a regional name. The biblical name for the country is 'Israel,' not 'Palestine.' Among other aspects of the 'Palestine' issue, is that the countries that despise Israel, the religious denominations that are against Israel, and the preterists, and many others, are trying to take away the name, the country of Israel and replace it with the name 'Palestine.'

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  We see, in the fulfillment of parts of Isaiah 19 that "the land of Judah" became a terror to the Egyptians.

  Now, since God finished giving His word to man before Hadrian kicked the Jews outta their land, the name "Palestine" doesn't appear in Scripture.

  Did a little digging on the name "Palestine". It comes from the Egyptian "peleset", C. 1150 BC, a name given to the area that included Philistia after those people had migrated from Caphtor. The Arabs called the area "Filastin".

  The Greex began calling the area "Palestaena" & the Romans got "Palestina" from that. This included the Philistines, but not ONLY them. There were Bedouins & other Ishmaelites among them.

  So, I was a little wrong. After the Neo-Assyrian empire conquered the Philistines, they mixed with those other people & lost their national ID, fulfilling the prophecy they'd vanish. But their posterity remains among the peoples of the land who call themselves "Palestinians" today. I believe that's why God mentioned them to Zechariah, their DNA is still present in many of today's Pals, including those who've betrayed their people to the Jews, & who will do so in the future, & will be honored by the Jews as God told Zechariah.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Still rubbish.

Those claiming the name "Palestinian" today are of mixed Arab heritage with no real connection to the land and no known heritage to the people called Philistines.

The overwhelming majority of them are of Jordanian heritage and Syrian heritage.

There is no known link today of anyone to the Philistines of the Bible, and until the Jews returning from the late 1800's through to the establishment of the modern nation of Israel no one wanted the land nor claimed the land except the Jews. 

The only link in any way is the name of the REGION not through any people now existing.

As I already mentioned, the Bedouin are in fact the current people that have the most continuous link and they do not claim philistine heritage and they do not claim the land for themselves. The land was given to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob in the Bible of course.

No matter what sort of false facts you want to make up, you cannot link the land to any group now calling themselves "Palestinian", and you cannot make a solid link to of any people today with the Philistines.

And I will point out to you that the Philistines are not even of Arab heritage, but were a sea ranging people until the hit the shores of Israel. No one really even knows their full heritage before that, but they are not as far as anyone knows any relation to Abraham and his children.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist
15 hours ago, robycop3 said:

outta

Neat'o!

15 hours ago, robycop3 said:

Greex

Double neat'o!

15 hours ago, robycop3 said:

their DNA is still present in many of today's Pals

...and you've performed the DNA tests yourself to prove this statement?

15 hours ago, robycop3 said:

Pals,

...super-duper neat'o superifico!

15 hours ago, robycop3 said:

So, I was a little wrong

mmm-hmmm.

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  • Independent Fundamental Baptist

Revelation 12:6

6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

 

Israel will flee at the middle of the tribulation.

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On 4/17/2019 at 9:10 AM, No Nicolaitans said:

Neat'o!

Double neat'o!

...and you've performed the DNA tests yourself to prove this statement?

...super-duper neat'o superifico!

mmm-hmmm.

Neato is a robot vacuum cleaner, I ordered one today from Amazon.

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